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Barefaced T'Vintage Review.

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[quote name='4000' post='690525' date='Dec 21 2009, 11:54 AM']...Maybe Alex should get Dave to build the cabs! :) ...[/quote]
... and get you to do the PR. :rolleyes: - job's a good'un :lol:

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[quote]What I don't like is when you are told you are wrong, or your bass is wrong, or your amp is wrong, (or the room is wrong!?) for not liking the cab by the maker. The science can be brought to the table, but if the prospective customer doesn't like it, you can't go telling them that they are wrong.[/quote]

I would agree with this. To assert that the customer must be doing something wrong and that's why you don't like the cabs is NOT cool (IMO). These comments may be made hastily, or in a genuine desire to be helpful, but it's a fine line between putting forward constructive advice on how a more desirable sound might be achieved based on one's experience, and telling the client/customer that if they don't like the product then they must be doing something wrong. Such comments [i]could [/i]be right, but could also be wrong - the rest of us just don't know. Unfortunately, what we end up seeing is a manufacturer that can come across (IMO) as quite condescending and blinkered when it comes to their own products.

FYI - I am genuinely interested in a 'Big One' and rate Alex's knowledge and desire to build something that he feels isn't met by the current market. I'm merely trying to convey what I've observed and feel about these things, given the comments already made... after all, this is a [i]discussion [/i]forum :)

Mark

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There has been hype....definitely. And that can lead to disappointment.

Fortunately Im not struggling with any back problems....and I do make sure I get help when lifting cabinets. Weight to me is more of an issue with the amp and bass. I usually borrow backline cabs, so 80% of the time Im not hauling stuff around.

I'm definitely on the school of thought that the ceramics still add something that neos cannot. Maybe thats ridiculous, but even store owners who test gear all day state the same thing.

I also think Talkbass is a massive hype machine. It annoys me. Most of those guys are happy with 4 ohm 2x12s for everything, but for me, thats sometimes not enough. I got into the frame of mind of 'one cab solutions', but so far only the HS410 is that one cab solution....or something bigger like the NV610.

We also must agree that some people here have totally different volume needs. Whats loud for one is quiet for another, (especially me, we play too loud, and to me I want to turn down, but I use ear protection so I dont have to worry).

I tested the Compact with my full band at a gig, (yes a gig not my house) and the lows were there, but it got lost completely once the band starting playing. Rock bands need totally different setups to funk or jazz. We had to switch back to the Ampeg 4x10 for the next band.

I appreciate the test, and it was light....but then again my HS410 weighs nothing with casters!

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[quote name='Ou7shined' post='690564' date='Dec 21 2009, 12:37 PM']... and get you to do the PR. :lol: - job's a good'un :lol:[/quote]
:) :rolleyes:

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[quote name='Musicman20' post='690568' date='Dec 21 2009, 12:39 PM']I'm definitely on the school of thought that the ceramics still add something that neos cannot. Maybe thats ridiculous, but even store owners who test gear all day state the same thing.




We also must agree that some people here have totally different volume needs. Whats loud for one is quiet for another, (especially me, we play too loud, and to me I want to turn down, but I use ear protection so I dont have to worry).

I tested the Compact with my full band at a gig, (yes a gig not my house) and the lows were there, but it got lost completely once the band starting playing. Rock bands need totally different setups to funk or jazz. We had to switch back to the Ampeg 4x10 for the next band.[/quote]

The neo thing may be true, but I haven't got the luxury of the option unfortunately!

I play in a rock band and it's plenty loud enough for me, but we're not a loud rock band (although our drummer would argue!). However I also used to use an Ampeg 4x10 in rehearsal and my Compact is much thicker and bigger sounding IME than that was, which just goes to show how people's experiences differ.

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[quote name='4000' post='690579' date='Dec 21 2009, 12:54 PM']I also used to use an Ampeg 4x10 in rehearsal and my Compact is much thicker and bigger sounding IME than that was, which just goes to show how people's experiences differ.[/quote]

+1 with my experience with the Big One. My Ampeg 410HLF has plenty of lows - but it just seems to smother everything with its sheer presence - to the detriment of clarity.

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I personally dont rate Ampeg massively anyway....maybe the older stuff. But, it definitely had miles more clarity and punch than the Compact, and it was 8 ohms with my friends SVT Pro 3.

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[quote name='Musicman20' post='690597' date='Dec 21 2009, 01:14 PM']....I personally dont rate Ampeg massively anyway....maybe the older stuff. But, it definitely had miles more clarity and punch than the Compact, and it was 8 ohms with my friends SVT Pro 3....[/quote]
As an ex-Ampeg owner, I don't rate them much either but my experience with Ampeg and the Compact has been the exact opposite! Funny that!

