G&L in trouble...?

[wateroftyne]

I'm seeing a few rumours on the internet - only rumours, mind - that G&L are in trouble.

See this post from one of their master builders.

If it's true, I hope they get through it...

 

[gjones]

That's sad to hear. I notice that GuitarGuitar have started selling them again.

I'm a big fan of G&L, I bought a used L2000 Tribute off Reverb yesterday.

[dmckee]

I hope not! (And I’ve just ordered some pickups ☹️)

[Beedster]

Yamaha’s next buy?

[LeftyJ]

Apparently this has happened several times before and they got through it in the end. I hope they'll live through this too! Would hate to see them go.

 

They're owned by BBE, who don't exactly appear to be very relevant anymore as a company. Their Sonic Maximizer pedals, rack units and plugins were succesful for a while and they made some cool preamps in the past, but when you visit their site now it still says "2016" at the bottom and the button that should lead to their Products page is very much dead. Not a good sign. Their website for their plugins is more up-to-date though (2025).

[BlueMoon]

I hope not. By and large they make great basses, but their distribution has been patchy in Europe.

[Cato]

Their UK suppliers never seem to last long, every now and then someone like Andertons will get a few bits and pieces in but when those are gone that seems to be it.

 

I was very interested in trying an ASAT bass a few years ago and couldn't find one, new or used, being advertised anywhere in the UK.

 

I always assumed the US made stuff was fairy low production numbers so most of it stays in the States.

 

It'll be a shame if they do go, a lot of their stuff, both bass and skinny strings, guitars are an interesting twist on Leo's original designs. I'd be sorry to see some of those designs go.

 

 

[Sean]

Sad news indeed. There’s something about G&L that just doesn’t fly with the market and it’s been that way for years. Prices of used USA basses are proportionately low compared to US Fender or US MM equivalents. Some of the US L2000 instruments that you see for sale used go for Japanese Fender prices and the Tribute line used prices are rock bottom (I’ve sold a couple in the last 2 years). I had a few of each and the quality/sound/playability is as good as anything comparable but they have remained very niche.

 

A few times over the years I’ve had compliments on my G&L basses especially a US trans-orange L2500 I had but people said that they couldn’t get past that headstock. One person said that the G&L headstock makes it look like it’s aimed at the country music sector. I couldn’t disagree.

 

G&L has lacked faces too, in a recent Andertons video on why Andertons is still in business, Lee Anderton says that they keep good stocks of and sell lots of instruments that customers’ favourite guitarists/bassists are playing. G&L just isn’t on the radar of many buyers in the way that Fender and MM are. There isn’t a high profile artist roster and there’s not a history of legendary stars out there playing them in the same way you see Fender and Gibson etc.

 

G&L marketing focuses on the Leo Fender legacy and “the best instruments Leo made”. All commendable and worthy but I don’t think that figures in the buying decision of many people. The landing page of the website says “Made in Fullerton since 1980” - who cares about this except for me and few other crusties? It presumes that you know the history of Fender and significance of it, whereas most Fender owners have no idea where Fullerton is nevermind that it was where so many great Fender instruments were made. The product info is all “features”, like Saddle Lock Bridge and Dual Fulcrum Vibrato; that’s like a car manufacturer putting Fuel Injection, 16v or ABS on its products, it’s old hat, we expect all this and a lot more these days. On the homepage there’s a bloke in a G&L top and jeans sitting down playing a natural JB. Then there’s pictures of Leo and other G&L blokes in plaid shirts in the workshop, one is even holding up a competitor's guitar (it’s a Fender). That’s the shop window of G&L today. None of that helps get these amazing instruments into the hands of potential buyers. 

 

I’ve dealt with G&L customer service a couple of times in the past and it’s so far above and beyond expectation, it’s like dealing with a boutique builder that focuses on your need, they’re fantastic. I’ve had a pickup sent out FoC from California and another time they shipped me a tuner to replace one that was bit stiff. 

 

I really hope G&L comes through this in whatever way, the products are fantastic but they need a serious business rethink to get them out there selling decent numbers. Spector went through a rough patch in 2007-09 with distribution, image etc. Prices were disproportionately low but now it’s bounced back. Fender went through a rough patch in the 80s until the management buy-out. 

 

If someone like Marcus MIller can drive a new brand (Sire) to the point where it’s becoming a benchmark within its market position then surely someone can inject enough magic into G&L to make it a brand that is on a lot of people’s shortlists. 

Edited 21 hours ago by Sean

[Beedster]

12 minutes ago, Sean said:

said that they couldn’t get past that headstock

 

Sad but true 

[Beedster]

13 minutes ago, Sean said:

Sad news indeed. There’s something about G&L that just doesn’t fly with the market and it’s been that way for years. Prices of used USA basses are proportionately low compared to US Fender or US MM equivalents. Some of the US L2000 instruments that you see for sale used go for Japanese Fender prices and the Tribute line used prices are rock bottom (I’ve sold a couple in the last 2 years). I had a few of each and the quality/sound/playability is as good as anything comparable but they have remained very niche.

