Ken Smith and customer service ?

[pantherairsoft]

Shall we consider this conversation drawn to a close then...?

How many OT posts in a row do we think it needs before it gets relegated from General Bass Discussion to Off Topic

At least it's friendly! That said, if I see that drummer at the wrong gig video crop up in anymore threads I may just have a mental breakdown...

[Jean-Luc Pickguard]

[quote name='pantherairsoft' post='1266824' date='Jun 12 2011, 11:46 PM']How many OT posts in a row do we think it needs before it gets relegated from General Bass Discussion to Off Topic [/quote]
Seven

[waynepunkdude]

[quote name='pantherairsoft' post='1266824' date='Jun 12 2011, 11:46 PM']Shall we consider this conversation drawn to a close then...?

How many OT posts in a row do we think it needs before it gets relegated from General Bass Discussion to Off Topic

At least it's friendly! That said, if I see that drummer at the wrong gig video crop up in anymore threads I may just have a mental breakdown...[/quote]


I don't see why it'd need to be drawn to a close just because of a few light hearted comments, it'll just drop off of the page when it draws to a close..

[wateroftyne]

[quote name='Jean-Luc Pickguard' post='1266828' date='Jun 12 2011, 11:49 PM']Seven[/quote]
Wrong!

The answer is seven-and-a-bit.

And I should know - I've got Wall-E on DVD *and* Blu-Ray.

[Jean-Luc Pickguard]

[quote name='wateroftyne' post='1266830' date='Jun 12 2011, 11:51 PM']Wrong!

The answer is seven-and-a-bit.

And I should know - I've got Wall-E on DVD *and* Blu-Ray.[/quote]
No - it's definitely seven - the same as the number a roads a man must walk down before you call him a man.

[Rich]

Wrong again actually, the answer is one of the following:
[list=1]
[*]Ulaan Bator.
[*]One sixth of a gill.
[*]Colonel Mustard, in the library, with the candlestick.
[*]Yes.
[*]1951.
[*]Tim.
[*]"Tea break's over, back on yer heads."
[*]No.
[*]The third dalek from the left.
[*]Marmoset.
[/list]

[skankdelvar]

[quote name='pantherairsoft' post='1266824' date='Jun 12 2011, 11:46 PM']How many OT posts in a row do we think it needs before it gets [s]relegated[/s] elevated from General Bass Discussion to Off Topic [/quote]
Probably the right place for it, tbh. Keep it all 'in-house' and on the QT, so to speak.

[quote name='purpleblob' post='1266716' date='Jun 12 2011, 10:21 PM']I'd like to point out that my company has no issues with small parts, that's just a rumour [/quote]
Ooops. My mistake. Wrong blob. Meant [b]thepurpleblob[/b].

It's all [i]very [/i]confusing. Sorry

Edited June 12, 2011 by skankdelvar

[yorks5stringer]

Hi Ken

The name's keith barclay and I'm 56 so you can confidently believe I wrote this email myself ...how dare you come on here and diss our cars and our strings I thought we had a "special relationship"?

Go in Peace

[waynepunkdude]

I sh*t you not, first phone call I got today was from a guy called Kenneth Smith.

[yorks5stringer]

[quote name='waynepunkdude' post='1266989' date='Jun 13 2011, 09:41 AM']I sh*t you not, first phone call I got today was from a guy called Kenneth Smith.[/quote]

Did he sound as if he'd been up all night?

[Ross]

The thing Ken can't seem to grasp, if people are spending £3k+ on a bass, it's not a big thing to expect the company to ship them a $10 pot and not extort $100 for their back pocket claiming it was for shipping. That is disgraceful customer service.

Oh and, Ross Curtis here, 19, business student. And to be honest I wouldn't buy a Ken Smith bass because I don't like the majority of botique basses and can't afford it on a student budget. If I did decide in the future when I'm earning good money I do want one I'd think twice about buying a Ken Smith now.

Edited June 13, 2011 by Ross

[bassbluestew]

Before this thread gets closed, I want to welcome Ken and thank him for taking the time, and as anyone who runs a business will know, he will have lots of better things to do with his time than answer threads that are going off topic.

Ken, you basses are fantastic, at least mine is. I have been playing for 35 years now, and been through a lot of good and bad basses in that time. This is the best by a long, long way. It's also the most expensive, but I only consider items expensive if they don't fulfil my expectations or if I don't enjoy them. I think this bass is excellent value. And if I needed, I'd buy another. No problem and no hesitation.

Every player I have shown or let play this bass has said WOW, without fail. No one has ever said it anything less.

So thats nailed.....I'm a huge fanboi, I make no excuse nor feel I need to.

