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Advice welcome - Bergantino HD210 or Barefaced Big Baby 2

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[quote name='[email protected]' timestamp='1484222999' post='3213644']
The whole 'x sells this so they wouldn't like Barefaced' argument is a bit tired.

Plus, do Bass Gear actually carry Bergantino products anymore?
[/quote]

No, we stopped selling them at least a year ago. You may have noticed I referred anyone interested in them to either Mark at Bass Direct and The Gallery for Bergantino.

This doesn't mean that, as a player, I don't like them and that, as a retailer, I have nothing but respect for their build quality, choice of materials, tone and reliability.

Jim Bergantino is also a complete gentleman with a lot of integrity and can't do enough to help his customers.

However - We've never stocked BareFaced and won't take them as PX either.



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Bergantino - probably the most common 'boutique' cabinet in the for sales sections on this site. Somewhat at contrast to a couple of posts in this thread! There always seems to be one for sale.

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I wouldn't have any concerns about the fit and finish on the Gen 3 Barefaced cabs. I've been gigging a Gen3 Big Twin 2 since 2013. It's been my only gigging cab in that time, and for a fair chunk of that time I also had to use it for rehearsals, as we used a friends function room. It's still as good as the day I got it, nothing's fallen off of it, the finish is still perfectly intact, and the handles haven't snapped! Sound is obviously a far more personal thing, is there anyone near you that owns either of the cabs in question?

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[quote name='Kev' timestamp='1484244525' post='3213960']
Bergantino - probably the most common 'boutique' cabinet in the for sales sections on this site. Somewhat at contrast to a couple of posts in this thread! There always seems to be one for sale.
[/quote]

In the interests of fair play, I've just trawled through the For Sale section on here. There are about ten Barefaced boxes for every one Bergantino. I have to admit, I stopped at about the second Bergantino - but you get the idea. It certainly backs up molan's statement. Not that this surprises me, as molan is one of the few knowledgeable contributors to this part of the forum.

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Without wanting to fan an already roaring fire, I don't see how 'how many of this brand or that are for sale' can be used as a true barometer of how they are perceived or valued. Many of these sales (and yes including several of my own) are to fund further purchases of products by said manufacturer.

I think we all have our fave brands for whatever reason. I just don't think it's particularly good practice or healthy to slate members or manufacturers just because we have differing views. Ultimately each of these brands are very well made, technologically advanced and pretty expensive items that help us do what we do better.

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[quote name='stevie' timestamp='1484249822' post='3214070']


In the interests of fair play, I've just trawled through the For Sale section on here. There are about ten Barefaced boxes for every one Bergantino. I have to admit, I stopped at about the second Bergantino - but you get the idea. It certainly backs up molan's statement. Not that this surprises me, as molan is one of the few knowledgeable contributors to this part of the forum.
[/quote]

Unless you have the new UK sales figures for bergatino vs barefaced this is meaningless.. I suspect that far more barefaced cabs have been sold than bergs but am happy to be corrected ..

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I didn't say anything about UK sales figures. I based my statement on what is shown in the For Sale section of this site and it is perfectly valid within the context of the recent discussion. Not only that, but anyone can check it out for themselves and dispute the figures if they want: there are ten times as many used Bareface cabs being sold on this forum than Bergantinos. This shows that molan's claim is not unreasonable.

On the other hand, if you're going to claim that more Barefaced cabs have been sold than Bergs, you really need to produce the figures, otherwise you run the risk of looking like a real tit. :)

Edited by stevie

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[quote name='stevie' timestamp='1484260128' post='3214233']
I didn't say anything about UK sales figures. I based my statement on what is shown in the For Sale section of this site and it is perfectly valid within the context of the recent discussion. Not only that, but anyone can check it out for themselves and dispute the figures if they want: there are ten times as many used Bareface cabs being sold on this forum than Bergantinos. This shows that molan's claim is not unreasonable.

On the other hand, if you're going to claim that more Barefaced cabs have been sold than Bergs, you really need to produce the figures, otherwise you run the risk of looking like a real tit. :)
[/quote]

And what I'm saying is that your statement, though true, has no relevance to the relative "stickiness" of Berg cabs vs Barefaced . There are more BMW's for sale on Autotrader than Infinitis. That does not make BMW's a fad and the Infiniti the long term professional owners choice... How does pointing this out make me look like a real tit? I'm the person trying to apply some logic to the situation. I've never understood why some folk absolutely love Barefaced and other people hate them. They're just pretty standard (but excellent) drivers in a box. Just like the bergs.. And the Bergbois started the flame war, not anyone else... And I did not claim, I said, suspect.... But with only two retail outlets selling Bergs in the UK and Alex having a factory with 5-6 people in it in the UK, with the UK being his historically more important market, it's not a bad guess. Also I see many more Barefaced cabs than Bergs in the wild...

Peace..

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I've owned and A/B'd a few Berg and Barefaced (gen3) cabs, and every time the Barefaced beat the Berg's to my ears. They are both great cabs though, and the Bergs are built better, but weigh more: great time for bassists and choices! Something for everyone.

Also; I have personally sold more Barefaced cabs on here than Bergs, but that's not an indication that the Bergs are keepers, as I'm Berg'less. rather it's because I've bought more BF as they are my preferred cabs; all things considered.

