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A similar thing happened with our band last year. We needed a dep drummer for a pub gig and our guitarist put ad on Facebook offering £80. We got loads of flak along the lines of how we were devaluing live music, stealing money from professional musicians, no decent musician in their right mind would take this gig etc. etc. , it went on for days. In the meantime we were contacted by several drummers who were willing to do the gig and we ended up with a pro drummer who was honestly the best drummer I have ever played with but was happy to do the gig for £80 rather than just sit at home complaining on Facebook. A couple months later we offered him a wedding gig for three times the money. There seem to be loads of 'professional' musicians on Facebook who don't seem to realise that pub gigs and functions are separate markets. If you are a pro musician who thinks that pub money is a threat to your livelihood you are in the wrong job IMO.

I found this bass almost 40 years ago and it has been my number 1 bass ever since. I don't gig it too much now, but I do occasionally (always for recording). It is light, resonant, the neck is beautifully worn and smooth and it sounds absolutely right for everything I play (or want to). It isn't everyone's cup of tea, but it's been perfect for me since the day I first picked it up.

I've got 60 gigs in the 2022 diary just now, running in an arc around NW London from Ware to Woking. Average fee across those 60 gigs is £300 a pop. Slightly more pubs than clubs, no posh functions. As to pub-rock wannabees pontificating on the ENORMOUS fees they get paid, there's no shortage of bloke-in-a-pub guys prepared to bore the pants off you with complete cow poop. When you try to find their high-paying gigs on social media it usually turns out that they haven't played a live gig in years. Ignore and move on.

Congratulations 👏 nice bass. Saw that one for sale, was tempted to buy that to go with my Avon Grabber,I bought recently.

Aaaand skip to the end. I'm very much a wood guy. I love woodwork and things made out of wood, so I don't really go for solid paint finishes. But this time, considering the grotesque Frankenstein-nature of the instrument at this point, and just to learn one more process, I decided to go for a spray finish. So, lots of sanding and priming (I'm never doing a paint job ever again) and then a couple of coats of Raspberry pink. Installed the electronics (the original P pickup and a second-hand J pickup I got for a tenner), slapped some strings on it, tuned it up and ....I said tuned it up...... ok... You may have seen these "overlord of music" bridges on ebay and aliexpress and whatnot for suspiciously low prices. Well now I know why. It's horrendous. It just about works, but by time I got up to around D on the supposed-E string, it became too hard for the coarse screw thread to overcome the tension. So I decided to tune the whole thing two steps down. In the end, I am SO glad I decided to try these ideas out here before trying it on a scratch build with nice wood. I learned a lot. The design I have is for a piezo bridge so there won't be any visible pickups, a bit like a Rob Allen mouse for example. I am also completely shocked that it sounds (imo) as good as it does. It really has a tone that I love AND the drop-tuning on a 30" scale bass is so much fun that I think I'll do the same with my scratch build project (also 30 scale) There are many things here that could be improved but the biggest negative that I didn't see coming - the headstock is so light, and the bridge so heavy that, sitting on my lap, if I'm not careful, the whole bass wants to swing up and crack me on the head. Something to think about there for future reference.

You would expect a 'function' gig to pay a lot more than a standard pub gig. You would also expect it to be more work and there to be different expectations.

Finally! A board worthy of my Behringer collection. The CS100 is a place holder for a pedal out on loan right now. I didn't want the plastic Behringer board,vso snapped this up the moment I saw it.

What? And spoil all our pun fun?

