Would someone's extreme political views prevent you being in a band with them, or working with them?

[EliasMooseblaster]

12 minutes ago, BassTractor said:

I see the user manuals online that teach you how to deal with these people, and it's always about keeping the communication open and about asking them questions and about letting them talk until they understand something isn't quite right in what they say.
I've not seen that happen, and do feel I've not tried hard enough.

It's a horrible position to be in. On the one hand, it isn't your job alone to talk people down from these extreme positions; on the other hand, if none of us challenge it then it just gets validated elsewhere and the problem grows. Even if you can't see the change from your own efforts, maybe it's enough to help them plant the first seed of doubt that might germinate further in the future, if enough people encourage them to actually think about the rhetoric they're repeating.

[TimR]

4 minutes ago, Misdee said:

The bigger question is who gets to arbitrate which views are extreme? We live in a world full of extremities, and all too often the most powerful get to define their opponents as extremists as a way of undermining the truth. Besides which, are extreme views necessarily wrong? Your liberal views on certain subjects are considered extreme by a lot of people. It's all about context.

 

Beyond all of that though, the older I get the more reluctant I am to condemn people for what they believe. I've come to realise that we all believe all sorts of crap at one time or another, mainly as a way of getting through life's difficulties. People who believe in  the most unpalatable ideas are often the most vulnerable or most damaged in one way or another.

 

I draw the line at people who are being willfully ignorant of facts and move on from thoughts and the odd conversation to full on organising actions.

 

It's like the flat earthers, I now don't believe any of the actually think the world is flat, they're just grifters who make money from it and are on some kind of power trip.

[Wombat]

The flat earth society has member all round the globe!

[Mrbigstuff]

3 hours ago, paul_5 said:

I wouldn’t gig with someone with extreme political views, and more importantly I’d tell them why - you have to call it out so that they know it’s unacceptable, otherwise they’ll just carry on until they find someone who’s prepared to accept it and never question themselves.

Calling it out just gets the response of being woke. Abhorrent behaviour and values have been normalised and justified by far right influencers, backed by some of the richest people in the world.

1 hour ago, Skinnyman said:

Yeah, but I bet you feel just a little bit dirty though, don’t you?

My gf has one and I can tell you that anyone who has that little pride in themselves does not clean the car interior well 😂

[Downunderwonder]

So long as they aren't asking for me to correct their worldview I can work with them. I get you are more talking about the evangelical sharing kind of misfit though.

[AndyTravis]

I’ve no idea about my band members views on political, religious or gender issues.

 

Then again, they all seem to be a fairly educated, intelligent bunch.

 

So if they came out with something offensive to me - I’d have to ask if it was a difference of opinion or if they were loony Roundabout painters…

 

If someone is racist or bigoted - I call

them out and then remove them from my life.

 

So I’d either sack them from the band - or quit.

[Sean]

I wonder how many of the people here who have said that they'd just get on with it and play in the band, letting the other "-ist/-phobic" people have their opinions, tick any of the targets of "-ism/-phobia" boxes themselves?

 

I cannot imagine that if they were gay, black, trans, or whatever that they would tolerate those bigoted people. For example, if you were gay, there's absolutely no way you're going to tolerate being in a band with a couple of openly homophobic musicians. 

 

I've been really lucky through the years generally and in my current main band you know you're in safe hands with zero tolerance for any of the -ist nonsense. 

 

Edited 14 hours ago by Sean

[Mrbigstuff]

40 minutes ago, Sean said:

For example, if you were gay, there's absolutely no way you're going to tolerate being in a band with a couple of openly homophobic musicians. 

Yet sadly I’ve read anecdotes indicating for many years, across many industries, people did. 

[TimR]

Depends if it's a hobby band or your main source of income. 

 

Finding yourself on a tour as a paid side musician might have a different slant on it. You may not have to spend any free time with them, just rehearsals and performances, or you may have to spend hours on a bus with them. I guess in those circumstances you'd have to wait until you get other work, or just hope they don't attract any media attention.

 

Wasn't there a pretty famous bass player here who had an 'audience with' tour. He was given quite a bit of stick here for it's content and never posted again. 

 

 

 

Edited 13 hours ago by TimR

[Dan Dare]

1 hour ago, Downunderwonder said:

So long as they aren't asking for me to correct their worldview I can work with them. I get you are more talking about the evangelical sharing kind of misfit though.

 

This. If they are up to snuff musically and don't wish/try to convert others to their worldview, I could put up with it, provided they don't subscribe to any hate-fuelled stuff. So flat earthers would be OK, whilst those who shout at hotels wouldn't.

[casapete]

29 minutes ago, TimR said:

Depends if it's a hobby band or your main source of income. 

This is key for me.

 

If it’s a hobby band then I’d be very particular who I mix with.

 

If it’s my job, then my tolerance level of dreadful people has been / would have to be adjusted

somewhat, in order to put food on the table. This is only the same as working anywhere else,

large companies etc. Not ideal by a long shot, but an inevitable compromise nevertheless.

However, for me there are still lines that need to be drawn that I don’t cross. 

[Misdee]

 

There's  a certain conceit in those who want to decide on everyone's behalf what is acceptable and what isn't. (Guardian readers take note). I'd find it hard to spend a lot of time playing music with people who weren't able to tolerate my intolerance.

