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lowlandtrees

Loud Practices....really necessary

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"I have to be this loud to get my sound" is shorthand for I don't know how to get a good sound out of my gear any other way, and anyway the sound of the band as a whole doesn't matter to me.

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[quote name='chris_b' timestamp='1481127424' post='3189901']
"I have to be this loud to get my sound" is shorthand for I don't know how to get a good sound out of my gear any other way, and anyway the sound of the band as a whole doesn't matter to me.
[/quote]
And besides, people who subscribe to this mantra tend to have a sh1t sound whatever volume they are at.

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[quote name='stingrayPete1977' timestamp='1481109635' post='3189726']
I've never understood why rehearsal rooms tend to have bigger amps than most of us gig with!
[/quote]

I reckon they pick em up cheap from people who realise, too late, they are too big to gig with ;)

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[quote name='KevB' timestamp='1481131199' post='3189931']


I reckon they pick em up cheap from people who realise, too late, they are too big to gig with ;)
[/quote]
I think you are probably right, mind you there still plenty of people here that can't gig without heft from a valve amp and a 4x15 even in the tickled trout!

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Never, never, play loud on a reharsall and i don't alow for anybody to do it. I would leave the room if the volume gets too loud. In rehearsalls comunication is king and you need to be heard by everybody if you need to speak in the middle of a song to point something out. Everybody should hear everybody so they can spot mistakes and think about arangements. Playing loud for a period of time makes the musicians tired and they wont be ale to perform technicaly and creatively at heir best level. Protect your hearing at all costs, even if it means leaving the band.

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[quote name='stingrayPete1977' timestamp='1481109635' post='3189726']
I've never understood why rehearsal rooms tend to have bigger amps than most of us gig with![/quote]

Those same amps would also have a volume knob which can be used to [i]lower [/i]and well as increase volume. ;)

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I wonder if there's a guy, on a guitarists forum somewhere, moaning about the bass player playing too quietly?

Probably not.

Edited by gjones

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Wirebirds gee tar man Al has a 20 watt combo, plenty loud enough and we're not quiet. Harp man has a Fender Bassman combo and is unbelievably loud.

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[quote name='ROConnell' timestamp='1481107570' post='3189700']
As long as you're in a room with decent acoustics and hearing protection I don't see the problem with playing loud, it's amateurish if the whole band thinks turning up will solve everything, but if you're a group who all know where your instrument sits in the frequencies and you e.q right I don't see a problem with turning up and having a blast, if you take the time to set up properly you should be able to hear most clearly. This depends all on the room and what equipment you have available though.
[/quote]

This is just technically wrong. All hearing protection is frequency dependant, it filters some sounds more than others. Some aren't bad, but the ears work better without them.

High sound levels cause changes in our middle ear which reduce the energy passing to the inner ear to avoid permanent damage. That means you lose a lot of detail at high sound levels.

You might get by at rehearsals with ear protection or be able to cope with high levels but you simply won't hear as well as you would at lower levels.

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Hearing protection as a matter of course for me. We work off the drummer, he likes to hit with some energy, being a fairly heavy band. So we all bring our volume up to his acoustic drum kit, no problems at all. Difficult to go quieter, no reason to go any louder, after all; we're not going to mic up his kit and run it through the PA too!

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Forgot to say that I started wearing ear protection a few months ago. It seems that it is almost universal that rehearsal rooms have ludicrously massive equipment. Not only rediculously loud for the room but a waste of space....on the other hand it won t get nicked. Cheap n heavy. Even the PA is far too powerful. I have played in a few bands and the most enjoyable was where we practiced in a members flat where we could not be too loud and could hear each other. I do think that it is a lead guitarist thing in general.

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We've just found a brand new rehearsal space - decent sized room - played gigs in smaller spaces. Decent, well setup PA, decent drumkit, couple of nice 4x12 guitar cabs and a 4x12 Marshall cab. Even the mics were in great nick - SM57, lemon scented.

As it was a big space the volumes weren't low but not crushingly loud - drummer wan't leatherint it like normal and everyone could hear everything. Even the BV were clear.

It's going to confuse the feck out of us when we gig next as the sound's way too good!

Saying that, last gig we had guitar volume issues... his amp head couldn't keep up and kept cutting out!

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In defence of the rehearsal rooms: every day of the week they get the people through the door that this thread is about, so they have to protect their investment. If they put in anything smaller they know it'll get blown to pieces.