Very kind of you to say. When you see stuff conversations like this on facebook, it always makes my heart sink. Function band - Tend to carry around larger PA and light systems. - As you are reach the more pro end, you factor in your own sound and lighting engineers (or hire them in). - You may carry around two desks (one foh, one monitoring) - You may carry around more pro wireless than your average band. Systems that tend to be 1k+ a unit. And that's for both mic and IEM units. Buying or hiring those doesn't come cheap. And then there's the shared mic license on top. - Set up time can be astronomical and may involve many early starts and soundchecks Promotional material - Pro videos cost pro money, videographers, editing, colourists - Pro audio cost pro audio in the studio... with the cost of engineers, mastering etc Clothes - Depending upon the band, there is a look that has to be adhered to. If you are doing an Abba band, you aren't going to get far without the outfits. I remember playing with an Elvis tribute. His clothes used to cost north of 2.5k an outfit. Function bands with everybody wearing matching suits... well, sometimes they have to be made because not everybody can fit in off the shelf for certain outfits... and a lot of time, the sort of things you see the top function bands wearing, aren't the sort of things you can just go into a shop and buy (they tend to be a bit ott spangly suits etc) Additional costs - Accountancy, Insurance, vans (either bought or hired), rehearsals, storage costs, travels costs tend to be higher. Factor in food and accommodation for band. Also, people don't seem to realise that you can spend hours speaking to client in order to land the deal... and then hours to finalise all the details of the event (which experience will tell me are mostly wishful thinking as events never run to plan) All these costs are passed onto the client or part absorbed (for example, you may lower costs if there is a particular reason that it would be beneficial to take the gig). Function bands turn to be run as a means to earn a wage in a professional capacity. Therefore the attitude should match. Loading in, your appearance, you language, attitude etc... is always part of how you are representing yourself. You have to have a plan for everything... what happens if the van breaks down. What happens if covid hits you. The contract has to be fulfilled. Pub band - Low risk. Low financial input. If I've got a date free and somebody was to ask would I like a gig playing a load of songs that are already in my repertoire for 50 quid and it's local, I'd probably consider it. All I have to do it turn up... maybe get introduced to some new players and build upon a network that could land me new work... well, there's worse things you could do to earn 50 quid. I am sure there are loads of people that argue they put a lot of money into their pub appearances, rehearsals etc... but the key thing is, there's a load of people that don't. The fee doesn't tend to change whatever the pub band is turning up with. Lots of players with a large repertoire can just sit in on a gig and busk it... and busk it a lot better than a lot of rehearsed bands. Even if a pub band has arrangements, give me a copy of the audio to listen to or the dots, I'll play it. These folks complaining about fifty quids should spend their time working on getting better paying gigs than worrying about who's taking fifty quid gigs. On facebook, if the gig isn't for you, move on. Nobody taking a pub gig is "crippling" the industry. A pub is a pub. Pubs are never going to be able to pay function prices - nor should they - because the difference between the two is astronomical. And if you look at the differences between a pub band and a function... it's quite clear to see why function bands are the price they are (having said that, there are some function bands that are just taking the p1ss.)

Reminds me of the old Washburn Stage B-20 bass..... https://www.vintageandrare.com/product/Washburn-Stage-Series-B-20-Bass-1982-Amber-Burst-56700

If doing larger venues and wanting thump in the back on the bigger stages I wouldn’t think that two 2x8 cabs would be the solution. I think as above, another Epifani 210 would be where I’d start.

There's a Coverband Facebook page over here in Essex where this seems to happen all the time, loads of people going on about how playing pubs for £250 undervalues them and 'How are we supposed to make a living?" type comments - I just think that if you are relying on pub gigs to make a living then, you probably aren't in the right job - or you aren't good enough/dedicated/appropriate to land the higher paying function work. We play local pubs mostly and get £250-£300 between four of us. Coming out of Covid we took the decision as a band to quietly offer our existing landlords a lower fee for any gig before the end of 2021, we called it Covid Relief - we actually said we'd do gigs them for £120. (Would have been lynched on Facebook 😜) - but when those landlords asked us at the end of the night what the fee was - we said "Well usually £250/£300, but as you know we are offering you a cheapy at £120 to help out." Every single one of them nodded, went off and came back with the full normal fee - one even paid us more...

This is it. You can over charge and people think, I aint paying that. You have to realise the venue is a business and has to make money too. Thats why we had an unwritten rule to charge the same. No one would get ripped off and the bars couldn't hold anyone to ransom.

My latest Bass Gear Magazine video review has just gone live!! Check out this beautiful Spector #Euro4LT #Bass ! Special thanks to Spector UK, Barnes & Mullins Ltd for letting us loose on this one - it inspired me to write this little tune, “The Spectator”. Hope you like it as much as I loved having the bass over. https://www.bassgearmag.com/bassic-review-spector-euro4-lt-bass/

Hello Basschat, it's been a while. I used to hang around here a lot, but I've been missing it lately, so I started looking through my favourite section; the Build Diaries. This is on a much more amateur level than most of the projects here, but it has a certain novelty factor that might make it a bit interesting. Pics 1 and 2: About a hundred years ago, I bought a no-particular-brand short scale bass that had a nice neck. I binned the rest. You can see how wonky the pickup covers were It's not that I didn't notice at the time, it's just that had no illusions of perfection. I was completely new to this thing, even woodwork in general was a new hobby to me at the time, so my tools and general knowledge were poor. Pic 3: Fast forward a bit and I decided to replace the top wood (with some cheap plywood) and the pickup covers and knobs but, more importantly, the fretboard. Which meant doing a fret job from scratch. Also a homemade brass nut.

It's all about perspective isn't it? Chris Square is a legend if you look at bass from the right angle.

First there was the proper enforcement of drink/drive laws, then there was the banning of smoking. Both measures are entirely to be applauded and supported, but there's no ducking that they came damned near to killing off live music in pubs. We've all fought back, of course, and live music is still out there, but it's way harder to get an audience to hit the bar at 8pm, drink & smoke steadily until chucking-out time, before stumbling into their Allegros and Cortinas ... it's only a short drive, I'll be fine, hic!

