And People Wonder Why Guitar Shops Are Closing.....

[spectoremg]

Is that the shop by the big car park/market? Been in there and it ain't much cop. However, for a real rock & roll experience try the pub over the road, they have a peerless collection of... potato mashers hanging on the walls!

[izustu]

I'm 'lucky' in that I live in the South Croydon area and within walking distance of several guitar shops.

Martin Phelps Music have been very helpful and I door stepped them recently with a similar problem. It was mid week and the shop was empty but the owner was happy to do a quick repair/upgrade whilst I waited. (Loose jack replaced.)

He and Joe are great and always happy to help though the shop is mental at weekends. (Loads of teaching takes place in the basement.)

http://martinphelpsmusic.co.uk/

Admittedly it was a guitar that I had recently brought from them, but the service was excellent.

Feline Guitars is just round the corner and they have been used for repair and set up. The Luther (Jon) is always a pleasure to chat to and has done some really good work on a couple of guitars.

http://www.felineguitars.com/index.html

There is another shop across the street that I've not visited though if you are passing through South Croydon it's worth a nose around. They are more ecliptic!

https://www.justflutes.com/#gref

There is also another shop are the far side of Croydon, which is huge with a large range of guitars and equipment. Though the experience there wasn't particularly friendly!

[Geek99]

Perhaps the OP should revisit anonymously and give them another chance, given Carl's apology and explanation

[Thunderbird]

I think the shop owner Carl has shown that he cares and it takes balls to reply to a "negative thread" and at the end of the day your business is only as good as your staff if they dont care your f***ed I hope the rude little oink got a good warning and a kick up the arse

[phil.c60]

Very good of you to reply, Carl, your post does not quite answer the original point although I did shorten it to stop it turning into war and peace.
I rang, and specifically asked if you had two 8' cables and an 18' cable in Whirlwind Elite tweed with silver stripe and was told that you did. We had a conversation about them, and I said I'd come in Sunday and asked if I needed to have them kept for me and you said no, they're a stock item, I've got lots.
I came in Sunday morning, asked the guy in the shop, he said "all the ones we've got...." etc. I looked on the rack, their were two 18' silver and no others (in silver). I asked again and got "all the ones we have......" I pointed out I had come specifically for them having been told they were a stock item and got "all the ones we have..." at this point I expressed my displeasure and left. I appreciate your apology, but if the guy in the shop had offered to order them, post them, been apologetic, anything really, I would have probably taken the 18' one and had the other two sent. The service was not great, he clearly didn't seem to care much and that was the overall point.
It may seem a lot of fuss over small items, but they are not cheap: the three leads come to nearly £100.
I do appreciate you're response, as I said it's good of you to take the time but I will be going elsewhere.

Edited February 10, 2016 by phil.c60

[vsmith1]

[quote name='discreet' timestamp='1454953411' post='2974570']
Yep, I am slowly working towards minimising my possessions... honest.
And incidentally, I'd love to be able to get into 35" waist jeans. Or even 36" waist jeans. Or even 40" waist jeans.
Anyway buying jeans is 'retail therapy' I just have a loin-cloth made out of an old tea towel and stay in a lot.
[/quote]

Are you in Ted Nugent's band?

[discreet]

[quote name='vsmith1' timestamp='1455096317' post='2975743']
Are you in Ted Nugent's band?
[/quote]

No, but I do borrow his crossbow occasionally.

[skej21]

[quote name='phil.c60' timestamp='1455096126' post='2975742']
Very good of you to reply, Carl, your post does not quite answer the original point although I did shorten it to stop it turning into war and peace.
I rang, and specifically asked if you had two 8' cables and an 18' cable in Whirlwind Elite tweed with silver stripe and was told that you did. We had a conversation about them, and I said I'd come in Sunday and asked if I needed to have them kept for me and you said no, they're a stock item, I've got lots.
I came in Sunday morning, asked the guy in the shop, he said "all the ones we've got...." etc. I looked on the rack, their were two 18' silver and no others (in silver). I asked again and got "all the ones we have......" I pointed out I had come specifically for them having been told they were a stock item and got "all the ones we have..." at this point I expressed my displeasure and left. I appreciate your apology, but if the guy in the shop had offered to order them, post them, been apologetic, anything really, I would have probably taken the 18' one and had the other two sent. The service was not great, he clearly didn't seem to care much and that was the overall point.
It may seem a lot of fuss over small items, but they are not cheap: the three leads come to nearly £100.
I do appreciate you're response, as I said it's good of you to take the time but I will be going elsewhere.
[/quote]

