Nut widths - anyone notices this?

[Wolverinebass]

I appreciate that this might a fashion thing, but has anyone else how the default nut width of manufacturers of 4 string basses has got thinner over the last few years? I also appreciate that it's personal preference and that folk will say that you should be able to play any bass regardless, but certainly for me at least that's not true. 

 

Most manufacturers are going for 40mm. For example, I bought a 2nd hand Schecter Raiden a few years ago. Advertised as 42.5mm. Lies!! It's 40 and I find it a bit uncomfortable even though it sounds monstrous. So, discount Precisions, sterling ray 34s, Rickenbacker, Status (when they were still open) and what you have left? Not much from the new market if you discount custom instruments.

 

Has anyone else noticed this? I appreciate if this is what is going to sell, then I may be behind the times. However, it's disappointing in some ways. Especially when Musicman slimmed the stingray neck back down a year ago. 

 

I was wondering if anyone else had noticed this.

[Doctor J]

Give me 38mm or give me death!

[BigRedX]

Nut width is a bit of a red herring, because it gives little indication of how close together the strings actually are at the nut. I discovered this in a major way in my quest for a playable Bass VI, where several instruments with what looked on paper like suitably wide nuts, actually had the two E-strings set in quite a way from the edges of the fingerboard.

 

IME if these things matter to you then you really need the following measurements before making any decisions:

1. The width of the neck at the nut

2. The string spacing at the nut

3. The width of the neck at the last fret along with what fret number that is

4. The string spacing at the bridge

5. The scale length

 

Because in reality there is no set distance between the edge of the neck and the outermost strings and this distance isn't even constant along the whole length of the neck. And close string spacing at the nut does not automatically lead to close string spacing at the bridge as well.

[mario_buoninfante]

On 10/10/2022 at 18:00, Wolverinebass said:

Most manufacturers are going for 40mm. For example, I bought a 2nd hand Schecter Raiden a few years ago. Advertised as 42.5mm. Lies!! It's 40 and I find it a bit uncomfortable even though it sounds monstrous. So, discount Precisions, sterling ray 34s, Rickenbacker, Status (when they were still open) and what you have left? Not much from the new market if you discount custom instruments.

you also have G&L and Spector

 

[PaulThePlug]

String Spacing at Nut...

Presume is std string centre to centre ala non width adjust bridge saddles Custom could be cut equi-distance between string edges of say 45-105?

 

The distance from fretboard edge? same gap or same string center...

 

40mm nut... 5mm 10mm 10mm 10mm 5mm?

 

Could make a bit of difference nut end, way more than bridge end

 

Edited November 10, 2022 by PaulThePlug

[hiram.k.hackenbacker]

On 10/10/2022 at 19:35, BigRedX said:

Nut width is a bit of a red herring....

Hardly a red herring. If the width of the neck is too wide anyway for you personally at the nut, it doesn't matter what the string spacing is.

The widest 4 string at the nut I've owned was 45.4mm. Due to issues with my fretting hand, it became less and less viable to play, so had to go.

 

[Martin E]

Interesting. Nothing worse for me than strings right on the edge of the fingerboard. I think  the gap to the edge should be the same for the E and G strings measured from edge of the string. Having set that the centres of the strings should then be used to space out the strings in relation to each other.

[Wolverinebass]

1 hour ago, mario_buoninfante said:

you also have G&L and Spector

 

I think you'll find that Spector are 40mm and G&L's standard nut width is 38mm. Admittedly you can use options on the neck profile though I've no idea what they might cost.

[mario_buoninfante]

If I'm not mistaking, most of the Spectors (almost all Euros, with the Dug Wimbish signature being the exception I believe) are >40mm.

and G&L L1000/L2000/LB100 Tribute and Fullerton made have either 1 5/8" (41.275 mm) or 1 3/4" (44.45 mm) necks.

The G&L Kiloton series have 1.5" (38.1 mm) necks and the Spector Legend/Pulse/Ethos series have 1.57" (39.878 mm) necks though.

[Woodinblack]

I don't think it has changed over the years, just some basses have stupidly wide nuts and some don't, but the nut spacing on my old ibanez is the same as the ones on the newer ones, ditto the spector.

[T-Bay]

I am amazed how much difference the small change makes. 38mm Jazz neck feels beautiful and perfect, 41mm precision neck feels like something I should use at the Oval.

[fretmeister]

The Stingray neck actually got a little wider at the nut with the specials!

I thought the lightweight new models would be perfect for me... but the neck is now too wide for my comfort.

[Munurmunuh]

12 hours ago, Wolverinebass said:

I think you'll find that G&L's standard nut width is 38mm. Admittedly you can use options on the neck profile though I've no idea what they might cost.

 

I've ordered 3 G+Ls: all had 1⅝" as standard; one of them I paid extra to have it 1½". 

 

The JB is 1½" and that can't be altered. 