On the few occasions I've been to a rehearsal room the drummer has always bought his own kit because the studio kits are wrecked. That's the level of musicianship we're talking about. I was in Panic, West London one night and the bass player next door was so loud that we couldn't hear each other speaking in our room!

The problem isn't the half stacks and 810's it's the guys who don't understand that the volume control can go both ways.

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Guest Jecklin

[quote name='chris_b' timestamp='1481154791' post='3190182']
......one night and the bass player next door was so loud that we couldn't hear each other speaking in our room!
[/quote]

I've rehearsed in a situation like this.
A nice studio set up in south east London.
The band next door were so loud I could hear very little in my room.
This is through brick wall plus double sound insulation.
I'm rehearsing my solo set, which is quiet so thought i'd just have to put up with it.
The 4 piece band on the other side were the ones who brought in management and got the problem band to reduce their volume.

I can't conceieve of why anyone needs to play that loud.
Ever!


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Rehearsals for me are more about song structure confidence and making sure guitar and keys are covering whats required in the song etc volume is not required though in a small room it's often dictated by the drum kit

Edited by lojo

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Silly loud practices was the main reason I quit one band and I announced my quitting on another (but the guitarist accepted playing at lower volumes so I didn't have to go... and amazingly he stuck to it for 4 years!)...

It's nice to play with some volume, but there's not much point if it's causing ear fatigue and you can't hear everything everybody plays clearly.

"Diego", are you there? :lol: Those guys drove me crazy. The answer to playing like sh*t was play louder so that the wall of sound covers everything. Pity, as the singer/guitarist was decent and had some cool songs... but the other guitarist was clueless and he kept complaining he couldn't hear his guitar and kept turning louder. He used a very scooped kind of sound with lots of distortion and with the amp on the floor aiming at his knees... My suggestions about positioning the amp differently and dialling in some more mids were completely ignored... he was one of those guys that feel personally attacked if you dare suggest changing anything they do. It was only a month but...

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[quote name='mcnach' timestamp='1481189932' post='3190318']
"Diego", are you there? :lol: Those guys drove me crazy. The answer to playing like sh*t was play louder so that the wall of sound covers everything. Pity, as the singer/guitarist was decent and had some cool songs... but the other guitarist was clueless and he kept complaining he couldn't hear his guitar and kept turning louder. He used a very scooped kind of sound with lots of distortion and with the amp on the floor aiming at his knees... My suggestions about positioning the amp differently and dialling in some more mids were completely ignored... he was one of those guys that feel personally attacked if you dare suggest changing anything they do. It was only a month but...
[/quote]

+1 to this - I have spent far too much of my life explaining to moron guitarists how physics works and that the reason they cannot hear their guitar is not because their amp is too quiet but because they have set up too close to the speaker which is pointing at their ankles and the rest of us can all hear it just fine. Guitarist reluctantly moves five feet further away from his amp, concedes that he can hear his guitar now...next week sets up in the old spot and stands six inches away from his speaker...

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The only time I ever rehearse LOUD (gig volume) is with a new band right before we do the first gig. And we generally rent an actual venue.
Although on one occasion we borrowed a large grain silo (mostly empty, but enough in there to soak up the reverberation off tin walls) and had a deputation from the nearby village asking when we would be coming back and could we do it in the village hall next time please!
Rather gratifying, even if the band didn't last.

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At my first rehearsal after taking up bass again a few years ago I'm pretty sure I did some damage to my hearing - my tinnitus has certainly been worse since. Since then, if there's been an acoustic drum kit involved, and hence the volume to keep up with that, I have never played without ear plugs. The straw that broke the camel's back when I left my last band was the two guitarists and their 100 watt valve combos - so loud that I couldn't hear the drums properly despite being so close to the hi hat I was in danger of getting something caught in it...

Frustratingly the best actual sound I've experienced in a band was the second one I joined, where the drummer played an electronic kit. Nice low volume, and no need for earplugs. Pity we were sh*t !

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We're all playing to the drum volume of course - ie the guitar volume which has to be louder. I understand drummers who complain that electronic drums aren't tactile enough but hey how about modifying your technique?

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When we rehearse, the vocals are coming through one 1x15 active monitor and the drummer is using those sticky brushy things that didn't exist when I were a lad. Old small Laney combo for me and guitarist has my old 50watt Yamaha combo.

Any of us can stop a number at talking volume to comment on some issue. Thus, no ears bleeding, no ears ringing and we can gig at remarkably low volumes if need be.

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