After some years of exploring Basschats Basses for Sale Mr Steinberger released the Radius, bought the WAV version, loved it, sold all my other basses and bought a CR... I upgraded the WAV to fretless and other stuff to bring it closer to the CR. Still have a hankering to try Status and ACG though...

I was talking to my drummer mate and he said that the female singer in his pub band had left after kicking up a fuss about the fact that they were getting between £250 - £300 a gig in the Glasgow area. She left shortly after and they replaced her with a better male singer. She is now sitting in the house twidiling her thumbs. The last pub gig I did was 3 years ago and the money varied from £170 to £300. The way things are with so many pubs closing or not bothering to do live music now, I would be happy to get £250 between us or £50 each to have a blast on a Saturday night.

Same as my old one - wonder if it is my old one? Another great, near replica-level bass, always though with a swapped trc, neckplate & a Gibbo sticker, you almost could get away with passing it off as original. Of course if you have the Ripper, Grabber and L6S copies, you have to have an Avon Marauder to finish the set: Only one I haven't had is the Ripper.

I like the reverse headstock, but would like a wee redesign to keep the strings straight all the way to the tuners.

That is pretty much the same flak this guy was getting. Stuff like “my function band doesn’t go out for less than £2k” yet when you point out that you’re probably not the market he’s aiming at then, you get a torrent of abuse! How some people don’t see the distinction between a pub covers band and a quality function band is beyond me. I remember seeing a promo vid of @EBS_freak band, it was a while ago now, but the professionalism and musical ability was outstanding. The guy asking if any local guitarist fancies earning £50, is clearly aiming at a different audience. At least you’d think it would be obvious

Yeah, should be a graphic designer….

That's completely different. I've needed a plumber a few times over the years, can't recall ever needing a pub band.

Lol yep I have tons of those, but you know, not very neat - and some have unnecessarily high power consumption. Companies like EWS do some very clever design that maximises the use of a battery, which speaks to my type of thinking. Darkglass don't use batteries for 'environmental reasons' but I don;t use dark glass so they can do one

It doesn't matter how good you think your band are, there are only so many people in the pub catchment area who will turn up and drink beer. If you are getting people from other towns coming to see you, it is likely that they will be driving and therefore (hopefully) not drinking! That's no good to a landlord when he's not charging admission and relying on beer sales.

Bin there, dun that. Bandmates can say the strangest things ...

In a previous band, about 10 years ago we would get £250 - £300. One band member was always saying we were worth more, at least £400/£450, so we said fine, get us a gig paying that. Still waiting.

Sounds like the guy posting the ad is getting a load of flack from what is likely to be a bunch of keyboard warriors who likely don't gig in a covers band with any great frequency! I've played the pub scene (originals and covers) for over 40 years and pub covers bands around here get £200 - £300(ish). The lower end of that is generally at the kind of venues where they don't give a t*ss about the bands or the quality of the musicianship. The top end is negotiable depending on your following / popularity. I've done a fair few deps in my time and I'm at a point now where I'll politely decline gigs that I get offered where there are 5 in the band and they are getting £200-£250. My regular gig is a 3 piece band and we do gigs where we will get £250 minimum and we aim for £300... bearing in mind that bands I was in 25 years ago were doing gigs for £250.

Where I come from the local bands all had a kind of unwritten rule that we would all charge the same. Made for no one getting ripped off if we all stuck to our guns on price. All was well until a new band started undercutting everyone. There are always mercenary bands out there who will sell their souls for gigs.

I do understand that. I think, from reading the guys posts, he’s assuming most guitarists that play in the local cover bands will know 90% of the songs on the set list anyway. He seems pretty humble about it, kind of “look, I know the moneys not great, but it’s a £250 gig and our guitarist can’t make it, does anyone fancy it?” Some of the replies he’s had have been so rude.

This guy will be joining me in my coffin when I die... Having owned hundreds of basses from almost all of the 'boutique' brands, there's a reason why I have 6 ACGs. In the illustrious words of Tony the Tiger, they're grrrrrrrrrrrreat!

Now, to the cavity. This took A LOT of sketching but it worked out eventually. The existing cavity wasn't useful so I decided to fill it, BUT, I couldn't be bothered trying to cut a block of wood of that size into exactly that shape.... so I decided to cut off the existing outer wall of the cavity. and fill it with a bunch of small bits. This is just silly. With the wall removed, I had more suitable pieces but at this point I found it funny that this body was more glue than wood, so I just went for it. Now I'm sorry I don't have more instructive photos here, but it's not so complicated. The new cavity (and cavity cover) is made in the typical way except that there is an additional partial cavity on the side. This provides a recess for pots to leave the cavity through the side but without the control knobs disrupting the silhouette of the bass when seen from the front. So this goes Volume - Tone - 3 way switch and then the jack in at the bottom. Incidentally, I went back and forth on this and now, after playing this for a few months, I've decided I'm not putting a volume knob on any more instruments I make. I just never touch them.