HOWEVER, before it gets too gushy, I do think there are marketing and communication issues. Now in a very small ( in number of staff only ) company this is understandable. I am very pleased to hear theres a new website on the way, that will help enormously.

It seems to me that the problem is time, isn't it always. I fully understand that commercial realities mean you just don't have the time to personally deal with every single request for parts or whatever. You have to make a buck as we all do, and you should do what you do best, which is make superb bass guitars. All this notwithstanding you also have a thriving and respected upright / bow business going on too ( how many other top end bass makers can say that ?? ) so you are doubly pressed for time.
Ken, as a possible solution, how about approaching a local university who run a Marketing degree, and offering an internship. I'm sure lots of bass playing Marketing students ( like I was ) would bite your arm off to work full or part time looking after your customer services ( even if only sending out international orders ) to take a bit of the pressure off you ?? As Kiwi said, respect comes from looking after the customers, not defending the product.

Thanks again for taking the time and dealing with some of these replies in a far more dignified and professional manner than I would have. I look forward to more positive relationship developing with the general UK bass playing scene.

Stewart.
p.s It was I who commented on the $300 minimum order for internation sales and having checked I can send a copy of the mail if you want to see it.

Edited June 13, 2011 by bassbluestew

[Machines]

If anything - this thread has intrigued me about KT basses. Thankfully I have 3 within an hour of me I can try out. Buying one is a different matter - but wanting one is the first stage.

[Beedster]

[quote name='Machines' post='1267099' date='Jun 13 2011, 11:10 AM']If anything - this thread has intrigued me about KT basses.[/quote]

Do you think it was all a cunning marketing ploy

[Vibrating G String]

[quote name='skankdelvar' post='1266318' date='Jun 12 2011, 09:08 AM']What we're left with VGS's incorrect string-gauge barney. And once the dust settled, Ken sent another set of strings. Not ideal, tbh, but not life-threatening either.[/quote]
It was a large order of strings for a business, not just a single set. As I posted earlier the mistake is totally forgivable. Calling me stupid was not.

Many guitar related businesses are run by people with no businesses sense and orders from NAMM were often wrong. My order for gig bags from Levys for example where they sent me straps instead and argued that was cool.

[Vibrating G String]

[quote name='Jean-Luc Pickguard' post='1266828' date='Jun 12 2011, 03:49 PM']Seven[/quote]
Heck, I can do seven by myself.

[Vibrating G String]

[quote name='Machines' post='1267099' date='Jun 13 2011, 03:10 AM']If anything - this thread has intrigued me about KT basses.[/quote]
KT? Did you mean KS?

[originalfunkbrother]

[quote name='bassbluestew' post='1267072' date='Jun 13 2011, 10:45 AM']Before this thread gets closed, I want to welcome Ken and thank him for taking the time, and as anyone who runs a business will know, he will have lots of better things to do with his time than answer threads that are going off topic.

Ken, you basses are fantastic, at least mine is. I have been playing for 35 years now, and been through a lot of good and bad basses in that time. This is the best by a long, long way. It's also the most expensive, but I only consider items expensive if they don't fulfil my expectations or if I don't enjoy them. I think this bass is excellent value. And if I needed, I'd buy another. No problem and no hesitation.

Every player I have shown or let play this bass has said WOW, without fail. No one has ever said it anything less.

So thats nailed.....I'm a huge fanboi, I make no excuse nor feel I need to.

HOWEVER, before it gets too gushy, I do think there are marketing and communication issues. Now in a very small ( in number of staff only ) company this is understandable. I am very pleased to hear theres a new website on the way, that will help enormously.

It seems to me that the problem is time, isn't it always. I fully understand that commercial realities mean you just don't have the time to personally deal with every single request for parts or whatever. You have to make a buck as we all do, and you should do what you do best, which is make superb bass guitars. All this notwithstanding you also have a thriving and respected upright / bow business going on too ( how many other top end bass makers can say that ?? ) so you are doubly pressed for time.
Ken, as a possible solution, how about approaching a local university who run a Marketing degree, and offering an internship. I'm sure lots of bass playing Marketing students ( like I was ) would bite your arm off to work full or part time looking after your customer services ( even if only sending out international orders ) to take a bit of the pressure off you ?? As Kiwi said, respect comes from looking after the customers, not defending the product.

Thanks again for taking the time and dealing with some of these replies in a far more dignified and professional manner than I would have. I look forward to more positive relationship developing with the general UK bass playing scene.