It's great that Carl came on to apologise and it's great that you have given feedback in a neutral and fair way (it's very easy to 'rant' unfairly on a forum!)...

However, reading through this I can only help but think that this could all have been avoided if Carl had originally just said 'we've got loads in stock so I don't mind setting them aside for you with your name on for a couple of days. If you've not bought them by Monday morning, I'll pop them back on display'... Then just said to his staff 'X is coming to pick these up on Sunday, keep an eye out'

Simple communication breakdown that could've been easily avoided by the looks of it. Shame you were the one on the end of it!

[4stringslow]

[quote name='Thunderbird' timestamp='1455093053' post='2975708']
I think the shop owner Carl has shown that he cares and it takes balls to reply to a "negative thread" . . . . .
[/quote]

Good point.

Also a good example of the maxim "if you like what we do, tell all your friends. If you don't, please tell us so we can fix it".

It's often when something goes wrong that a company's customer service is really put to the test and it can give them the opportunity to really shine. Surly staff must be every shop owner's nightmare.

[Carl W - Guitar Sound]

Hi Guys,

I just wanted to say i really appreciate the understanding on this from a lot of you. I've worked really hard to get that shop up and running and as we've decided to compete with internet pricing and happily price-match it is a bit of a labour of love but as i'm a gear head i love it! I personally work in the shop 5 days a week but wanted to keep the shop open 7 days a week so inevitably i have to rely on staff to represent me when i'm not there. The member of staff in question got it wrong on this occasion and that has been addressed but i've also had many glowing reports back from other customers that he's super helpful and really couldn't have done more. He's not the most confident lad and probably a wee bit of shyness could easily be misinterpreted as rudeness but we're working on it with him. Do i believe he called it wrong with Phil on that particular day, yes which is why i'm on here personally apologising. I completely understand Phil not wanting to purchase through us as a result of a bad experience, i might have reacted the same, but from the other side of the fence it does show how tough it is to keep all customers happy in retail. I used to work for two other very large online guitar retailers, one of which Phil has mentioned and i know personally they don't always get it right either but i suppose if you are only using the online side you don't have human contact and this limits the chance of misunderstandings.

Completely understand Phil, hope you get the bits you need and good luck with all the gigging.

Carl

[bassninja]

Mainly reasonable points, but props to Carl for having the cojones to take the trouble to join & reply.

With all respect, though, bit grubby to use the opportunity to ask for a discount for all of us.

[Mudpup]

Once again, a classy response from the shop........well done

Edited February 10, 2016 by Mudpup

[Geek99]

[quote name='Carl W - Guitar Sound' timestamp='1455100499' post='2975796']
Hi Guys,

I just wanted to say i really appreciate the understanding on this from a lot of you. I've worked really hard to get that shop up and running and as we've decided to compete with internet pricing and happily price-match it is a bit of a labour of love but as i'm a gear head i love it! I personally work in the shop 5 days a week but wanted to keep the shop open 7 days a week so inevitably i have to rely on staff to represent me when i'm not there. The member of staff in question got it wrong on this occasion and that has been addressed but i've also had many glowing reports back from other customers that he's super helpful and really couldn't have done more. He's not the most confident lad and probably a wee bit of shyness could easily be misinterpreted as rudeness but we're working on it with him. Do i believe he called it wrong with Phil on that particular day, yes which is why i'm on here personally apologising. I completely understand Phil not wanting to purchase through us as a result of a bad experience, i might have reacted the same, but from the other side of the fence it does show how tough it is to keep all customers happy in retail. I used to work for two other very large online guitar retailers, one of which Phil has mentioned and i know personally they don't always get it right either but i suppose if you are only using the online side you don't have human contact and this limits the chance of misunderstandings.

