visog Posted December 7, 2015 Share Posted December 7, 2015 [quote name='Bassjon' timestamp='1449521390' post='2924362'] I listened to a Jaco live solo once. I didn't understand it. There was no time signature, it was just random runs with a couple of harmonics on the end. Then waiting for a few seconds then doing it again ..... and again. [/quote] Yes - much as I love his music I recognise this... his solo in on the live video of 'Shadows and Light' is like this - unsettled and neurotic. Might be the coke.... but his earlier work testify to his ability to play beautiful arrangements and parts, as well as inhuman stamina on super-fast grooves.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
colgraff Posted December 7, 2015 Share Posted December 7, 2015 (edited) [quote name='Bassjon' timestamp='1449521390' post='2924362'] I listened to a Jaco live solo once. I didn't understand it. There was no time signature, it was just random runs with a couple of harmonics on the end. Then waiting for a few seconds then doing it again ..... and again. I put my humble opinion on what I thought next to the video - didn't slag it off, just said I don't get it and it's not for me and how I like to hear a cohesive catchy melody in a song format. Well the shitstorm of hatred I got was unbelievable! 'You're not a 'proper' musician' etc! So for me Jaco has been spoiled by all the fanboy jazz purists. I do like playing Come On, Come Over' though. Start there, its easy to listen to! [/quote] I've had lots of criticism (professional and personal) along these lines relating to different musicians, a fair bit on BC and a not inconsiderable amount because I have always been a singer who plays bass rather than vice versa. I get very uncomfortable as soon as one style of music is held up as superior to another. To me, it is all music and some I like, some I don't. I don't have enough years left to master everything, so I stick to what I enjoy. Edited December 7, 2015 by colgraff Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bassjon Posted December 7, 2015 Share Posted December 7, 2015 (edited) I have to be honest I like what I like, hopefully that doesn't mean I'm ignorant to other types of music, it just means I don't get enjoyment out of jazz bass solo music so I listen to what I do like. Having said that, I'm really interested in the Jaco movie and I hope it turns me onto his music a bit more. Edited December 7, 2015 by Bassjon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rubbersoul Posted December 7, 2015 Share Posted December 7, 2015 I have listened to some of his stuff but it does nothing for me. Obviously a very gifted musician but it's just not for me. I will try again some time, maybe his less jazzy stuff will appeal more. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drTStingray Posted December 8, 2015 Share Posted December 8, 2015 Yes Jaco really was all that!! Supremely gifted musician, arranger and composer IMHO. He could also groove like the best R and B players I ever saw or heard. However, some of his music is, for me, not very accessible - but there again some of it is very much in the Jazz idiom - there is far less accessible jazz music around than Jacos. I have found his blend of jazz and R and B styles to have influenced my playing as much as people like Louis Jonhnson, John Paul Jones, Jamerson, Babbitt and many others but I have picked up a lot of jazzy progressions from Jaco which I would not have otherwise. His work is well worth a listen and some of the stuff with Mike Stern, Joni Mitchell etc may be less jazzy than that from Weather Report. He also influenced a lot of famous people, not least the phenomenal Norman Watt Roy (the bass part to Hit Me With Your Rythmn Stick is stated by Norman as being directly influenced by Jaco) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blue Posted December 8, 2015 Share Posted December 8, 2015 (edited) [quote name='AinsleyWalker' timestamp='1449496563' post='2923995'] Of course all music is totally subjective but what I've heard of Jaco Pastorius has been a total let down compared to what I've heard from word of mouth. Granted, I've only heard some of the most well known tracks and to me it was just disjointed... It sounded like I'd just walked into any guitar shop in the world... Aimless noodling... Anyone got any suggestions that may change my mind? [/quote] If you don't get Jaco's talent,you might want to consider taking up a different instrument. Bass guitar is not for everyone. Aimless noodling, WTF? Blue Edited December 8, 2015 by blue Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
project_c Posted December 8, 2015 Share Posted December 8, 2015 I never get why people are proud to post stuff that makes them seem deeply ignorant. Unless it's just to troll. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blue Posted December 8, 2015 Share Posted December 8, 2015 (edited) [quote name='project_c' timestamp='1449539357' post='2924525'] I never get why people are proud to post stuff that makes them seem deeply ignorant. Unless it's just to troll. [/quote] Not sure if your referencing me, if you are I guess that's OK. However, I'm not trolling. And most that know me, know I live in a pretty back & white world. I don't think my opinion is any more absurd than the tittle of this thread. And i know my comment is pretty harsh and I should have kept it to myself. But I am thinking others had the same thought as me, but were to smart to share it.. Fisrt time in 40 years i have ever heard anyone refer to Joco's playing as "aimless noodling" Blue. Edited December 8, 2015 by blue Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