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Some people like Bergs more than BF. Some people like BF more than Bergs.

How this turns into angry posting central every time is just beyond me. It is ALL relative. It all depends on what each individual is looking for in a cab. Nothing else. How do I know if a cab is going to work for me? I play through one. I buy it, try it at home and if I like it I keep it. If I do not I send it back under distance selling or if I bought it here I sell it on for the same price.

Alex is doing his thing. Jim is doing his thing. Both are great options. What a time to be alive!

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Sorry boyz...what a meaningless thread we have here.

I had a berg and a big baby 2 at the same time, preferred the bb2, but I liked some things in the ae210 as well, different taste.

I suspect the hate against one of your homeland's best product may be caused by other factors than barefaced being a poor design.

Myself, I have a mixed love-hate relationship with barefaced, mainly due to a less than pleasing appeal with the owner, but it's partly non rational, and I know it and it doesn't stop me liking the cab. It's not my dream cab, but it's damn good.

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I had a CN210 for a while and it was awesome... I only changed it for a pair of barefaced One10s as they are easier to transport and I also have the option of using just one.

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[i]"However - We've never stocked BareFaced and [u]won't take them as PX either.[/u]" [/i]That's a strange business decision.

Both Bergantino and Barefaced are in the top echelon of bass cabs ever made. Whether someone likes them or not doesn't change that fact.

The reality is. . . you don't get "best in show" awards and reviews (as both these companies do) by not being one of the best.

Edited by chris_b

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I had a pair of berg hs 210's which were the fore-runner to the hd, tone to die for but at 50lbs a little
heavy for my fragile back!....saying this, i would worry having a cab built out of 9mm plywood, not that
i have heard of many failures.

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It has to be a choice made by ear, not recommendation imo. I`m a Barefaced owner/user and I love their cabs so would recommend them heartily, but at the SE Bass Bash a couple of years ago we did a cab shoot-out and the runaway winner was a Berg - the CN212 to be exact. Both makes are pretty high-end, so it`s down to the the ears of the user.

Edited by Lozz196

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I've followed this thread from day one and my admiration of the s**t-stirring abilities of molan just increases every time he posts. :) A perfect lesson in how to create a row - just brilliant!

Thank you molan for being so entertaining. ;) Really!

Frank.

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[quote name='chris_b' timestamp='1484306990' post='3214503']
[i]"However - We've never stocked BareFaced and [u]won't take them as PX either.[/u]" [/i]That's a strange business decision.

Both Bergantino and Barefaced are in the top echelon of bass cabs ever made. Whether someone likes them or not doesn't change that fact.

The reality is. . . you don't get "best in show" awards and reviews (as both these companies do) by not being one of the best.
[/quote]

It's not strange at all Chris, just basic integrity.

We won't stock anything that we don't believe has a basic level of quality and that we can stand behind. Our reputation rests on supplying decent quality goods that we know will perform well, won't break and won't deteriorate rapidly.

Too many customers with extremely bad experiences in terms of quality control and build for us to be able to sell them as a reputable dealer :(

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[quote name='machinehead' timestamp='1484343264' post='3214899']
I've followed this thread from day one and my admiration of the s**t-stirring abilities of molan just increases every time he posts. :) A perfect lesson in how to create a row - just brilliant!

Thank you molan for being so entertaining. ;) Really!

Frank.
[/quote]

I do my best Frank, thanks for the vote of confidence 😂

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[quote name='mildmanofrock' timestamp='1484343749' post='3214904']
Why does he leap on BF posts so quickly and regularly to denounce them? Has he got a personal gripe?
[/quote]

Now that would be telling.

Unfortunately I'm not allowed to be as open and honest as I'd like to be :(

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[quote name='molan' timestamp='1484351718' post='3214975']


It's not strange at all Chris, just basic integrity.

We won't stock anything that we don't believe has a basic level of quality and that we can stand behind. Our reputation rests on supplying decent quality goods that we know will perform well, won't break and won't deteriorate rapidly.

Too many customers with extremely bad experiences in terms of quality control and build for us to be able to sell them as a reputable dealer :(
[/quote]

I thought you stocked alleva coppolo??

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Gents, this thread seems to have turned into a massive bitchfest. As it stands, it's of no relevance to the OP whatsoever. So please, let's have some sensible discussion and advice without the playground tongue-poking or the near-defamatory slagging. Ok?

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[quote name='Rich' timestamp='1484393633' post='3215140']
Gents, this thread seems to have turned into a massive bitchfest. As it stands, it's of no relevance to the OP whatsoever. So please, let's have some sensible discussion and advice without the playground tongue-poking or the near-defamatory slagging. Ok?
[/quote]

A welcome and useful comment - most of the above has nothing to do with the OP.

Anyway, back to the OP's original question - i have a couple of Barefaced Big Baby 2's. They sound great, are very portable and i have had no issues with quality control on them.

At some stage i would like to try a Berg in a band situation. I find that most cabs sound ok at lower/home/practice volumes - its when you stick them in a band that you find out if they really work for you. The Barefaced trial period comes into its own then - as far as i know you can't send a Berg back if you don't get on with it.

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