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[quote name='Musicman20' post='690597' date='Dec 21 2009, 01:14 PM']I personally dont rate Ampeg massively anyway....maybe the older stuff. But, it definitely had miles more clarity and punch than the Compact, and it was 8 ohms with my friends SVT Pro 3.[/quote]

Which again is the opposite of my experience, which just goes to show that people need to try gear themselves in context.

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I have to be honest and say I haven't noticed any "hype". I have noticed plenty of people happy with their BF cabs and recommending that they are given a bit of time to settle down but to my mind there has not been any excessive strength of feeling. They are just something new. We all got excited over Markbass a couple of years ago, it's natural when something new comes along.

The strongest views here seem to be from the people who claim to be "redressing the balance" by disagreeing with the BF users as fervently as possible. If you don't like BF cabs then fine, it doesn't really matter.

It all kicked off when the "nay" camp started expressing how refreshed and satisfied they felt at a negative BF report. Let's face it, surely that alone is enough to negate all "subjectivity" from the follow up posts? You can't go from shouting "Wooo hoooo, somebody doesn't like Bf!!!" to "Purely subjectively, in my experience etc. etc. etc." It doesn't really wash any more.

Of course, couple that with the fact that several members of the "nay" camp seem to be at the centre of pretty much every BC controversy makes me even more enamoured of Barefaced. And I have never seen or heard one. And I use combos. And have no money.

See, it's not the "for" camp that's persuasive, it's the negative propagandists shooting themselves in the foot.

But I have to confess to being biased here. Not necessarily in favour of Barefaced, but I will take the opposite stance to EBS Freak almost every time.

:rolleyes:

Summary part 2...

[i]Barefaced Fans[/i]...I like them.

[i]Others[/i]...Yeah, but I tested them and I didn't like them. God, stop hyping them up.

[i]Barefaced Fans[/i]...You didn't like them? Oh well, that's cool. You could give them a bit more time? No worries though, it's all subjective.

[i]Others[/i]...STOP IT! Stop trying to force Barefaced cabs down my throat. I can't stand any more hype!

[i]Barefaced Fans[/i]...Whoa! Chill out guys. I like mine, and I thought you would too. No big deal though. I know they have issues, but I am happy to compromise for the weight and tone.

[i]Others[/i].. La La La La I can't hear you! It's the HYPE...HYPE...HYPE...I can't hear my self think any more!!!!! I tried these cabs along side every other cab in the world and if Alex hasn't compared them in one million live situations against the largest Ampeg/Berg/Eden/EBS rig then he is a fool and he is going to hell!!

[i]Bareface Fans[/i]...Okay, I'm getting worried about you now. Can I get you anything? DO, YOU, NEED, YOUR, MEDS?

[i]Others[/i]...but...but......but......FINNBASS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

:)

Edited by paul h

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To be honest guys, it's that sort of incitement that is causing the problems round here. :)

Why can't we all just agree that everyone is different (especially when it comes to conveying what it is we perceive as our version sonic excellence) and be happy with it without getting personal?
Alex himself has released a statement saying that he values both positive and negative feedback and will draw on both to improve his future line of cabs.
You can't say fairer than that.

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people are to nice on this forum. If this was any other forum this thread would've got reallllll bad.

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[quote name='Ou7shined' post='690758' date='Dec 21 2009, 04:15 PM']To be honest guys, it's that sort of incitement that is causing the problems round here. :)[/quote]

Fair enough...but where were you for this...

[quote]Do you still want that spirit level for installing the tweeter?[/quote]

And this...

[quote]Probably wise. Damage limitation and all that.[/quote]

Or this...

[quote]With respect Phaedrus - there's so many guys do the polar opposite with regard to these cabs, it's almost refreshing to hear a dissenting voice.[/quote]

Or this...

[quote]Sorry, you obviously need it spelt out. At the Moffat bass bash there was a lot of discussion on finnbass about how the barefaced did not compare very well to the other cabs present. A lot of discussion. On Basschat, the same posters made hardly a mention. I find that odd. Why did the guys that were at Moffat feel unable to say on Basschat what they said on Finnbass? Perhaps it is because any posting off message on Bare Faced gets descended on by the white knights others have referred to? Perhaps that in itself is suppression of discussion.

I have seen one member in particular, who obviously does not rate Bare Faced, get a lot of personal abuse.[/quote]

This...

[quote]The cab IS "colouring your sound". Whatever that means.[/quote]???? (This one is just here for it's astounding double negative style contradiction.)