40hz Posted December 8, 2015 Share Posted December 8, 2015 [quote name='blue' timestamp='1449537862' post='2924522'] If you don't get Jaco's talent,you might want to consider taking up a different instrument. Bass guitar is not for everyone. Aimless noodling, WTF? Blue [/quote] So OP should give up bass because he doesn't like Jaco? Absolute twaddle. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blue Posted December 8, 2015 Share Posted December 8, 2015 [quote name='40hz' timestamp='1449542000' post='2924528'] So OP should give up bass because he doesn't like Jaco? Absolute twaddle. [/quote] If he hears aimless noodling in Jaco, I'd say yes, it's something he should consider. I'm a big fan and the aimless noodling remark ticked me off. Blue Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Number6 Posted December 8, 2015 Share Posted December 8, 2015 I have to say there are so many elements of Jaco' playing that have influenced other players. I listen back through his music and can always pick out a little part that is useful. His music as a whole is certainly not what this cat listens too regularly but i find his bass playing really inspirational. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
project_c Posted December 8, 2015 Share Posted December 8, 2015 [quote name='blue' timestamp='1449541667' post='2924527'] Not sure if your referencing me, if you are I guess that's OK. However, I'm not trolling. And most that know me, know I live in a pretty back & white world. I don't think my opinion is any more absurd than the tittle of this thread. And i know my comment is pretty harsh and I should have kept it to myself. But I am thinking others had the same thought as me, but were to smart to share it.. Fisrt time in 40 years i have ever heard anyone refer to Joco's playing as "aimless noodling" Blue. [/quote] Referencing the OP, not you - I totally agree with everything you say. But i reckon this thread was started either by someone who's trolling, or just very proud of their own ignorance.. either way, not worth the effort! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CamdenRob Posted December 8, 2015 Share Posted December 8, 2015 I had a quick listen through some of the examples in this thread last night for the first time. He sounds very tallented but I couldn't really hear any notes... just lots of parpy fretless sliding about. Was pretty unique though and I'd not even know where to start coming up with lines like that presented with similar root material to work with. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drTStingray Posted December 8, 2015 Share Posted December 8, 2015 [quote name='CamdenRob' timestamp='1449560420' post='2924560'] He sounds very tallented but I couldn't really hear any notes... just lots of parpy fretless sliding about. [/quote] This along with the aimless noodling remark really makes me wonder whether I've been blessed with super hearing or whether some people have little or no hearing at all. Not all of his stuff is on fretless (a point he used to correct people on back in the day) and apart from live (where his sound was slightly less distinct) the notes are generally very distinct - in fact most genres of music in the late 70s early 80s was characterised by very distinct bass notes and sound. If you don't like jazz or R and B then you're unlikely to listen for long enough to appreciate Jaco. Some of these comments are along the lines of what I would have expected to hear in the 70s from fans of anarchic enthusiastic clanging of the day - aherm punk I think was the genre. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sibob Posted December 8, 2015 Share Posted December 8, 2015 [quote name='Painy' timestamp='1449507100' post='2924165'] Thanks for that, nice to read an interview that poses relevant questions across a range of topics rather than just focusing on the promotion of an artist's latest venture which seems so prevalent in magazine and tv interviews. [/quote] Thanks for the kind words Si Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve-bbb Posted December 8, 2015 Share Posted December 8, 2015 [quote name='AinsleyWalker' timestamp='1449496563' post='2923995'] Of course all music is totally subjective but what I've heard of Jaco Pastorius has been a total let down compared to what I've heard from word of mouth. Granted, I've only heard some of the most well known tracks and to me it was just disjointed... It sounded like I'd just walked into any guitar shop in the world... Aimless noodling... Anyone got any suggestions that may change my mind? [/quote] pretty much anything of his material with joni mitchell - she was his sort of muse and saw the 'original' in him and gave him masses of leeway creatively (and socially it would seem) within her closest circle way too much material to choose from so im going to put this up here because it is beautifully sublime and simple [url="http://youtu.be/N0MwObE-OC4"]http://youtu.be/N0MwObE-OC4[/url] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lowdown Posted December 8, 2015 Share Posted December 8, 2015 (edited) [quote name='chardbass' timestamp='1449518618' post='2924315'] I rarely hear him now but I heard this the other day and it moved me so deeply. Simply stunning. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QpaFTPmp2Pw&feature=youtu.be [/quote] I still listen to this on occasions and I think the lyrical side of him really shines out on this track. As someone else said above, a lovely arrangement as well. Edited December 8, 2015 by lowdown Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dad3353 Posted December 8, 2015 Share Posted December 8, 2015 Just wondering whether those that only capture 'aimless noodling' or 'parpy fretless sliding about' think of stuff like this ..? http://youtu.be/38QwLRYK8X0 Nothing there, either..? To me, although obviously different instruments, generation and all, the musicality shines through Just wondering... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CamdenRob Posted December 8, 2015 Share Posted December 8, 2015 (edited) Just for ballance I do like a bit of parpy fretless... I'm often inclined to do some myself I'll have to have a better listen tonight, there were just to many notes in the bits I heard yesterday, not enough structure for my taste... I couldn't really pick out a melody or groove. Guess I'm just conditioned to cycles of riffs etc... I am a man of simple tastes Edited December 8, 2015 by CamdenRob Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Number6 Posted December 8, 2015 Share Posted December 8, 2015 [quote name='CamdenRob' timestamp='1449571322' post='2924671'] Just for ballance I do like a bit of parpy fretless... I'm often inclined to do some myself I'll have to have a better listen tonight, there were just to many notes in the bits I heard yesterday, not enough structure for my taste... I couldn't really pick out a melody or groove. Guess I'm just conditioned to cycles of riffs etc... I am a man of simple tastes [/quote] You need to listen to Kuru Rob Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spoombung Posted December 8, 2015 Share Posted December 8, 2015 (edited) I'll always associate him with Joe Zawinul''s exotic Latin Jazz compositions and being an equal part of one of the greatest bands of all time. Context is everything and people may prefer his Joni Mitchell and Weather Report stuff to the intense spotlight focused on his bass in the solo albums. His role in the development of bass playing is so obvious it hardly needs a mention. Edited December 8, 2015 by Spoombung Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AntLockyer Posted December 8, 2015 Share Posted December 8, 2015 [quote name='Dad3353' timestamp='1449570764' post='2924664'] Just wondering whether those that only capture 'aimless noodling' or 'parpy fretless sliding about' think of stuff like this ..? [/quote] While I can hear a lot of merit in Jaco's work a lot of it is a bit far out there and does appear to be aimless noodling. That Schubert piece is exceptionally well structured and more importantly accessible to most people without having to be in possession of whatever it is people need to be able to decipher Jaco. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ezbass Posted December 8, 2015 Share Posted December 8, 2015 (edited) With so many of the great and good of bass world (beyond the walls of BC) hailing Jaco, it is hard to pretend his impact wasn't huge. However, for me, his playing doesn't do it for me because of the genre. Yes his work with Joni was nice enough, but for my tastes (which seem to coincide with CamdenRob's in this regard) the whole thing leaves me a bit cold.[quote name='CamdenRob' timestamp='1449571322' post='2924671'] I couldn't really pick out a melody or groove. Guess I'm just conditioned to cycles of riffs etc... I am a man of simple tastes [/quote]Which is why, I guess, I prefer Stanley Clarke, to me, it's just more accessible, given my musical sensibilities. [url="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hrnI7TQ44U0"]http://www.youtube....h?v=hrnI7TQ44U0[/url] And now with the marvellous Jeff Beck [url="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cOaAZlrt6II"]http://www.youtube....h?v=cOaAZlrt6II[/url] EDIT: I don't understand why the videos only show as links? Edited December 8, 2015 by ezbass Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AinsleyWalker Posted December 8, 2015 Author Share Posted December 8, 2015 (edited) Thanks to everyone who gave genuine helpful responses/suggestions, I plan to check all of it out at some stage! As to [url="http://basschat.co.uk/user/3700-project-c/"]project_c[/url] and [url="http://basschat.co.uk/user/34882-blue/"]blue[/url] it's a shame you feel the need to respond in the aggressive and self-righteous manner that you have, it's people like you that tarnish forums for others. Before I even said anything I stated that music is subjective, ergo, this is purely my opinion. I've been completely honest about my opinion and then as you can see, I've asked for suggestions that might change my mind because I'm always open to a fresh perspective. I figured this was the best platform to express my current point of view in the hopes that it might be changed, not for people like you to say I shouldn't be playing bass or that I'm deeply ignorant because I'm not currently a fan of one specific player. This is a place for friendly discussion and exploration, not for people like you to climb onto your pedestal in an attempt to put others down. Perhaps you both need to learn how to maturely disagree with others. Edited December 8, 2015 by AinsleyWalker Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toneknob Posted December 8, 2015 Share Posted December 8, 2015 Oh, I'm quite partial to a bit of parpy fretless. Which songs in particular exhibit this, please? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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