Now let's fast forward to some point last year (...I think. Time has lost all meaning lately) and I got thinking about a scratch build, but I decided to do a little practice run on some ideas I'd had and where better to practice these ideas than on my ludicrous little ship of Theseus bass. The general concept is one of visual minimalism: I don't like the silhouette of tuning keys on a headstock, but I also don't like the look of a headless bass. I also want to hide the tone controls. And all of this on a budget of loose change found behind the sofa. So, after some sketching and pondering, I got to work. I wish I'd taken more photos along the way but I think I've got all the salient points, and you'll be glad of a shorter slideshow. First, pickups removed and cavities filled with some random blocks of wood (more on this in a bit) Step 2; the headstock. I went through so many possibilities for how to clamp the string ends. Wondering if I would somehow use the little string clamp that came with the headless bridge I'd bought... In the end, I settled on drilling some tunnels through the headstock so the clamps would be on the back and then inserting the brass pins from electrical plugs. This gave me a ready-made, freely available solution to a complicated problem. A brass block with a hole for the string to pass through and a grub screw to lock it in place. Perfect. 👌 In case you're wondering, I finished this project about 9 months ago and the strings have kept their tuning perfectly. The plug grips haven't let the strings budge one tiny bit. I don't have an additional photo from this stage but I later added a sort of frame around the plug ends so they wouldn't snag or scrape anything accidentally (you'll see it on the finished bass)

So, just to summarise: we want more knobs on our pedals, but we hate more knobs on our pedals. We like multi FX units, but also hate multi FX units. welcome to Basschat!! 😆

oh wow! Thanks for the tip-off @Daz39. @Andyjr1515 & @TheGreek - that looks gorgeous. It's so difficult to make something that looks so simple. I'm digging through the forum to find a build thread for this 😄 Thanks Andy!

Still has serial/model number on it.

As an addition to what programming actually means, the way you generally use it is like this. Fiddle with the knobs, when you like the sound you get, press menu and exit at the same time. It then asks you what patch number you want to write it to (I can't remember how many there are but certainly at least 128) then you turn the knob next to the display to get to the number you want, then press the knob in and it writes it (or exit and it doesn't). If you press menu you can change the display type or name the patches. Once you have a patch you can obviously just change the knobs to change the sound and it shows you on the display that you are not currently aligned with that patch any more. Pressing the right button cycles through the patches, pressing the left turns the effect on and off. Holding the button locks the sound like the SY1 main button. Its a bit wider than the SY1, but the sockets are at the top, so it doesn't take more sideways space. Its a bit cramped at the top though. Strangely it takes 2 AA batteries, but still a 9v adapter as usual.

I'd forgotten just how f**king good The Selecter were/are!!

This and many other tracks indicate otherwise. 🙂

Suppose I shouldn't ever mention on Facebook that the only times I've ever depped (3 in total) it's always been for £0. Can't recall even being bought a pint, actually. Still, I enjoyed it and it helped out some friends, and that's why I did it.

Appears you've been lucky then. In my neck of the woods a discussion on set list is fairly common. There's a reason for going niche - I've never been so busy......

At the time pretty much all of the bands were quite good. There was no 5h1t bands certainly. Every band had a healthy calendar and got plenty of gigs. We just thought it was the decent thing to do to charge a going rate.

^^^ On the multi-fx thing, I always see the rational and convenient side of them and buy them but after a couple of months they just don't float my boat. Having now owned the Zoom CDR 70, MS 60 B, B1- Four, and Helix Effects, Stomp, Stomp XL I've hopefully learned my lesson now (probably not though). So I guess multi-fx pedals annoy me in a lot of ways, usually the interface and the programming which loses sponteneity and creativity for me. Individual pedals are certainly less convenient and cost effective and are not really the rational choice but I don't make music as a rational choice. It's down to what inspires you and what's fun to muck about with, I'm sure for some people that's multi-fx, not for me though. I'll use a Laptop DAW if I want to sit at home and get into the fine-technical tuning of reverse echo's and the like and it'll do it better and more conveniently than any multi-fx (which often end up being hooked up to a Laptop anyway), and if I'm playing in a band situation then I've yet to need sounds that can't be achieved by a few basic pedals where it's useful for them to have visible controls and individual footswitches.

The above is based on the 'Nordic Mandola'. Here's one with pin-point capos(!!). And believe me, there is a market for these instruments.

I also play Celtic bouzouki and a few folk-instrument makers do make those extended range instruments.

Looks like his technique has worked for him, being the multi millionaire bass player that he is. Probably not a good role model for others, but who knows. The rights and wrongs of a technique are debatable if the player is very successful.