Ruck Posted November 27, 2016 Share Posted November 27, 2016 Ive been asked by one of the members to try out for my favourite local band. They already have label, management, 2 albums, tours booked etc none of which I have ever achieved in band. Feeling a bit overwhelmed. No idea how to approach the legal side of things if I make the grade. What details should I look out for. Any suggestions/advice/jokes welcome! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JTUK Posted November 27, 2016 Share Posted November 27, 2016 Meet their management team.... or whoever leads them. Get detail of what their business model is really like. In this day and age of DIY, a lot of those things like albums etc don't mean a great deal. The first question I'd ask, is what is the earning potential p.a, to see how 'serious' a proposition it actually is. That is not to say it is not worth pursuing or doing, but unless there is an income stream, there isn't much of a business end to worry about, IMO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ruck Posted November 27, 2016 Author Share Posted November 27, 2016 Ha thanks yeah that pretty much sums it up JTUK, of course its going to ultimately be one of those "for the love of it" endeavours I guess. Small time band with a bit of backing. Still going to be a great deal of experience for me. I have no idea what it would be like juggling a whole load of gigs along side a day job! Ive gigged 3 nights of the weekend before plenty of times in function bands, but they're gigging all sides of the country on week days yet still somehow hold down their day jobs?! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigRedX Posted November 27, 2016 Share Posted November 27, 2016 If the band's management and label are actually any good, there won't be a lot for you to worry about since they should be doing all the day to day organisation of the band, leaving the musicians to get on with doing the the things they should be best at - namely writing and playing the music. However don't sign anything without getting it checked by a lawyer who specialises in the music business. Now would be a good time to join the Musician's Union since they can put you in touch with the right legal people and also offer a free contract check for members. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oggiesnr Posted November 27, 2016 Share Posted November 27, 2016 [quote name='BigRedX' timestamp='1480285175' post='3183141'] However don't sign anything without getting it checked by a lawyer who specialises in the music business. Now would be a good time to join the Musician's Union since they can put you in touch with the right legal people and also offer a free contract check for members. [/quote] This plus loads. Also if you contribute to writing songs that's a whole new ssue that also needs to be covered. Last point. How are you going to earn enough to live? What's actually on offer? Playing music is fine but it's the Music "Business". If the "Business" sucks then there's no music and no way to pay your bills. Be very careful. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blue Posted November 28, 2016 Share Posted November 28, 2016 Don't tell them you don't care about money. Blue Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SH73 Posted November 28, 2016 Share Posted November 28, 2016 Ask for £ 1 000 000 advanced payment Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Painy Posted November 28, 2016 Share Posted November 28, 2016 [quote name='SH73' timestamp='1480317486' post='3183227'] Ask for £ 1 000 000 advanced payment [/quote] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
interpol52 Posted November 28, 2016 Share Posted November 28, 2016 I would echo all that has been said about meeting the management and sussing out the practicalities. I know that sounds very dull but it will end up being the thing that makes or breaks your enjoyment in my experience. It depends on how old you are, responsibilities, family, etc too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
casapete Posted November 28, 2016 Share Posted November 28, 2016 Professional band, all with day jobs? Mmmm.......approach with caution. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JapanAxe Posted November 28, 2016 Share Posted November 28, 2016 I've posted this before, but here are my 4 key things to find out: [color=#282828][font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif]1. Corporate structure - Boss and employees? Partnership?[/font][/color] [color=#282828][font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif]2. Unique selling point (USP) - What differentiates the band from the competition?[/font][/color] [color=#282828][font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif]3. Cash turnover - The top line.[/font][/color] [color=#282828][font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif]4. [/font][/color][color=#282828][font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif]Business model - what's it about? Fun? Money? Self-esteem? [/font][/color] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigRedX Posted November 28, 2016 Share Posted November 28, 2016 [quote name='casapete' timestamp='1480321342' post='3183254'] Professional band, all with day jobs? Mmmm.......approach with caution. [/quote] IME only the very biggest names playing original music, or the songwriters in long running bands with a large back catalogue can get away with not having some other source of income during the times when the band isn't touring or recording. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpondonBassed Posted November 28, 2016 Share Posted November 28, 2016 It's very nice to have the opportunity to consider becoming professional. I can't offer any advice but I wish you every success. Also, I hope you have a great time doing it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MoonBassAlpha Posted November 28, 2016 Share Posted November 28, 2016 If you don't give it a really good shot, you'll always be asking yourself "what if...." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
