Are you a muppet?

[uk_lefty]

I don't think anyone is getting ripped off here. Unless there's a BC kids TV show starting featuring all of these puppets...

[nige1968]

Can't get this out of my head now. Thanks everyone.

 

 

[Rich]

Me...

 

...and my Band Of Muppets

Edited 6 hours ago by Rich

[Pseudonym]

30 minutes ago, Rich said:

 

You're in a band with Elton John? Well played.

[ezbass]

36 minutes ago, Rich said:

Me...

 

 

4 strings, 4 tuners and 4 capstans? This cannot be AI. 

[Beedster]

Yep, you're all muppets for sure 

[Beedster]

On 29/04/2025 at 10:08, Kev said:

Sincerely hope none of the members crying IP Theft have ever bought a cheap bass copy before  

So @Kev, you're a moderator yes? Just checking

[Kev]

42 minutes ago, Beedster said:

So @Kev, you're a moderator yes? Just checking

Last time I checked, forever appreciated

 

Just on the topic of my little joke that I presume you didn't chuckle at, it does still open an interesting debate as to why it is OK to accept an individual deliberately copying another person's/company's work for a profit without license, but a computer doing it anonymously for free is somehow abhorrent?  (presumably it is free and people aren't paying to do this, I haven't tried making a muppet me, as indeed I am already too much of one as it is) 

[Buddster]

9 minutes ago, Kev said:

Presumably it is free and people aren't paying to do this

Depends, subscription to Chatgpt is paid, or it's free for a limited number of pictures 

[Beedster]

3 minutes ago, Kev said:

Last time I checked, forever appreciated

 

Just on the topic of my little joke that I presume you didn't chuckle at, it does still open an interesting debate as to why it is OK to accept an individual deliberately copying another person's/company's work for a profit without license, but a computer doing it anonymously for free is somehow abhorrent?  (presumably it is free and people aren't paying to do this, I haven't tried making a muppet me, as indeed I am already too much of one as it is) 

 

Kev, thanks. Yes it does open up a debate, and one that could have happened here in this thread, because two well respected members highlighted IP and ecological factors, and I'd have hoped that the community response, as well as the moderating response, would have considered whether, as a online community, we should think more carefully about responsible use of the web. Absolutely we've probably all been on the wrong side of both debates at some point, but given we're currently sleepwalking into potentially catastrophic I/P and ecological crises - which effects us all as musicians and probably beyond (AI has already had a pretty disastrous impact on my field) - it would have been lovely to see support for those members who voiced concerns 👍   

[wateroftyne]

My God, I hate AI with a firey passion.

[Beedster]

5 minutes ago, wateroftyne said:

My God, I hate AI with a firey passion.

Likewise Michael, it’s undermining quality and creativity in so many professions at present, not just the arts, we should be pushing back at every opportunity 👍

[binky_bass]

This might all be well and fun, and perceived as innocent, but it is the start of a slippery slope. I personally believe that people that use these AI services that blatantly, and with no apology, rip off IP from multiple trademarked platforms, have absolutely no right to complain when their IP, job, industry they work in etc. becomes impacted by this form of AI. What this AI is doing, and by virtue what people using it are doing is theft, it's that straight forward. 

 

AI in the not-so-intelligent form that it exists in, and is being used in, today is not a positive thing. 

 

In my humble opinion, something as blatant and obvious as this shouldn't be infecting this forum and I suspect it probably could leave BassChat open to legal ramifications. 

[stewblack]

43 minutes ago, binky_bass said:

it is the start of a slippery slope

Not going to join the debate other than to say I feel we've passed that point and are already in free fall.

It's just too damn exciting to computer people and to much fun for punters.

 

[PainInTheBass]

People need to calm down and read up on fair use. Also see the following advice from Gemini. I'm not a lawyer so take from this what you will. And if Disney issue a takedown notice, just comply.

 

Recommendations:

 * Make it Distinctive: To minimize risk, try to make your character and its style significantly different from existing Muppets. Avoid directly copying recognizable features.

 * Avoid Using the Term "Muppet": Don't explicitly call your creation a "Muppet" or use the Muppets trademark in your description.

 * Clearly State It's Fan-Created: If your image could be interpreted as being officially related to the Muppets, explicitly state that it is fan-created and not affiliated with Disney.

 * Be Prepared for a Takedown Request: Even if you believe your use is fair, Disney could still send a takedown request to the forum. You would then need to decide whether to comply or challenge it (which can have legal implications).

In conclusion, while the risk of legal action for a non-profit, original image on a small forum is likely low, technically it could still be considered copyright infringement if it draws too heavily on the established Muppet style. Creating a distinctly different character and avoiding the use of the "Muppet" trademark will help to minimize any potential issues.

[Downunderwonder]

^ An AI telling you how to avoid being confused with a Muppet.

[PainInTheBass]

Beautiful isn't it?

[Burns-bass]

1 hour ago, PainInTheBass said:

People need to calm down and read up on fair use. Also see the following advice from Gemini. I'm not a lawyer so take from this what you will. And if Disney issue a takedown notice, just comply.

 

Recommendations:

 * Make it Distinctive: To minimize risk, try to make your character and its style significantly different from existing Muppets. Avoid directly copying recognizable features.

 * Avoid Using the Term "Muppet": Don't explicitly call your creation a "Muppet" or use the Muppets trademark in your description.

 * Clearly State It's Fan-Created: If your image could be interpreted as being officially related to the Muppets, explicitly state that it is fan-created and not affiliated with Disney.

 * Be Prepared for a Takedown Request: Even if you believe your use is fair, Disney could still send a takedown request to the forum. You would then need to decide whether to comply or challenge it (which can have legal implications).

In conclusion, while the risk of legal action for a non-profit, original image on a small forum is likely low, technically it could still be considered copyright infringement if it draws too heavily on the established Muppet style. Creating a distinctly different character and avoiding the use of the "Muppet" trademark will help to minimize any potential issues.

Your focusing on the practical protection for doing this rather then the principle here.

 

Tech companies (billionaires) are using media and content that has been provided for free on the internet to train its models and effectively replace humans in the generation of creative endeavours. And charge us to do so.

 

It may not mean much to you, but for lots of people AI will be an existential threat. In my industry it already is.

 

This stuff is funny, but it normalises what is effectively theft. 
 

16,000 artists against it here: https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2024/jan/21/we-need-to-come-together-british-artists-team-up-to-fight-ai-image-generating-software

 

1,000 here: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cwyd3r62kp5o.amp

 

More here: https://www.theartnewspaper.com/2024/10/24/artists-statement-opposing-artificial-intelligence-content-scraping

 

People against machines aren’t luddites looking to stop progress. AI (in its current forms) isn’t progress. It’s derivative rubbish.

 

[PainInTheBass]

A couple of bass players having a laugh generating some Muppet style images for no commercial gain is one thing, but the wider principle where livelihoods are threatened, yes I understand and agree with the sentiment. AI is here to stay and controls are needed because right now it's the wild west out there. Used improperly it will cause harm. But the Muppets in this thread have lifted my spirits and made me laugh. Not a bad thing IMO.

 

As for those posts normalising theft, that's a bit harsh isn't it? With that rationale you might as well say that covers bands or tribute acts shouldn't charge for their performances.

Edited 22 minutes ago by PainInTheBass