Does my amp need pat testing?

[Twincam]

Never thought about this but do I need to get my te combo pat tested to take it to rehearsal rooms and such like?

[ead]

I'd say only if required by the person that owns the rooms. We had to have our whole set up tested to play in a hotel.

[colgraff]

No you don't. You only need to if a venue at which you are playing asks for your PAT certificate. I've only need to produce a certificate twice in 20+ years.

[bonzodog]

Also does not apply to gear less than 12 months old

[RockfordStone]

only time i ever needed to get my amp pat tested in 10 years was on BBC radio, and they did it there

[Huge Hands]

[quote name='colgraff' timestamp='1456995935' post='2994246']
No you don't. You only need to if a venue at which you are playing asks for your PAT certificate. I've only need to produce a certificate twice in 20+ years.
[/quote]

This^^

It is usually more prevalent at larger corporate facilities that have Engineering departments. Where I work (not a venue but we do use AV equipment) - the assumption is that any equipment being brought on site will be PAT tested, and that the supplier can produce a certificate on demand if required. Other institutions insist on seeing the certificates up front.

If you are regularly going to be doing function gigs at various corporate venues, then it might be worth getting it done. I doubt your local rehearsal studio would ask.

[PaulWarning]

we've only been asked twice in 10 years, first time we got all the gear tested and they never asked for the certificate when we got there, the last time we got some blank stickers and said we couldn't find the cert, they were happy with that, they only ask to dot the i's and t's for insurance purposes, just keep your gear in good nick, a visual inspection to make sure all the cables are clamped and there's no bare wires or broken plastic bits you should be fine

[skampino]

There is no specific requirement when PAT testing should be done but you will find most hotels and function rooms will require you to have a certificate even if equipment is brand new!
We had to get all our gear done for a function and be aware that includes power leads and extension leads!

Edited March 3, 2016 by skampino

[Simon.]

It's not a legal requirement to have PAT testing done, but for peace of mind, it's something worth thinking about. As others have said, some venues will demand it, others never question you about it.

Without scaremongering, one thing to potentially consider is that if something does go wrong and there is a fire or injury resulting from a faulty piece of kit, you can be sure that the insurance companies (on both sides) will want to know if the equipment involved had been maintained to a reasonable standard. Proof of a history of PAT Testing would help in this. Although, one of the problems with the test is that it is a 'point in time' assessment of the equipment. eg. On the day it was tested, it was OK, but if that was 4 months ago and you've done 35 shows, in 8 weeks, touring round Europe in the back of a Transit since then, the condition of the kit might no longer be as it was.

Part of the guidance for PAT testing puts some of the onus on the user to do a visual check each and every time they use the piece of equipment. Approximately 80% of faults are found visually - the damaged/exposed cables, broken casing that allows you get a finger inside, etc.

There are no hard and fast rules for PAT testing, you just need to apply some common sense. An Ampeg rig which is gigged heavily and in harsh conditions (touring, in and out of trucks, etc), should be checked and tested more frequently than an identical rig which sits in someone's house, never moves ('cause it too frickin' heavy!), and is only used one or twice a week.

[ColinB]

We were asked once for a PAT certificate before we could play in a very posh hotel in Henley.... and when we got to the hotel we were playing in the cellar bar and the state of the electrics in there was frightening (or shocking)! I couldn't resist saying (in a too loud voice) when the manager was nearby something about the irony of being asked for certification to play in such a dodgy looking place.

[PaulWarning]

[quote name='ColinB' timestamp='1457004603' post='2994349']
We were asked once for a PAT certificate before we could play in a very posh hotel in Henley.... and when we got to the hotel we were playing in the cellar bar and the state of the electrics in there was frightening (or shocking)! I couldn't resist saying (in a too loud voice) when the manager was nearby something about the irony of being asked for certification to play in such a dodgy looking place.
[/quote]someone once posted in a similar thread, "if they ask for your PAT certificate ask them for their mains test certificate" something like that anyway

[mingsta]

Echo'ing the above - you only need it if the venue requires it. Most don't bother.

We did about 20 gigs last year and the only one that required PAT certificates was the Orangery at Kew Gardens but its a listed building.

[BigRedX]

[quote name='Twincam' timestamp='1456993190' post='2994220']
Never thought about this but do I need to get my te combo pat tested to take it to rehearsal rooms and such like?
[/quote]

If you've seen the state of most of the gear in the average rehearsal room you wouldn't need to be asking this question! ;-)

[EmmettC]

If you have insurance for your band having a valid PAT test cert is usually required, they will probably never ask to see it unless you need to claim on your insurance.

[M@23]

We've been asked once, in hundreds of gigs. It was at an English Heritage site, probably one of the grandest houses in the country. The sockets are all under the floorboards, to keep them out of sight, only; having been recently refurbished, the workman had nailed the removable panels from the floorboards down. So we had to daisy chain extension leads from an outside power source in the belting rain. It wasn't too exposed, just, very frustrating given how fussy they were and given the list of rules we had to adhere to that something this simple wasn't checked.