casapete Posted November 28, 2016 Share Posted November 28, 2016 [quote name='BigRedX' timestamp='1480322682' post='3183269'] IME only the very biggest names playing original music, or the songwriters in long running bands with a large back catalogue can get away with not having some other source of income during the times when the band isn't touring or recording. [/quote] From my experience, working in a professional band whilst trying to work around all the member's various day careers / day jobs can be a nightmare, resulting in the inevitable conflicts of interest unless you are very fortunate. Maybe best if we define the term 'professional'? This can appear to mean 'relating or belonging to a profession', or alternatively 'engaged in a specific activity as one's main paid occupation rather than as an amateur', which is the definition that usually springs to my mind. And let's not get into figuring semi-pro.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Norm Posted November 28, 2016 Share Posted November 28, 2016 Your favourite local band? You already like/love the songs by the sound of it? Go for it. You'll have a blast. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skankdelvar Posted November 28, 2016 Share Posted November 28, 2016 Scrutinise everything, trust no one. Be friendly, be polite, be professional, but have a plan to kill everybody you meet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blue Posted November 28, 2016 Share Posted November 28, 2016 Don't forget to ask what the job pays, and how and when you get paid. Blue Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
taunton-hobbit Posted November 28, 2016 Share Posted November 28, 2016 'Professional' is often used to mean that they play for money (sometimes?) It's not the same as earning enough to live on......... I wish you luck, I hope this works for you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jazzyvee Posted November 29, 2016 Share Posted November 29, 2016 (edited) [quote name='taunton-hobbit' timestamp='1480367721' post='3183834'] 'Professional' is often used to mean that they play for money (sometimes?) It's not the same as earning enough to live on......... I wish you luck, I hope this works for you. [/quote] Yep, in the early 90's I was hired to play guitar in the band of a UK artiste who was doing well with a few albums released in the USA. The band had been touring there virtually 6 - 8 months per year. I did 3 months in the states with them when they released a new album and took a "unpaid" leave from my day job to do it. I knew the pay would be less than my day job but I wanted the experience so that was my driver. At the end of the tour the USA management company that represented the artiste and the band leader asked me to join the band properly. But they couldn't guarantee me even half of what my salary was at that time and made some good faith "promises" of getting me other work in the states with other touring foreign artistes they represented to make up my money. However I had a mortgage and a good career ahead of me to think about and as much as the romantic notion of being a professional musician was an attraction, practical considerations had to be taken. In the end I didn't take it, and few months after the tour the band had a massive number 1 hit record in the UK and opened for Sting on some dates then they split up. The artiste made some good money from it and is still working and living in the USA but the backing band didn't benefit financially from it at all and now are doing their own individual thing with different bands. I'd say if you can do it and it ticks the right boxes it's a great thing to experience! With the right band and right money I would do that again in a heartbeat but then I'm older, wiser and have less financial constraints now. "Blue" gives good advice, the money is important after all it is the Music Business. If the management get their sums right and you undercut yourself, guess who gets the extra. It is a good idea to join the MU and seek their advice. Edited November 29, 2016 by jazzyvee Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaulWarning Posted November 29, 2016 Share Posted November 29, 2016 (edited) our drummer used to play with a 'professional' band, i.e. they played originals gigs all over the country, he had to quit because he just couldn't keep getting to gigs at the other end of the country on weekdays, if you're a self employed plumber or something it's doable, but if you're got a 'proper' job I don't see how, and it doesn't sound like it will pay enough to support you if all the others have jobs, Another band I know have sold 5 - 6K of their latest album and haven't seen a bean, all the money goes on 'promotional expenses' according to the small record company anyway Edited November 29, 2016 by PaulWarning Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blue Posted November 29, 2016 Share Posted November 29, 2016 [quote name='PaulWarning' timestamp='1480412233' post='3184077'] our drummer used to play with a 'professional' band, i.e. they played originals gigs all over the country, he had to quit because he just couldn't keep getting to gigs at the other end of the country on weekdays, if you're a self employed plumber or something it's doable, but if you're got a 'proper' job I don't see how, and it doesn't sound like it will pay enough to support you if all the others have jobs, Another band I know have sold 5 - 6K of their latest album and haven't seen a bean, all the money goes on 'promotional expenses' according to the small record company anyway [/quote] I'd be a good candidate for a pro band. I'm not married,no girlfriend,my kids are adults and I don't have a day job. I can get up and leave anytime on short notice. Blue Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaulWarning Posted November 29, 2016 Share Posted November 29, 2016 [quote name='blue' timestamp='1480439901' post='3184429'] I'd be a good candidate for a pro band. I'm not married,no girlfriend,my kids are adults and I don't have a day job. I can get up and leave anytime on short notice. Blue [/quote]same here Blue, but I'm not sure I'd fancy driving a few hundred miles to play to 12 people and get back a 3am Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blue Posted November 29, 2016 Share Posted November 29, 2016 (edited) [quote name='PaulWarning' timestamp='1480444997' post='3184500'] same here Blue, but I'm not sure I'd fancy driving a few hundred miles to play to 12 people and get back a 3am [/quote] Depends on the pay, we have one gig that's a 2 hour drive, but we charge 1.5k Playing to 12 or 1,200 people makes little different to me. It use to. I think I've played to a 1200 people once in my life. Blue Edited November 30, 2016 by blue Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FinnDave Posted November 29, 2016 Share Posted November 29, 2016 [quote name='blue' timestamp='1480439901' post='3184429'] I'd be a good candidate for a pro band. I'm not married,no girlfriend,my kids are adults and I don't have a day job. I can get up and leave anytime on short notice. Blue [/quote] Same here (although I am married, she is very independent and supportive of what I do). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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