[quote]And I'll defend my right to think that Barefaced cabs don't live up to the hype. No probs there then.[/quote] THE HYPE!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[quote]Anyway, back on topic, we wouldn't want the thread closing demon to make a visit.[/quote]

[quote]My opinions are built on experience... unlike others around here.[/quote]

[quote]Some are willing to learn. Some already know it all.[/quote]

I know I'm being an arse now, but saying my post is a cause of the problems after you left all these slip by uncommented upon I feel is a bit unfair. What I tried to do is to inject some humour into the thread...possibly not very successfully. :rolleyes:

And a public apology to EBS Freak. I genuinely didn't mean to single you out...but hey, your posts are your posts! :lol:

So all meant light heartedly...but probably not the most diplomatic I've ever been.

Hey ho.

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[quote name='umph' post='690769' date='Dec 21 2009, 04:35 PM']people are to nice on this forum. If this was any other forum this thread would've got reallllll bad.[/quote]

+ 1 I completely agree! Probably a good thing.

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[quote name='cheddatom' post='690776' date='Dec 21 2009, 04:42 PM']Paul, I laughed out loud in my office when i'm supposed to be working, so nice one![/quote]

I'm at home, but my pop still looked at me funny! :)

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[quote name='paul h' post='690714' date='Dec 21 2009, 03:32 PM']Summary part 2...

[i]Barefaced Fans[/i]...I like them.

[i]Others[/i]...Yeah, but I tested them and I didn't like them. God, stop hyping them up.

[i]Barefaced Fans[/i]...You didn't like them? Oh well, that's cool. You could give them a bit more time? No worries though, it's all subjective.

[i]Others[/i]...STOP IT! Stop trying to force Barefaced cabs down my throat. I can't stand any more hype!

[i]Barefaced Fans[/i]...Whoa! Chill out guys. I like mine, and I thought you would too. No big deal though. I know they have issues, but I am happy to compromise for the weight and tone.

[i]Others[/i].. La La La La I can't hear you! It's the HYPE...HYPE...HYPE...I can't hear my self think any more!!!!! I tried these cabs along side every other cab in the world and if Alex hasn't compared them in one million live situations against the largest Ampeg/Berg/Eden/EBS rig then he is a fool and he is going to hell!!

[i]Bareface Fans[/i]...Okay, I'm getting worried about you now. Can I get you anything? DO, YOU, NEED, YOUR, MEDS?

[i]Others[/i]...but...but......but......FINNBASS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

:)[/quote]

Absolute genius!
We like this! lol

Si

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[quote name='paul h' post='690774' date='Dec 21 2009, 04:40 PM']???? (This one is just here for it's astounding double negative style contradiction.)[/quote]

You clearly have no idea what a double negative is.

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[quote name='Sibob' post='690788' date='Dec 21 2009, 04:58 PM']Absolute genius!
We like this! lol

Si[/quote]

+1

Nice work, Paul.

Now I've got to get back to hyping cabs by saying that I bought one and I rather like it. :)

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Hmmm thought this was dead buried

but I do wonder about some of the comments on here.

but here is a thing.

I've used loads of 15"s over the years and if you want one to cut through a mix... it isn't the best place to start, IME.
What they will do (15's )..typically very well..is put of a sound that can bolster the overall band sound and underpin..they aren't likely to come over the top though.
Put that against a LOUD gtr and drummer and what you'll likely get pretty quickly is a DIN..

To make 15's work GENERALLY..you need a drummer who can tune his kit, a gtr who sits of top with tasteful playing and keys who can duck and dive around the tune. Or just get the plec out and raze it.. :) :rolleyes:

IMV, you need a speaker config that doesn't end at 3-3.5k so if the speaker has above that, then fine, or if a horn can help out, great.

However, some 15's and some 12's with a horn leaves a huge hole to cover..
10 are better in that instance, IMV.

Getting back to the OP.. not a fan of the home-made look of some of the cabs..without any of the possible build-issues, so that is a compete non-starter to me.
If I were in the market for DIY, then I'd have a closer look at a BFM 10 cab..
But hey...I don't care, I am not playing them anyway.

If people are happy with their kit..then whatever comes their way, is down to them.

FWIW.. I DO think there is a certain hype on here. I don't blame BF for that. Anybody would want such an outlet and the sponsored forum helps in that regard.
Other can presumable do the same and put their money where their mouth is.. ???

Sooner or later though, hype or no hype.. things have to deliver, so if people are happy with that, then fine.

But it is a commercial product, at no cheap price, so people will say what they feel about them..that the business they are in.

Edited by JTUK

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