[BigRedX]

11 hours ago, hiram.k.hackenbacker said:

Hardly a red herring. If the width of the neck is too wide anyway for you personally at the nut, it doesn't matter what the string spacing is.

The widest 4 string at the nut I've owned was 45.4mm. Due to issues with my fretting hand, it became less and less viable to play, so had to go.

 

But in my case it was. 

 

What I wanted was a Bass VI with comfortable (for me) string spacing at both the nut and the bridge. However as I discovered the width of the neck at the nut has little bearing on the distance between the two E strings. My Squier Bass VI which started this whole quest off has a narrow nut at 40mm and 35mm between the two E strings. This string spacing was far too close for me (it was even closer than my guitars) so I started looking at Bass VI alternatives with wider necks. I soon discovered that a wider neck didn't automatically mean a proportionally wider string spacing. It seemed to me that the wider the neck got on most Bass VI type instruments the further from the neck edges the E strings were, so adding another 3-4mm to the nut width would only result in the overall string spacing increasing by only 2-2.5mm. 

 

Also having owned a lot of very different bass guitars over the past 40 years, I can say while on P and J style basses there may well be a direct correlation between the nut width and string spacing at the nut, once you step away from these designs pretty much anything goes. Also there is no direct correlation between nut and bridge string spacing. Of all the basses I have owned, the one with the widest string spacing at the bridge also had the narrowest string spacing at the nut. That why IMO all those measurements are important, because they tell you what the actual relationships are between the strings and edges of the neck rather than simply making assumptions which based on my experience may well turn out to be wrong. 

[leschirons]

Strange. Never once have I ever considered the nut width of a bass or thought that it may present a problem for me. I have a Jazz, a P bass, a Status, and a Maruszczyk. The Fenders being 4 stringers and the others being 5s. The only considerations for me are the scale length and the neck shape as to whether a bass is comfortable to play. No offence to anyone as I'm now genuinely interested in this subject but is there a possibility that this becomes an issue  because people think it may be, or should be, an issue?

My arthritis has dictated that I don't play 6 string basses anymore but that's a whole neck width problem. 

 

I suppose the other possible answer is that I'm just too daft and amateurish to have noticed any differences🤣

[LukeFRC]

22 hours ago, leschirons said:

Strange. Never once have I ever considered the nut width of a bass or thought that it may present a problem for me. I have a Jazz, a P bass, a Status, and a Maruszczyk. The Fenders being 4 stringers and the others being 5s. The only considerations for me are the scale length and the neck shape as to whether a bass is comfortable to play. No offence to anyone as I'm now genuinely interested in this subject but is there a possibility that this becomes an issue  because people think it may be, or should be, an issue?

My arthritis has dictated that I don't play 6 string basses anymore but that's a whole neck width problem. 

 

I suppose the other possible answer is that I'm just too daft and amateurish to have noticed any differences🤣

There’s a difference in feel between a 44.5mm P bass and a 38mm J bass, they way you play has to change slightly.

my hands are not massive and when I had a vintage spec 44.5mm I found I wasn’t as comfortable as on something 41mm-ish - so when I got a Bravewood p bass I asked for a 41mm neck as it fits my hands better.

oddly enough I don’t seem to have a problem with a 45-46mm 5 string nut 

 

I have a jazz with a 36mm I think which is super thin and I find easy to play - but it’s not too deep a neck - give me a narrow nut but deep front to back and I’ll struggle ergonomically again. 

[Woodinblack]

22 hours ago, leschirons said:

SThe only considerations for me are the scale length and the neck shape as to whether a bass is comfortable to play. No offence to anyone as I'm now genuinely interested in this subject but is there a possibility that this becomes an issue  because people think it may be, or should be, an issue?

 

So what convinces you that other peoples concern over the nut width is in their heads, but your concern over neck shape or scale length isn't?

[mario_buoninfante]

At the end of the day, I think it's all subjective. I suppose it's impossible to say this thing here makes it easier to play, this one makes it harder to play.
There are so many factors to account for, the most important of which is the musician (and not only the size of their hands).
On the bass side of things there are several parameters too:

• nut width
• width at the bridge
• neck finishing
• neck depth
• neck shape
• string used (steel roundwound are way rougher than flatwound, nickel sits in the middle, tape are "floppier", etc.
• scale length
• how the bass sits when standing up/sitting down

All these might have a totally different impact on different people.

There might be trends, but in general human beings are unique and so it's their "taste".

Edited November 16, 2022 by mario_buoninfante

[Geek99]

On 11/11/2022 at 08:46, T-Bay said:

I am amazed how much difference the small change makes. 38mm Jazz neck feels beautiful and perfect, 41mm precision neck feels like something I should use at the Oval.