Edited March 3, 2016 by M@23

[wateroftyne]

I've been asked once, so I bought some stickers off eBay. It's a joke.

[Number6]

I do PAT testing as part of my job as a Maintenance Electrician. I should set myself up a band related sideline

[Jakester]

PAT testing is only required on equipment provided by an employer to employees. It's part of the employer's duty of care to provide safe working equipment, but the actual testing is not legally mandated (but an accepted way of proving it is safe to use).

There is no legal requirement for anyone to PAT test equipment they use themselves or no requirement (beyond it being a condition of entry) to ensure gear you use at a gig has been PAT tested. However, you owe the venue owners a duty to ensure your gear is safe, and a PAT test is arguably a way to show you've done that.

[RockfordStone]

[quote name='Jakester' timestamp='1457023582' post='2994590']
PAT testing is only required on equipment provided by an employer to employees. It's part of the employer's duty of care to provide safe working equipment, but the actual testing is not legally mandated (but an accepted way of proving it is safe to use).

There is no legal requirement for anyone to PAT test equipment they use themselves or no requirement (beyond it being a condition of entry) to ensure gear you use at a gig has been PAT tested. However, you owe the venue owners a duty to ensure your gear is safe, and a PAT test is arguably a way to show you've done that.
[/quote]

thats what i thought, but didnt post it in case i looked like a tit

[Number6]

So if you use house equipment they should test it really.

[Roger2611]

Our covers band was told on a few occasions that we would need to have a PAT test certificate before we could play their venues, we decided to bite the bullet and get it done but of the places that demanded it none ever asked us to produce the certificate or even checked the gear on set up!

[sunburstjazz1967]

[quote name='wateroftyne' timestamp='1457013622' post='2994461']
I've been asked once, so I bought some stickers off eBay. It's a joke.
[/quote]

I've seen this before, its pointless and a bit stupid really and here is why, the sticker is purely for users of the kit to see visually that its in date it MUST be accompanied by an actual certificate giving the full details of the item including the earth type,the certificate MUST show the company name and contact details on it.

Ok that's the paperwork side of it who cares you ask? Well EVERY band who's kit I have tested at least one item was found and repaired, many of our mass produced amps and musical kit have metal casings and high voltage transformers inside, often the only protection from a fault is a small ring terminal crimped to a banjo washer or bolted to the chassis, the bolts vibrate loose as do the locking nuts just like the ones on bass control pots so the earth is lost, any voltage trying to leak to earth (which is normal to a certain level) goes straight up your instrument lead and to your earthed bridge and strings, enjoy your ebay stickers though :-)

As a minimum a continuity test from the earth pin of the plug top to the chassis of the amp is worth doing, then check every iec lead from earth to earth, my own band used to get some terrible hum it various venues,when I tested our own kit I found a lead with no earth present, this was the cause of the hum and really dangerous when used to feed a PA system, life threatening really regardless of need or legality.

Edited March 3, 2016 by sunburstjazz1967

[fretmeister]

EMGs (no ground needed) and a wireless then. Gotcha!

[wateroftyne]

[quote name='sunburstjazz1967' timestamp='1457031521' post='2994699']
I've seen this before, its pointless and a bit stupid really and here is why, the sticker is purely for users of the kit to see visually that its in date it MUST be accompanied by an actual certificate giving the full details of the item including the earth type,the certificate MUST show the company name and contact details on it.

Ok that's the paperwork side of it who cares you ask? Well EVERY band who's kit I have tested at least one item was found and repaired, many of our mass produced amps and musical kit have metal casings and high voltage transformers inside, often the only protection from a fault is a small ring terminal crimped to a banjo washer or bolted to the chassis, the bolts vibrate loose as do the locking nuts just like the ones on bass control pots so the earth is lost, any voltage trying to leak to earth (which is normal to a certain level) goes straight up your instrument lead and to your earthed bridge and strings, enjoy your ebay stickers though :-)

As a minimum a continuity test from the earth pin of the plug top to the chassis of the amp is worth doing, then check every iec lead from earth to earth, my own band used to get some terrible hum it various venues,when I tested our own kit I found a lead with no earth present, this was the cause of the hum and really dangerous when used to feed a PA system, life threatening really regardless of need or legality.
[/quote]

OK, I'll take the risk. I'd like to make an observation, though - IME the people who go on about the importance of PAT testing the most are the people who get paid to do the tests.

[EmmettC]

I assume everyone who is out gigging had public liability insurance, you get it free with MU membership, the insurance won't cover you if you're equipment isn't PAT tested. It's a big risk going out without insurance, there's such a large risk of someone getting injured because of your gear, particularly during get-outs.