 

A few times over the years I’ve had compliments on my G&L basses especially a US trans-orange L2500 I had but people said that they couldn’t get past that headstock. One person said that the G&L headstock makes it look like it’s aimed at the country music sector. I couldn’t disagree.

 

G&L has lacked faces too, in a recent Andertons video on why Andertons is still in business, Lee Anderton says that they keep good stocks of and sell lots of instruments that customers’ favourite guitarists/bassists are playing. G&L just isn’t on the radar of many buyers in the way that Fender and MM are. There isn’t a high profile artist roster and there’s not a history of legendary stars out there playing them in the same way you see Fender and Gibson etc.

 

G&L marketing focuses on the Leo Fender legacy and “the best instruments Leo made”. All commendable and worthy but I don’t think that figures in the buying decision of many people. The landing page of the website says “Made in Fullerton since 1980” - who cares about this except for me and few other crusties? It presumes that you know the history of Fender and significance of it, whereas most Fender owners have no idea where Fullerton is nevermind that it was where so many great Fender instruments were made. The product info is all “features” like Saddle Lock Bridge and Dual Fulcrum Vibrato; that’s like a car manufacturer putting “Fuel Injection”, “16v” or “ABS” on their products, it’s old hat, we expect all this and a lot more these days. There’s a bloke in a G&L top and jeans sitting down playing a natural JB. Then there’s pictures of Leo and other G&L blokes in plaid shirts in the workshop, one is even holding up a competitors guitar (it’s a Fender). That’s the shop window of G&L today. None of that helps get these amazing instruments into the hands of potential buyers. 

 

I’ve dealt with G&L customer service a coupel of times in the past and it’s so far above and beyond expectation, it’s like dealing with a boutique builder that focuses on your need, they’re fantastic. I’ve had a pickup sent out FoC from California and another time they shipped me a tuner to replace one that was bit stiff. 

 

I really hope G&L comes through this in whatever way, the products are fantastic but they need a serious business rethink to get them out there selling decent numbers. Spector went through a rough patch in 2007-09 with distribution, image etc. Prices were disproportionately low but now it’s bounced back. Fender went through a rough patch in the 80s until the management buy-out. 

 

Despite what we may think, we rarely buy the best tool for the job, which is why Fender are where they are and G&L are where they are  

[LeftyJ]

1 hour ago, Sean said:

G&L marketing focuses on the Leo Fender legacy and “the best instruments Leo made”. All commendable and worthy but I don’t think that figures in the buying decision of many people. The landing page of the website says “Made in Fullerton since 1980” - who cares about this except for me and few other crusties? It presumes that you know the history of Fender and significance of it, whereas most Fender owners have no idea where Fullerton is nevermind that it was where so many great Fender instruments were made. The product info is all “features” like Saddle Lock Bridge and Dual Fulcrum Vibrato; that’s like a car manufacturer putting “Fuel Injection”, “16v” or “ABS” on their products, it’s old hat, we expect all this and a lot more these days.

 

This is painfully accurate :')

They like to present themselves as innovative, when all their innovations date back to the 1980s or earlier and they haven't kept on innovating since- unless you count scrapping Leo's fairly unique Bi-cut neck with single-action truss rod in 2006, and replacing it with a more conventional double-action truss rod routed below the fingerboard, as on most modern guitars, and switching to a whopping FOUR neck bolts instead of three, and six on some basses. 

 

I love G&L, one of my guitars dearest to me is an American ASAT Special (one of the earliest with 4-bolt neck, but still with the bi-cut neck) and I've owned a few others in the past (another ASAT Special, a Legacy Special and an SB-2, all 3-bolts) and all of them were wonderful. I would hate to see the brand disappear. 

[Musicman20]

I noticed this mentioned here:

 

https://www.reddit.com/r/GLGuitars/comments/1nla1iw/gl_shut_down_temporary_or_permanent/

[Sean]

2 hours ago, Musicman20 said:

I noticed this mentioned here:

 

https://www.reddit.com/r/GLGuitars/comments/1nla1iw/gl_shut_down_temporary_or_permanent/

There's some shocking stuff in there. I had no idea how bad it was.

[Grahambythesea]

I wonder if Mr. Trump’s tariffs have played a part which presumably are applied to the Tribute series basses which I guess probably sell better than there more expensive US made counterparts. G&L was never a brand that had the same “Leo” magic as Fender & Musicman. 

[itu]

13 minutes ago, Grahambythesea said:

G&L was never a brand that had the same “Leo” magic as Fender & Musicman. 

For me G&L has always been the workhorse of all these three brands because of the versatility. Especially models L-2000 and 2500 (and Wide-5): modern electronics and 2 pickups. 

 

When Nirvana started to use those cheapo and old student instruments, a friend of mine went to US. He came back with a neat G&L and said that Fender prices were sky high while his instrument had a very attractive price tag. George & Leo would be my choice of all his three companies. Well, an old Sabre could be close. 

[Mediocre Polymath]

That's sad to hear. I agree with what has already been said though, about how they've always seemed a little held back by their sort of internally contradictory relationship with the idea of innovation. They pitch themselves as high tech and the final refinement of the Fender-style design, but they're also trying to trade on their connection to the broader Fender history to an equal or greater extent.