Stewart.
p.s It was I who commented on the $300 minimum order for internation sales and having checked I can send a copy of the mail if you want to see it.[/quote]


+2

[bassbluestew]

[quote]Oh and, Ross Curtis here, 19, business student. And to be honest I wouldn't buy a Ken Smith bass because I don't like the majority of botique basses and can't afford it on a student budget. If I did decide in the future when I'm earning good money I do want one I'd think twice about buying a Ken Smith now.[/quote]

Hi Ross, I would fully expect that if this was new bass, or even an older single owner bass, the Ken would have done this. In this case its' not. It's had god knows how many owners, and whilst may be lovingly treated by the current owner, how have the previous owners treated it ??

Also remember this isn't strictly a boutique bass, it's not a cheap bass by any stretch of the imagination, but with all due respect to the current owner, it is one of the lower priced models, and is 10 plus years old. I reckon if he had walked into Kens shop with the bass, the pot would have been supplied and fitted very cheaply, if not FOC.

It's a shame you are ruling out Ken's basses in the future because of this, I'm sure if you played one - with an open mind - it might change your mind. They are truly great.

Stewart

[skankdelvar]

[quote name='Ross' post='1267065' date='Jun 13 2011, 10:40 AM']The thing Ken can't seem to grasp, if people are spending £3k+ on a bass, it's not a big thing to expect the company to ship them a $10 pot and not extort $100 for their back pocket claiming it was for shipping. That is disgraceful customer service.[/quote]
It's reasonable you'd think that, if you're not in full possession of the facts. If you go back a few pages, you'll see that I checked UPS and the deliv costs are - indeed - eyewatering. $147 for the sort of package we're talking about. As someone else said, it's UPS we should be bitching about.

KSB offer UPS shipping with the option of US Mail at a much lower cost. No extortion, afaics.

Edited June 13, 2011 by skankdelvar

[AndyTravis]

I owned a 1991 Burner Artist for a short while and made some enquiries directly to Ken about changing the Black Hardware over to the modern Gold Equivalent.

He replied quickly in person, and although his response was, shall we say 'functional' - I didn't expect a reply from the owner of the company.

I just think I took it for what it was, a busy guy who must get 20 general enquiry e-mails for every one serious enquiry regarding his basses.

I'd still own another, just didn't have the money to keep the bass at the time, never had an easier bass to play.

[RhysP]

[quote name='Ross' post='1267065' date='Jun 13 2011, 10:40 AM']The thing Ken can't seem to grasp, if people are spending £3k+ on a bass, it's not a big thing to expect the company to ship them a $10 pot and not extort $100 for their back pocket claiming it was for shipping. That is disgraceful customer service.[/quote]
If you're going to mouth off at least get your facts right. As Skank has pointed out, The shipping fee was what UPS quoted, not some figure plucked from the air by Mr. Smith.

Also, the OP did not spend $3000+ on a bass - he had an old secondhand bass.

Edited June 13, 2011 by RhysP

[icastle]

[quote name='skankdelvar' post='1265602' date='Jun 12 2011, 12:30 AM']If one googles micrometer monster guitar cable jack damage there are any number of refs. Many seem to suggest that Monster is not 'oversized'. If anything, it's usually bang-on at .250"

But some jacks such as Neutrix are - relative to Monster - microscopically 'undersized'. Whatever the case, you can see how these things start. Best to let it lie.[/quote]

A fraction of a mm out on the overall size isn't an issue regardless of the jack socket in use - the spring will happily accomodate this.
Where the Monster plugs seem to differ is the shape of the tip where it pushes over the spring and the diameter/shape of the chanfer immediately prior to the tip.

I think the rationale was that the slightly larger tip and skinny chamfer leading up to it would hold the plug more firmly in place - unfortunately what it seems to do on some sockets is deform the spring so it wants to push forward further than it should when it is at rest.

My understanding is that eventually this can lead to the spring folding into the path the plug takes and the socket becomes u/s.

[icastle]

Having read through this a couple of things spring to mind.

The main business criticism seems to be based around availability of spare parts and costs involved in shipping them.

Ken - you probably know what minor spare parts are the most requested, have you considered doing a deal with an EU based company and let them pick up the spare parts orders over here?
I'm sure it doesn't form a large part of your business and devolving that particular reponsibilty would let you concentrate on what you do best.

The second thought is that maybe you should consider an extended or 'rewarranty' arrangement.
Once the warranty has expired then a yearly premium of $50 (number off the top of my head) to provide a 'parts only' deal would probably return a profit (not everyone would need to use the service after all) and provide a unique service that would show a commitment to customer care and effectively negate you wasting four hours of your time on an internet forum for the sake of what was initially a $5 pot...

[OliverBlackman]

[quote name='icastle' post='1267307' date='Jun 13 2011, 02:11 PM']The second thought is that maybe you should consider an extended or 'rewarranty' arrangement.
Once the warranty has expired then a yearly premium of $50[/quote]

I think thats a great idea