Roasted vs Standard necks - Stability?

[martthebass]

Just coming from the Short Scale Bass appreciation thread and noticed some comments coming up regarding roasted necks and stability of roasted, caramelised and standard necks.  Rather than hijack that thread I thought a separate thread to discuss might be beneficial.

 

For myself I've got 2 basses with roasted necks (EBMM DarkRay and EBMM Shorty Ray), 1 bass with a graphite neck (Status CW-1) and one with a standard maple neck.  Of these the most stable is the Status (no surprise there), which was adjusted when I bought it over 4 years ago and never touched since, the next are the Sandberg and the DarkRay which I've tweaked twice in the last year and the worst is the shorty Ray which seems to move a little bit from month to month.  A small sample group but not seeing a major difference which makes me think there are a number of factors at play.... 

Edited 21 hours ago by martthebass

[LeftyJ]

I have no basses or guitars with roasted necks, but I do have 2 cents about Music Man necks moving: I had a Stingray 5 which was very susceptible to changes in humidity, and would move quite a bit with the change of the seasons, but it got a LOT more stable when I had the neck re-waxed by my favourite luthier. The Music Man necks are oiled / waxed rather than lacquered, which should seal the wood just the same against humidity, but unlike lacquer an oiled / waxed neck does require regular maintenance. 

[tubbybloke68]

My stingray neck needs adjustment quite often, it’s roasted (pretty sure anyway) . It’s one of the later ones, charcoal sparkle, yet my USA Sterling is very stable and a fair bit older. They’re both stored in the same room in the house too. X

[Geek99]

@tubbybloke68

”made in USA” equals “magic wood. “ ✨🦄

[Twigman]

My EBMM USA Sterling has a 'normal' oiled neck and never needs tweaking. I only ever need to adjust the tuning when I change the strings!

[Beedster]

I've had cheap necks that have been perfect and never needed a tweak, and expensive necks that were always slightly out. While of course quality materials and high standards of manufacture are protective, there's always going to be the odd bit of temperamental wood that gets through the process, and I guess it's possible that various treatments - roasted etc - might lower the risk os those that do being a complete PITA. But on the whole, if you keep your necks in fairLy consistent humidity and temperature, and don't change string tension or gauge too often, you really shouldn't have to touch your necks very often once set up.  

[martthebass]

19 minutes ago, Beedster said:

But on the whole, if you keep your necks in fairLy consistent humidity and temperature, and don't change string tension or gauge too often, you really shouldn't have to touch your necks very often once set up.  

I wish that was always the case Chris 😞

[Beedster]

1 minute ago, martthebass said:

I wish that was always the case Chris 😞

 

It's been my experience, perhaps I've either been lucky or have lower standards  

[neepheid]

Wood be woody.

[Sean]

My tip of the day is...

 

Keep the truss covers removed. I'm always adjusting truss rods, 1/8th of a turn here, tiny tweak there. 

[cocco]

I have two basses with roasted maple necks, a stingray special, and a parts P bass with a neck made by Shuker.

 

I've had the stingray for a couple of months, (it's a 2020 build) and the P bass since January (the neck was made this time last year).

 

The stingray needed a neck tweak when the seasons changed not so long ago, only about 1/4 turn, but the shuker neck hasn't budged at all. 

[tauzero]

45 minutes ago, Sean said:

My tip of the day is...

 

Keep the truss covers removed. I'm always adjusting truss rods, 1/8th of a turn here, tiny tweak there. 

 

Even easier, have headless basses with the truss rod adjuster exposed at the unheadstock end (Sei, Hohner).

[LawrenceH]

9 hours ago, LeftyJ said:

The Music Man necks are oiled / waxed rather than lacquered, which should seal the wood just the same against humidity, but unlike lacquer an oiled / waxed neck does require regular maintenance. 

 

Based on a sample size of one MM Stingray versus numerous lacquered Fenders, I think there's something in this. With the addition that oiled finishes are typically touted as 'breathable' whereas polyurethanes are far less so. The 'ray is lovely but it does drift with the seasons, the Fenders do not.

 

I also have a maple parquet floor that has been oiled and the pieces move loads with humidity. It's an inherently unstable timber

[Stub Mandrel]

I suspect it's got most to do with the individual properties of the bit if wood in question. Regardless of cut or roasting, wood is far more variable than carbon fibre.

 

Some basses need a half turn in winter and summer, some don't. 

[itu]

30 minutes ago, LawrenceH said:

I also have a maple parquet floor that has been oiled and the pieces move loads with humidity. It's an inherently unstable timber

A floor is one big unit. The comparison between a tiny neck and an acre of maple is not fair. A carpenter told me that any wooden floor moves, no matter if it's oiled, painted, or lacquered. It should float, or it can be attached from one side, but it moves a lot. 

 

I've had necks that need a tiny bit of adjusting in spring and autumn, like the original Affirma fretted 4, but not the fretless 5. My basses with carbon necks are stable round the year. 

[martthebass]

19 hours ago, LeftyJ said:

I have no basses or guitars with roasted necks, but I do have 2 cents about Music Man necks moving: I had a Stingray 5 which was very susceptible to changes in humidity, and would move quite a bit with the change of the seasons, but it got a LOT more stable when I had the neck re-waxed by my favourite luthier. The Music Man necks are oiled / waxed rather than lacquered, which should seal the wood just the same against humidity, but unlike lacquer an oiled / waxed neck does require regular maintenance. 

You may have something there.  My Sandberg is lacquered and the neck is pretty stable, more so than the 2 oil/waxed EBMM basses.

[HeadlessBassist]

Yes, obviously the graphite necks are the most stable and are usually 'fit it and forget it' spec where seasonal changes are concerned. I've never had any issues with my Status bass necks over the years.

 

I haven't seen any real difference in stability between roasted and natural maple. It seems to vary from bass to bass. My 30 year old natural ash/maple Stingray seems totally oblivious to seasonal change and just stays set up exactly as it always has been. Whereas my GB Spitfire does increase it's action by about 1mm when it gets cold, but otherwise it's super stable.

 

Maybe the one teller is the Cort Space 5, which has the roasted maple fingerboard on top of a 7-piece maple/walnut/purple heart neck. That thing lives in the boot of the car and never even needs tuning, whatever the weather outside, but that consistency seems to occur with most headless basses equipped with monorail tuners.

 

I definitely see a small movement on my natural ash/maple Fender Elite Jazz (with the posiflex rods in the neck) which does display a small rise in the action, but only around 1mm difference, whereas my American Original Jazz (with no graphite rods) never seems to change at all, but it did arrive brand new seven years ago with plenty of relief in the neck from the factory and I've never needed to change it.

 

I really don't know if it's down to the cut of the wood or the seasoning etc, but it may just be down to luck of the draw with maple necks in general.