 

As a side note, I've always found it odd when people have such visceral reactions to headstock shapes. Unless it's something deliberately oversized or covered with overbearing ornamental flourishes, I really don't much care.

 

It would never have occurred to me that a little kink in the lower curve of an otherwise conventional four-in-line headstock could elicit such strong reactions one way or another.

[kodiakblair]

3 hours ago, Sean said:

There's some shocking stuff in there.

Not half.

 

Did you the one where some arse said he was regretting not buying one 25 years, even though the shop manager told they were built by the Fender brothers George and Leo 🤣🤣🤣

 

Way I see things G&L struggled because A. they concentrated mostly on the US market. B. they traded on myths centred around an old guy who died in his 80's 30 odd years back. 

 

Sad though if they wind up down the tubes as they paid the best money. Their hourly rate was $19.50, pish when compared to the In 'n' Out burger chain's $21ph starting rate but better than the $16 Ernie Ball pays or the $18 you get at Fender Corona.

[Schnozzalee]

I felt like they were doing well until McLaren took over from Paul Gagon. 

 

They pumped out loads for Andertons/PMT/GuitarGuitar in 2018, in okoume, caribbean rosewood etc and gig bags... They just fell flat.

 

Gutted though because this is/was my favourite brand.

[Stub Mandrel]

I've always ignored g&l for two, possibly irrational, reasons.

 

First, the styling - logo and headstock.

 

Second, unlike Musicman, g&l always seem like slightly upmarket Fender clones. If these are "Leo finally gets it right", why are they so conservative? 

[tauzero]

5 hours ago, Grahambythesea said:

I wonder if Mr. Trump’s tariffs have played a part which presumably are applied to the Tribute series basses which I guess probably sell better than there more expensive US made counterparts. G&L was never a brand that had the same “Leo” magic as Fender & Musicman. 

 

Presumably they do because one of the links above points to a thread where one poster says that the Tributes are QCed in the USA, hence they'd presumably have to be imported unless there's some sort of special dispensation. The answer would be to export the QC jobs to Indonesia, then export direct from Indonesia, which would avoid US tariffs except for those to be sent to the US anyway.

[neepheid]

I'm a big fan of G&L basses.  Although I currently only have one (a CLF L-1000) I have owned several Tributes in the past, and they've all been excellent instruments.  I only sold them because I was pack shuffling (or fundraising) and figured I could easily buy them again if needs be.  Whoops, that might have been a miscalculation, given the information swirling around the internet.

 

Honestly, I've felt in my gut they've been in bother for a while.  They gave me the impression that they had retreated to their home market - there has been little to no stock in the UK/EU for many months now (the recent burp in availability of Tributes and a single Fullerton Deluxe bass at GuitarGuitar is an anomaly - trust me, I've been keeping an eye on things).  Thomann don't even list G&L as a brand they carry any more.  That's a red flag, when your products aren't even listed on presumably Europe's biggest music retailer.

 

Ever since I got introduced to G&L instruments at a bass bash and fell in love with them, I always got this feeling that they were like a "secret owner's club" and "best kept secret" type of outfit.  Back in the day, that might have worked in a "when you know, you know" organic kind of way.  But these days where if you don't make a loud noise about yourself and your products in a flashy, attention grabbing 10 second short video you're officially a behind the times loser, that just isn't sustainable any more.

 

No-one apart from old farts care about Leo Fender's "DNA" in the instruments.  Frankly, even though I am an old fart (in Internet terms at least) I don't give a monkey's about it either, never did.  You've got to move with the times, or step aside.  I really hoped that after they finally dragged their website into something approaching a modern, contemporary design a couple of years ago that it would signify a shift in focus/attitude but it seems that was only window dressing at best.

 

I hope they pull through.  Apart from my direct affection for the brand and its products, from a purely selfish point of view, you know what the second hand market will do with the news that there is suddenly a finite supply of something...

[LeftyJ]

This thread and the posts over on Reddit inspired me to pick up my ASAT Special again last night after neglecting it for some time, and it was fun. It's such a lovely guitar, and the Jumbo MFD pickups are wonderful. Loud, defined, with more low end and brightness than any other single coil guitar I own, but they clean up beautifully when turning down the volume control. And thanks to the treble bleed the character stays intact when turning it down. Their electronics really are their forte. I sold an ASAT Special once and regretted it for years, I won't make that mistake twice! 

[Supernaut]

G&L > Musicman > Fender

[jd56hawk]

Sad news if they actually go out of business.

I wouldn't trade this for a brand new USA-made Fender Precision 𝘢𝘯𝘥 Jazz bass.

 

[Mokl]

I actually quite like the headstock. 

 

Not played the Tributes but have had 3 US over the years, ASAT and SB1 basses and a Legacy 6 string. I regret parting with them all, although I wouldn't go back to the ASAT bass because of the body shape discomfort/neck dive on a strap. The build quality was very good on all, would be sad to see them go, but as others have suggested, in the crowded marketplace of today, it's easy to understand how they might be struggling.