BC's new classifieds section - your opinions please

[Conan]

[quote name='skankdelvar' timestamp='1354755561' post='1890158']
Ped and Steve cannot be expected to run the site at a personal loss simply for our benefit. Because the logical outcome... is that they go broke and there's no site upon which to advertise, at which point we'd all be royally f***ed up the fundamental.[/quote]

This.

[quote name='molan' timestamp='1354757413' post='1890166']
I can't think of anything that costs so little yet delivers such a wide, and directly relevant, target audience. I'd gladly pay a bit more to get things up and running with a solid base for future development
[/quote]

Oh and this as well.

I read with incredulity yesterday that there are people who have sold stuff on here (or even just advertised stuff) but have [i]never [/i]made a donation. I might not donate after [i]every[/i] item sold (a set of strings for example) but whenever I sell something with a value of greater than £100 or so I reach for the "donate" button. I can't believe that some people don't! That is just taking advantage of a (currently) free service!!

Edited December 6, 2012 by Conan

[Big_Stu]

From what I've seen over a couple of years or so, this is the place to come to for a full & frank opinion on any item you may wish to buy or at least audition. No-one with their eye on commission, or what brands they have in stock, & happy to give good, bad or indifferent experience. You'd struggle to find a shop that doesn't have a hint of any of those points, or others negatives, and any comparable site with such experience comes with a free American slant to all views.
There is nowhere that can offer such a service, & so - regardless of whether I place ads or not - I'd be happy to pay a regular annual subscription of £10-£20 no problem. I don't see the direct connection between paying and placing adverts, we all buy something bass related somewhere or other every year, if advice on here stops you buying cheap crap strings not worth a Donald (for eg.) then you've got your subs back already.

[uncle psychosis]

[quote name='ped' timestamp='1354731453' post='1889775']
We already have a message to every seller to ask for a donation, and unfortunately it doesn't work. Shame, but there you go!!
[/quote]

well, yes. But my memory of that message is that its a bit flowery---"it would be really nice if you send us a donation...". What I'm suggesting is more of an upfront "We cannot continue doing this for free, please help us out".

FWIW, I will be hitting the donate button at some point this month (I'm utterly skint and waiting for an expenses claim to hit my bank account...).

Edited December 6, 2012 by uncle psychosis

[mcnach]

[quote name='molan' timestamp='1354757413' post='1890166']
I think Talkbass has a 'lifetime' membership that allows open access to the classifieds indefinitely.

I'd be happy to consider a single one-off donation of an amount greater than £20 to save the hassle of annual renewal.

Let's face it, £20 = just £1.67 a month for the potential to a huge, an knowledgeable, base of potential customers for any sale.

I can't think of anything that costs so little yet delivers such a wide, and directly relevant, target audience. I'd gladly pay a bit more to get things up and running with a solid base for future development
[/quote]


Indeed.

I was also thinking about when I used to buy guitar/bass magazines. I used to buy 1-3 every month, at around £5 each.
Sure, it's a different kind of information. But I find BC more entertaining, for sure. It must be worth a donation here and there.

[Billy Apple]

Feel like I'm coming in very late here, but all the same. I like the old market-place, I like how a sale can develop into its own thing and become part of the discussion The new classifieds seem just that, the classifieds at the back of the paper, but I want to read the news. However I have no problem with paying for BC membership. £20 a year? I spill more than that in ale down me BC polo on a Friday neet!

[Norris]

Summarising a lot of common responses:[list]
[*]Many people on here are happy to pay an annual subscription
[*]Some people would leave if the annual subscription was compulsory
[*]The site can't do anything too complicated to segregate paying/non-paying members
[*]The mods want to reduce the amount of time they spend moderating
[/list]
So my idea is:[list]
[*]Decide an annual subscription level (£20 has been suggested)
[*]Make it easy to pay
[*]Make it [u]optional[/u] (then you won't lose members/passing traffic)
[*]Find a way to display to [u]everyone[/u] if a member has contributed or not (an icon next to their avatar or something other than the "Members" group under their name)
[*][u]Let the users decide[/u] who they want to trade with or pressurise (regular traders) into contributing (there is enough badgering already going on in the Marketplace for sellers to provide location/price/photos etc. without involving mods)
[/list]
Would that keep everyone happy?

[wateroftyne]

[quote name='Norris' timestamp='1354885077' post='1891590']
So my idea is:[list]
[*]Decide an annual subscription level (£20 has been suggested)
[*]Make it easy to pay
[*]Make it [u]optional[/u] (then you won't lose members/passing traffic)
[*]Find a way to display to [u]everyone[/u] if a member has contributed or not (an icon next to their avatar or something other than the "Members" group under their name)
[/list]
[/quote]

This would be my preference too, but Ped has said they don't want to create any sort of membership 'hierarchy'. I'm not sure it would be a problem - it works fine elsewhere.

[ped]

[quote name='wateroftyne' timestamp='1354885229' post='1891594']
This would be my preference too, but Ped has said they don't want to create any sort of membership 'hierarchy'. I'm not sure it would be a problem - it works fine elsewhere.
[/quote]

It'll have to be compulsory. If you look at TB, it's compulsory there, and if you donate the minimum you get extra benefits, all of which you get here for free anyway.

