band members are plotting to remove one of us... suggestions sought

[Uncle Rodney]

It's something we encounter in bands, however as I've grown older and been on both sides of this situation, I maintain, "be nice". Here's the current situation, I will use alias' so not to reveal anything personal.

 

Band member A thinks band member B isn't good enough, insisting B has to go. Interestingly A has "found" a replacement in C showing us videos of their performance selling C to us. The current band plan is to auditon C without telling B about it.

 

This leaves me feeling bad because B now becomes treated differently in online chats, as if he has an infectious disease. The band plans to try out C in the new year, so that's 6 weeks B is frozen out.

 

I've already said - so we get C onboard, a few weeks later he announces his "other band is getting busy so needs to leave" - Obviously B has now gone with no replacement. The band stalls. C will leave if he thinks the band isn't good enough anyway.

 

Personally I don't think A is that good. I had a quiet moment with B before this situation arose and B has said A isn't that good.

 

Any ideas? I need to be nice to everyone, bands should be enjoyable, it's the bitching that makes it all sour. I suspect B has "a lot on his plate" and doesn't need anymore 💩- so I'm wondering if to phone him for a quiet update, he could then tell the band "sorry guys, I have a lot of 💩on my plate and need to drop out" it's better the exit is done by B rather than be "fired".

Edited 6 hours ago by Uncle Rodney

[Hellzero]

Why don't you fire the trouble maker instead, so A, as he isn't as good as he thinks he is, which is way too frequent...

[martthebass]

With friends like this who needs enemies mate.  Personally I'd call it a day as these situations have a tendency to implode or at a minimum leave a sour taste in the mouth going forward.  

[Steve Browning]

Indeed. It could be your turn next. 

 

I would guess that most of us have experienced both sides of this particular coin. If A isn't that good then the band is unlikely to improve overall. 

 

I'd consider your own situation carefully. 

[fretmeister]

Options:

 

1: Fire A for the same reasons he has about other people. Replace him.

 

2: Leave the toxic environment completely, but throw that grenade on the way out - "I am leaving the band. I cannot believe A is secretly plotting to bin B and even set up an audition for C. That's is appalling. A band should be like a marriage - if it's not working you end it. Not try out a side piece first"

 

3: Seduce A's partner. (Seems to be a rule).

[Boodang]

If the band has stalled, start a new band with 'B'? 

[Lozz196]

It all sounds much like our current and previous governments.........

[Happy Jack]

Never been in this precise situation but I've been close enough (several times) that you could see it from here.

 

In all of my experience, removal/replacement of any band member is only acceptable is everyone is on board right from the start.

 

If everyone in your anonymous band agrees that 'B' has to go, then he has to go. If it's just 'A' who's pushing for it, then all the non-B members need to go to the pub and have a chat with Frank and Ernest.

[cetera]

Been there. Trust noone....

Do what's right for you, because you can be sure that the rest of them won't care if it were you who was up for the chop.

[SumOne]

Someone who plays what is right for the band as a team-player (i.e. perhaps some 'easy' subtle rhythm chords are better than a 'difficult' ear-splitting guitar solo), plays within their limits, spends the time learning the songs and being at rehearsals and is reliable for gigs (and helpful for setup etc) and is a decent person to be around are what are probably more important than technical ability.   

 

....at least that is the case for the weekend warrior type stuff I do. I've been in bands that have been tempted by a technically better guitarist, but it turns out that their big guitar solos aren't really enjoyed by many and often don't serve the song as well as something more low-key, and things like them not haivng a car and always needing lifts is a bit of a faff, and that they only turn up to occasional rehearsals is not great for the band as a whole. In the end we'd be better of with the less technically gifted player.

 

 

 

 

[chris_b]

Never mind the politics. Is the band any good? Are you working? Are the gigs good? Is C a better player than B? Are the rest of the band good players?

 

Keep B or C (whoever is the better player), replace A (he's a troublemaker), end up with a better band and go from strength to strength.

[BlueMoon]

1 hour ago, cetera said:

Do what's right for you, because you can be sure that the rest of them won't care if it were you who was up for the chop.

Wise advice. I’ve been in a similar situation, played nice, and it has not always been reciprocated. As I gained more experience (and got older) my “being nice” hat is based on “if it suits my interests”. Sounds nasty but sometimes it’s a jungle out there.

[fretmeister]

It does sound a lot like A and C have intentions to control the entire thing together. If C is already in a band that is working why would he want 2 jobs that will clash.

The more I read it, the more I think that A&C won't be waiting long before binning the OP as well and replacing with another pre-arranged mate.

 

This sort of shite is why I'm not in a band at the moment. 

[Dan Dare]

Sounds as if a full and frank discussion between all parties, rather than one to one chats between A & C, A & B, B & C, etc, is needed. Get everything out in the open with everyone present (not online, but physically present, where nobody can hide). If it crashes and burns, so be it. Doesn't sound a particularly healthy situation at the moment, so no great loss.

[Phil Starr]

I hate all this, the only bands that really work and have longevity are those that avoid all this. 

 

So as written is C the replacement for B and friend of A? If I'm reading this right then there must be a D and maybe an E???

