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So who pays for the damage?


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Long storey short...guys buys a car from me, his mate has a WAL, it's not insured, two beered up idiots get hold of WAL in the break, fight over who should play it, bass gets dropped, damages the head.....ugly scene.

...so WAL not insured, the owner is now trying to take the bar owner to court over negligence....hmm...tough one.

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[quote name='neepheid' timestamp='1370804079' post='2105812']
Surely it's the fault of the idiots concerned? Where has personal responsibility gone?
[/quote]
Yup, presumably the Wal owner can't trace them and doesn't want to / can't afford the repair so is chancing his luck with the venue.

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Oh dear, the inherent dangers of gigging in pubs with high quality instruments. As far as I can see the unfortunate Wal owner is on to plums..as we say in this locality.

Anyone who messes with my instruments without asking first at gigs does so at the risk of a quick, but painful death!!!

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[quote name='miles'tone' timestamp='1370804362' post='2105820']
Lesson learned:

Don't take your Wal to the pub.
[/quote]

Harsh but fair. If you do insist on taking three grands worth of boutique bass to play at the local boozer be prepared for heartache.

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In a bid to make a long story short I got lost at the car? I'm assuming that's just how you know the guy with the Wal.

I think he'd have to make a case against the individual or individuals who damaged it. I imagine the venue will have a disclaimer saying the band assumes responsibility, or he would simply not be able to get anything against them - I mean, in all honesty, they didn't damage it, did they?

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[quote name='Junkyard Rocket' timestamp='1370814981' post='2106011']
I doubt the car insurance would cover it, but it might be worth a try :blink:[size=4][/quote][/size]
[size=4]Depends if it's fully comp or just third party fire and theft.[/size]

Edited by discreet
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trying to go after the venue is imho lazy and disingenuous and will serve little purpose other than possibly having the legal rottweilers from the brewery snarling at your friend and as for the venue manager, dont be surprised if he/she is less amicable towards future bookings

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I know, my jaw hit the ground when I heard this, I did find it incredulous that:

1/ The WAL wasn't insured at all :o seems the owner was of the [i]assumption[/i] that his house contents cover 'covered' the bass...expensive assumption! More money need not equal more brains.

2/ The two guys who were the cause of it all by scrapping over best pi**ed bass player, did a runner after the scuffle, then as sometimes happens in these situations, everyone has memory failure as to names etc...although christian names were heard by those breaking things up.

.... I'm guessing the WAL owner is 'trying it on' the pubs public liabilty insurance :blink: possibly because he feels the two guys are known to the landlord, but landlord doesn't wish to bubble them up and WAL man (WALly?) hasn't anywhere else to go with this?

A sorry tale indeed.

Edited by iconic
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[quote name='iconic' timestamp='1370847210' post='2106126']
.. I'm guessing the WAL owner is 'trying it on' the pubs public liabilty insurance :blink: possibly because he feels the two guys are known to the landlord, but landlord doesn't wish to bubble them up and WAL man (WALly?) hasn't anywhere else to go with this?

A sorry tale indeed.
[/quote]

youre friend could report it to local police as criminal damage - from your OP it sounds as though there is grounds for this to be reckless criminal damage rather than an unfortunate accident - the police could then request cctv from the landlord - but if he does i would suggest that he mentions this to the police as the landlord might try and fob them off that the cctv wasnt recording properly or some excuse so he doesnt have to grass his friends up if thats what you suspect

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Well, I find it wholly disgusting. I stopped working behind bars because of changes in the licensing laws which basically passed a lot of the blame for patrons' drunkenness onto the staff. We don't pour it down their throats! We had a loosely defined duty of care and we stopped serving someone who is out of it, but who's to stop someone buying a drink for some poor SOB who is already legless then falls over and splits their head open? Now that's our fault? Up yours. I quit.

Venues are being hounded and harassed on all sides by the Police, Councils' licensing boards, the PRS and now stuff like this? Sometimes I'm surprised they bother to open their doors at all. And before you question my credentials, I know venue owners personally and have installed and maintained CCTV in a couple of places. What fun - bouncers getting put in the dock for doing their job - physically restraining someone who is throwing punches around is assault, apparently. I've been hauled to court as a witness to something I never actually saw because I lifted the CCTV footage, I spent a whole morning waiting around then finally the perp changed his plea. Wonderful. It's not a morning off work by the way - it's a morning of sitting around uneasily in a waiting area playing spot the junkie. Fun. As far as I can see, rather than the courts tackle the drunken individuals who can't or won't handle their ale, they'd rather solve the problem by harassing venue owners and staff. They'd love it if all the bars in the country closed.

Someone also told me that if a contractor falls off their own badly maintained ladder on your property, you're liable and can be sued? Is that right?

Now someone has taken their eye off the ball, something bad happened that was completely unforeseeable by the venue staff/management (and indeed, unless they're running a bass crèche, not their problem) and he's trying to extract compensation out of the venue? Balls to that. In a perfect world you would be able to leave your property lying out and people that have nothing to do with it would leave it well alone, but this isn't a perfect world.

I despise the way this world is going. Blame anyone but yourself. In my opinion there are two problems here - of course the vast majority of the blame is on the drunken idiots who fkd about with the bass in the first place but a smidgeon of blame rests with the owner for not taking the appropriate steps to secure his property IF he left it unattended. It's no-one else's problem or concern. Deal with it.

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[quote name='neepheid' timestamp='1370857028' post='2106237']
Well, I find it wholly disgusting. I stopped working behind bars because of changes in the licensing laws which basically passed a lot of the blame for patrons' drunkenness onto the staff. We don't pour it down their throats! We had a loosely defined duty of care and we stopped serving someone who is out of it, but who's to stop someone buying a drink for some poor SOB who is already legless then falls over and splits their head open? Now that's our fault? Up yours. I quit.

Venues are being hounded and harassed on all sides by the Police, Councils' licensing boards, the PRS and now stuff like this? Sometimes I'm surprised they bother to open their doors at all. And before you question my credentials, I know venue owners personally and have installed and maintained CCTV in a couple of places. What fun - bouncers getting put in the dock for doing their job - physically restraining someone who is throwing punches around is assault, apparently. I've been hauled to court as a witness to something I never actually saw because I lifted the CCTV footage, I spent a whole morning waiting around then finally the perp changed his plea. Wonderful. It's not a morning off work by the way - it's a morning of sitting around uneasily in a waiting area playing spot the junkie. Fun. As far as I can see, rather than the courts tackle the drunken individuals who can't or won't handle their ale, they'd rather solve the problem by harassing venue owners and staff. They'd love it if all the bars in the country closed.

Someone also told me that if a contractor falls off their own badly maintained ladder on your property, you're liable and can be sued? Is that right?

Now someone has taken their eye off the ball, something bad happened that was completely unforeseeable by the venue staff/management (and indeed, unless they're running a bass crèche, not their problem) and he's trying to extract compensation out of the venue? Balls to that. In a perfect world you would be able to leave your property lying out and people that have nothing to do with it would leave it well alone, but this isn't a perfect world.

I despise the way this world is going. Blame anyone but yourself. In my opinion there are two problems here - of course the vast majority of the blame is on the drunken idiots who fkd about with the bass in the first place but a smidgeon of blame rests with the owner for not taking the appropriate steps to secure his property IF he left it unattended. It's no-one else's problem or concern. Deal with it.
[/quote]
This is wisdom.

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