In the future we may be able to offer extra benefits for a larger fee but all in all I don't think it would be fair to expect some to pay and others not to. Anyone can use the forum as they wish, but if you're selling something worth more than £100, it's fair enough to expect some payback for that. If that puts some people off then we'll have to accept that, but I wonder where else would represent such a good chance of selling their item.

[wateroftyne]

[quote name='ped' timestamp='1354887444' post='1891630']
It'll have to be compulsory. If you look at TB, it's compulsory there, and if you donate the minimum you get extra benefits, all of which you get here for free anyway.

In the future we may be able to offer extra benefits for a larger fee but all in all I don't think it would be fair to expect some to pay and others not to. Anyone can use the forum as they wish, but if you're selling something worth more than £100, it's fair enough to expect some payback for that. If that puts some people off then we'll have to accept that, but I wonder where else would represent such a good chance of selling their item.
[/quote]

I've just realised that TB's classifieds were restricted to supporting members - didn't know that...!

I suppose the classifieds thing has never been a driver for me to contribute either here or TB - I just do it because I'm grateful.

[ped]

[quote name='wateroftyne' timestamp='1354887764' post='1891642']
I've just realised that TB's classifieds were restricted to supporting members - didn't know that...!

I suppose the classifieds thing has never been a driver for me to contribute either here or TB - I just do it because I'm grateful.
[/quote]

Yes it didn't used to be, but I was talking to the owner about it and they have found it's been useful - at the end of the day you can't compare something like eBay of Gumtree to a forum setup, for better or for worse. All have their advantages.

[neepheid]

More moderators == less time spent moderating? Non?

[Salt on your Bass?]

I fully support the two tier classified charge or subscription. Makes sense to me as if youre personally making a finncial gain from an established database, you should contribute yo the maintenance of that database.

Im not sure bout a tiered optional subscription. I agree every member benefits from knowledge and experience.
I like the level playing field of everones views and comments that mke up the community. Could you send automted messages every 100 or so posts from the user requesting a donation? Accompanied by an interesting haiku or bass fact? Not sure if this is simple, but once an established or more frequent user it should inspire a contribution.

The donte button and topics for donations are easy to ignore.

Thanks for all the hard work guys.

[JTUK]

Don't really bother with the new classifieds,tbh... but then I am not on the hunt for anything either.
That didn't always stop me using/checking-out the old FS section, tho..

[Owen]

Sorry, I have not scanned this thread so I might have missed something obvious in my response.

Pay to sell? Totally yes. Happy to do so. Stuff costs money to run. That is how things work properly

New classifieds? I must admit they are not doing it for me. Sorry I really like the debate around bits of kit for sale. The new classifieds seem to need another step before actually getting in there and they seem slightly sterile. I am more than aware that I am not a mod and that there are probably sound reasons for having them.

[Musicman20]

I don't like the new Classifieds section, sorry

There are some players who buy stuff to sell on here for no charge, and make profit, so yeah, a donation should be required. Subscription to sell might be a bit harder to run...depends.

[BassTractor]

For me it lacks the charm that the discussion gave the old forum. Could be some great info there often.
Now, sadly, it doesn't attract me anymore.
That said, I'd probably look if I was on a hunt, but the GAS doesn't sneak up on me anymore.


best,
bert

[peteb]

First impressions are that the new classifieds are not as user friendly as the old

I may want to buy and sell a couple of basses next year but there is no way I would pay a subscription! A reasonable charge for a successful sale or a small insertion fee may be acceptable (bearing in mind that the market is very slow at the moment) but certainly not a subcription.

Sorry but I think that you would find that most of the traffic you get from people who don't post alot but are interested in buying or selling would take the same view.....

[cloudburst]

If it ain't broke, don't fix it.

CB

[Kiwi]

According to some members it was broke and did need fixing. The problem with politics is that the right question sometimes reveals how divided everyone is about what the right answer is. This means we don't always get a clear direction about what the right thing to do is. But sometimes the outcome matters less than talking to people about the outcome.

[wateroftyne]

Was there any research done with the user base?

[Kiwi]

Oh we would have loved to have done that. Problem is...there are no analysis tools available with the modules. Everything would need to be coded which would need funding.

[BigBeatNut]

No analysis tools ? Maybe i'm missing WOT's point but we do have opinion polls as a standard part of the forum don't we ? An opinion poll before coding began might have saved expenditure by not starting on the (apparently not very popular) classifieds section.

Actually ... it's perfectly possible there was a poll and I missed it. Apologies if so.

[wateroftyne]

That's what I was thinking - even just a simple 'What do you think about...' thread.

[ped]

That's what this is!

To be honest as I've said we're limited to what we can do by software and funds so to a certain extent opening it up to a free for all wouldn't be productive. When we can afford to we'll see if we can adapt things further, but going on the TB model seems the best route right now.

[Jigster]

Not crazy about the new Classifieds - but agree with some above, if you're selling and get a sale then it's only right to put a bit back in the BC pot