 

What I find more disturbing than anyone's supposedly extreme views is the assumption by many people that benevolence and being "open-minded" is synonymous with permissiveness, letting people say, do and act as they want uncontested. 

 

Extremism and "bigotry" is then defined as anyone who doesn't concur with certain groups of people in society's idea of themselves, or anything that challenges and questions those ideas. 

 

 

[Tdw]

If someone had extreme political views and talked about them alot then yes I probably would not want to spend time with them. This would apply equally to the  extreme left and the extreme right. If people had views very different to me but didn't go on about their politics all the time then I probably wouldn't really mind unless they were real arseholes ( and in my opinions most Alt right and social justice warriors are). I'd also be prepared to talk to them about politics in private (occasionally) as long as the conversation remained calm and civil. What I wouldn't do is storm off in a self righteous huff at the first mention of any opinion i didnt like.

[Deaklet]

I play professionally and I absolutely DO NOT want to hear about your personal beliefs. It is completely inappropriate. Don't even try it around me, or I will pack up my gear and storm off like Ritchie Blackmore. Time is money.

[Steve Browning]

5 hours ago, Misdee said:

 

There's  a certain conceit in those who want to decide on everyone's behalf what is acceptable and what isn't. (Guardian readers take note). I'd find it hard to spend a lot of time playing music with people who weren't able to tolerate my intolerance. 

 

 

So you'd walk over your intolerance towards their intolerance of your intolerance?

[Leonard Smalls]

I've found over the years that the more creative an artist is, the less likely they are to be far right so luckily, I haven't often come up against many fascist type musos, especially if they're any good.

However, they may be a touch lefty, but as my position on Political Compass is on the libertarian left of Tony Benn and Gandhi I'm relatively OK with that (unless they get too SWP!).

[neepheid]

In a nutshell - don't be a d!ck.  If you think hotels with people in them should be set on fire, you're being a d!ck. If you think ill of people just because they're from somewhere else, you're being a d!ck.  If you're one of those "keep Britain British" types, you're being a d!ck.

 

It's pretty simple really. Gonnae no?

[gjones]

I rarely talk about politics with my bandmates. I certainly don't bring up the topic of politics with them. 

 

I've had sneaking suspicions about some ex bandmates world views but never investigated further - because I didn't want their political views to have an effect on the musical relationship I had with them.

 

If I did find out they had views that were VERY extreme, I might think twice about playing in a band with them.

Edited 3 hours ago by gjones

[Misdee]

Is musicians shouting abuse at asylum hotels a thing nowadays? Is it a problem many of you are actually encountering? I expect not. But at least now we know that you're against that kind of thing.

 

Were I a recently-arrived Albanian or Afghan youth anxious to be granted Leave To Remain just knowing that the amateur bass players of Britain were,by and large, on my side would,no doubt, be a source of great comfort. Maybe someone on Basschat could come up with a funky little ditty, preferably without any slapping in it though,(too aggressive, might trigger PTSD ect) we could  somehow send to these poor souls. They could listen to it to drown out the sound of the lynch mob outside.

[Crusoe]

15 hours ago, ped said:

Someone in my band has a Nissan Juke and I’m perfectly ok playing with him

That's just beyond the pale! Does his wife drive it to do the school run?

[Crusoe]

10 hours ago, TimR said:

Depends if it's a hobby band or your main source of income. 

 

Finding yourself on a tour as a paid side musician might have a different slant on it. You may not have to spend any free time with them, just rehearsals and performances, or you may have to spend hours on a bus with them. I guess in those circumstances you'd have to wait until you get other work, or just hope they don't attract any media attention.

 

Wasn't there a pretty famous bass player here who had an 'audience with' tour. He was given quite a bit of stick here for it's content and never posted again. 

 

 

 

Gene Simmons was a member on here!? 🤯

[cetera]

8 minutes ago, Misdee said:

Is musicians shouting abuse at asylum hotels a thing nowadays? Is it a problem many of you are actually encountering? I expect not. But at least now we know that you're against that kind of thing.

 

Were I a recently-arrived Albanian or Afghan youth anxious to be granted Leave To Remain just knowing that the amateur bass players of Britain were,by and large, on my side would,no doubt, be a source of great comfort. Maybe someone on Basschat could come up with a funky little ditty, preferably without any slapping in it though,(too aggressive, might trigger PTSD ect) we could  somehow send to these poor souls. They could listen to it to drown out the sound of the lynch mob outside.

 

Not sure what, if anything, this post is trying to contribute apart from sarcasm?

[Bassybert]

3 minutes ago, Crusoe said:

Gene Simmons was a member on here!? 🤯

If he was, it would only have been because he was trying to sell something 😂

[Boodang]

I'm not a professional, so for me it's as much about the social side as the playing. Consequently it has to be a comfortable environment to relax in. And that's not just extreme views or prejudices, but also something more mainstream if it was too preachy. An interesting debate where there are differing views is one thing but if it was constant it would take the fun out of playing. 

[Misdee]

6 minutes ago, cetera said:

 

Not sure what, if anything, this post is trying to contribute apart from sarcasm?

The point is that certain issues have a profile in certain people's imagination that is disproportionate to their actual incidence.