 

My experience is that if C is a friend of A (and that may be the qualification that makes him 'better') then the two of them might potentially gang up on you andl become the united powerhouse of the band. You will then be the semi-detached bass player when decisions are made. We all have videos of ourselves playing at our best and in practice he/she/they might not be so proficient as the video shows. 

 

Ask yourself what you genuinely think of B's playing. Were you concerned before this all came up? If not then this is a stitch up, probably.

 

Then there is the human and moral side of this. This is really awful treatment of B and you are clearly uncomfortable with it all. If B is genuinely holding you all back you need to be honest with them and give them the chance to fix any issues. Even if they are awful and you are confident that they will never be good enough then there are ways of dealing with this that are open and honest. It's never easy to say these things but it can be done kindly and decently even if it is tough at the time. I sense that you think this is a really S****y way of dealing with things.

 

If there are a D and E then talk to them, see how they feel. If there are only you three then I'm afraid you have to choose between them. I know from past experience I'll go against the one making me choose. 

 

You need to tell A that you aren't happy. If you ant to stick with your current line up then say so. If you aren't happy with B then agree how you are going to deal with that without stabbing him in the back. I'd be saying that if you collectively want a replacement then you should audition several musicians and choose the best, not just hand it to a friend. Balance that against ending the band. I've  been kicked out of bands for insisting we should all behave professionally. based on your post alone however A is a bully.

[Jean-Luc Pickguard]

I'd get all the band members together in a room and bang their heads together.

[thumperbob 2002]

No one as bitchy as a weekend warrior, who thinks they should be pro. 

[Beedster]

f*** me that's grim  

[Grooverjr]

Not good. Unless A is your close mate or you genuinely love being in the band and see it as having a real future (neither of which comes through in your post, but that's just my reading of it) then walk away, Renee. If A thinks B is ropey and vice versa then it is probably not just the skill level at play on any case.

[Uncle Rodney]

1 hour ago, Phil Starr said:

..snip.. snip..

 

1. ..is C the replacement for B and friend of A? ..snip.. snip..

 

.. snip.. snip..

 

2. ..you genuinely think of B's playing. Were you concerned before this all came up? ..snip.. snip..

 

3. Then there is the human and moral side of this. This is really awful treatment of B and you are clearly uncomfortable with it all.

 

4. If B is genuinely holding you all back you need to be honest with them and give them the chance to fix any issues. ...... I sense that you think this is a really S****y way of dealing with things.

 

5. If there are a D and E then talk to them, see how they feel. .. snip.. snip..

 

6. ..snip.. snip..Balance that against ending the band. I've  been kicked out of bands for insisting we should all behave professionally. based on your post alone however A is a bully.

Hope you don't mind me editing your comment, it hit me solid in the face.

 

1. That's a good question I didn't and should have asked when the band discussed this at the rehearsal. Also I should have asked how many other bands the replacement guy (C) currently in.

 

2. In truth I wasn't really paying attention, more of a general listen to my cues etc. I was thinking perhaps B wasn't "leaning into it" as much as I would have thought. I happen to get into a convo about some other band related subject with B and I thought to raise the question, is there a problem.

 

3. 100% - you have me 100% I told the guys this is a bad thing to do, and repeated it many times. Call me a softy but I find it upsetting. I think the deep emotion is rooted in many years of scrapping.

 

4. When asked for my view about B, I gave a full speech, we should quietly speak with B, find out if there's any problems we could fix. I think this view comes with age, after being in a lot of scraps, when I've seen skilled negotiators at work, I'm very impressed at how they get a good solution and no one gets hurt.

 

5. Yes there are other band members, I think though as A's presentation was strong, the other guys just went along with it. It was mentioned if to move A into a different position in the band, but as we're not mainstream, finding another person will be nigh on impossible.

 

6. Yes I have advocated a "professional" approach. However that notion usually falls on inexperienced ears. Usually it's that ransom demand, "either he goes or I go". 

 

I have thought if to jump ship as overall the band is quite weak, nice enough guys but not really "doing the business".

 

All the comments are good, making me think

Edited 2 hours ago by Uncle Rodney

[TimR]

What is B doing wrong that is preventing you from progressing? 

 

Where do you hope to progress to and when? Is everyone else 100% on board and capable of committing to playing at that new level? 

 

The best musician is the one that can make the gigs. 

Edited 1 hour ago by TimR

[Phil Starr]

I really feel for you. You are at least behaving decently. I really hope it works out for you

[bassbiscuits]

My two pennies worth? I don’t think situations like this ever end well. Doesn’t sound like the kind of relationships you need to sustain a solid, working band. 
 

If A isn’t much good anyway, then it’s probably less about B’s ability and more of a power thing against B. Again a fairly rubbish way to behave to anyone you’ve got a meaningful friendship or working relationship with. 
 

If there are other members of the band you like working with I’d be tempted to have a word with them about you leaving and taking them with you. 
 

Unless this is some very successful money spinner of a band where putting up with a temperamental band member is the price to pay for the financial security etc, then I don’t think I could be bothered to unpick it. I’d be looking for something else. 

[christhammer666]

id rather have B who is possibly loyal and solid albeit sometimes may not be a virtuoso rather then A who is a troublemaker

[Crusoe]

I could have sworn that I watched this series on Netflix.