I find the opposite as I just play what’s in my hand even If I need to adjust slightly- not saying you’re wrong btw 

[Henrythe8]

1 hour ago, mario_buoninfante said:

At the end of the day, I think it's all subjective. I suppose it's impossible to say this thing here makes it easier to play, this one makes it harder to play.
There are so many factors to account for, the most important of which is the musician (and not only the size of their hands).
On the bass side of things there are several parameters too:

• nut width
• width at the bridge
• neck finishing
• neck depth
• neck shape
• string used (steel roundwound are way rougher than flatwound, nickel sits in the middle, tape are "floppier", etc.
• scale length
• how the bass sits when standing up/sitting down

All these might have a totally different impact on different people.

There might be trends, but in general human beings are unique and so it's their "taste".

True. 

Now, the "standard" nut width is 38,5mm/1,5", which is the Jazz Bass. It represents over 80% of the sales and is favoured by over 75% of the players. At the time it was labelled as the A neck with Fender. 

I'm in favor of the Vintage Precision 44mm (1,75") that was the C neck at the time. (note that at the time, again, the letter was regarding the nut width and not the shape). But there is very few basses with this nut width. (Warwick Dolphin, Buzzard and Stryker NT have it by default). 

 

The modern other manufacturers (Spector being one of those) has a standard of 40mm. Some like chunky "U" neck (over 22mm neck thickness on first fret). Some prefer flat neck, or round, or Oval... 

I think that today it's more difficult to be sure of what you like. When I was younger, I had access to four musical instruments store in my midtown in France. So I could try a lot of different basses and shapes. 
Today people often rely on advices on internet which is by definition flawed as my advice for the best bass neck for me will be agreed on by a mere 5% of players (44mm, "oval with soulder" shape and 20mm thin.)

 

The aim for the manufacturers is to sell instruments that fit the most players. hence the decreasing median nut width, I guess. 

[T-Bay]

1 hour ago, Geek99 said:

I find the opposite as I just play what’s in my hand even If I need to adjust slightly- not saying you’re wrong btw 

I wonder if it’s what you get used to. For years I played slim necks, whether Jazz, Thunderbird, Aria Pro. When I tried a Precision it just felt all sorts of wrong. I am sure I would get used to it in time but can’t be bothered. I am pretty settled in what I play and apart from a special Jazz for my 50th, I can’t remember the last Bass I bought.

[mario_buoninfante]

16 minutes ago, Henrythe8 said:

The modern other manufacturers (Spector being one of those) has a standard of 40mm.

I think Euro and US made have all thicker necks, apart from the Dug Wimbish signature one

[mario_buoninfante]

18 minutes ago, Henrythe8 said:

True. 

Now, the "standard" nut width is 38,5mm/1,5", which is the Jazz Bass. It represents over 80% of the sales and is favoured by over 75% of the players. At the time it was labelled as the A neck with Fender. 

I'm in favor of the Vintage Precision 44mm (1,75") that was the C neck at the time. (note that at the time, again, the letter was regarding the nut width and not the shape). But there is very few basses with this nut width. (Warwick Dolphin, Buzzard and Stryker NT have it by default). 

 

The modern other manufacturers (Spector being one of those) has a standard of 40mm. Some like chunky "U" neck (over 22mm neck thickness on first fret). Some prefer flat neck, or round, or Oval... 

I think that today it's more difficult to be sure of what you like. When I was younger, I had access to four musical instruments store in my midtown in France. So I could try a lot of different basses and shapes. 
Today people often rely on advices on internet which is by definition flawed as my advice for the best bass neck for me will be agreed on by a mere 5% of players (44mm, "oval with soulder" shape and 20mm thin.)

 

The aim for the manufacturers is to sell instruments that fit the most players. hence the decreasing median nut width, I guess. 

 

Also found this that, despite being 1 data point, suggests that Precisions are the most sold basses, followed by other basses with "thick" necks.

https://www.notreble.com/buzz/2022/11/10/reverb-releases-list-of-best-selling-basses-of-2022/

 

[leschirons]

6 hours ago, Woodinblack said:

 

So what convinces you that other peoples concern over the nut width is in their heads, but your concern over neck shape or scale length isn't?

I'm not convinced about anything. Hence, I asked the question, "is there a possibility?........

[Ralf1e]

On 16/11/2022 at 11:28, Geek99 said:

I find the opposite as I just play what’s in my hand even If I need to adjust slightly- not saying you’re wrong btw 

I can relate to that. I just had a run around with calipers this morning measuring bass necks and overall string widths just below the nut.

The narrowest was Classic Vibe 70's Squier Jazz bought recently at 38.5 neck width and a 31.08 string width

The widest 4 string was my Aria SB900 which surprised me with 45.25 neck width and a 36.89 string width. Not that far from my 5 string G&L  L2000 Legacy @ 45.6 and 38.87

I never even think about neck widths. I just spread my hands out a bit more. I suspect my playing is not as refined as most on here 😀

Edited November 17, 2022 by Ralf1e
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