Completely understand Phil, hope you get the bits you need and good luck with all the gigging.

Carl
[/quote]

Well done, Carl

[M@23]

[quote name='TheGreek' timestamp='1455056351' post='2975592']


Hey Carl

Good of you to take the time to join the forum and respond in person. Suggests that you do, in fact, care..

Personally if I was in the OP's position I'd like something to appease me for the trouble/ poor service and to encourage me to continue to shop locally - i.e. your store. Why not offer him (and any other BC member) a generous reduction to entice us into your store?? Remember reputation is everything. What better way to boost your reputation that to be valued by the most popular bass players' site in Europe?

Perfect opportunity to get a ton of free advertising..
[/quote]

I honestly can't tell if you're being serious?

[Daz39]

We have to allow for humans in a 'live' environment. If a member of staff is having an off day, fine, they shouldn't take it out on the customer, but it happens. They have personal lives too.

If the management repeat the attitude or don't address it - then yeah, you have a problem - but expecting every visit to a shop to be wonderful is a bit much.

Often it's younger, lower paid staff doing these front line jobs: working their way up and on in the world of employment. Most of us were in such a job once (any job, I never worked in retail, but I spent many an hour keeping a photocopier company (but that's another story...)).

There are a couple of local music stores near me; one is a bit 'are you local?', and the other is a nice place to visit. They compete with PMT, which in Leeds is actually alright - yeah it gets busy and you can't find staff when you need someone, but they play good music and are fairly helpful.
(Their stock is another issue though...)

[Lozz196]

Quality of Carl to join the forum in order to address the issue - real kudos there.

[MacDaddy]

[quote name='cybertect' timestamp='1455018187' post='2975002']
I have the luxury of Wunjo Bass being about five minutes walk from my office in London. Lawrence and the Toms are a delight to deal with and they're usually competitive with any deals I can find on line.
[/quote]

This. I've bought from them before and am happy to go back.

Was in there yesterday. Made it clear I was just browsing, but was still invited to try anything that took my fancy. Also had a bit of a natter about custom basses.

[Geek99]

[quote name='Daz39' timestamp='1455111370' post='2975981']
We have to allow for humans in a 'live' environment. If a member of staff is having an off day, fine, they shouldn't take it out on the customer, but it happens. They have personal lives too.

If the management repeat the attitude or don't address it - then yeah, you have a problem - but expecting every visit to a shop to be wonderful is a bit much.

Often it's younger, lower paid staff doing these front line jobs: working their way up and on in the world of employment. Most of us were in such a job once (any job, I never worked in retail, but I spent many an hour keeping a photocopier company (but that's another story...)).

There are a couple of local music stores near me; one is a bit 'are you local?', and the other is a nice place to visit. They compete with PMT, which in Leeds is actually alright - yeah it gets busy and you can't find staff when you need someone, but they play good music and are fairly helpful.
(Their stock is another issue though...)
[/quote]
Yes, liked Leeds PMT

re youthful staff; in my first job (Sainsburys) I asked this woman customer if she "really was [i]that [/i]stupid". She didn't like it unsurprisingly. Reason was that she had brought some reduced sausages back four full days after their best-before date complaining that they "smelt a bit funny"; they'd spent most of the the fourth day in her shopping basket in Summer as we were her last call of the day. I got told off big time. I did protest that she was in fact stupid and that I was factually correct and the supervisor said "I agree, but just don't [i]tell [/i]her"

[Dave C - GB Music]

In defence of Carl, it is so easy to fall foul of a customer and anyone can make a mistake. My situation is even worse with regards to space / stock, given the range of stuff we cover but telling people we can get it is often no longer than buying online anyway. Many times I've heard of people buying something "in stock" online, then receiving multiple "updates" for their order from Gear... suppliers.

That's when - damn it - they have to come to a shop. We had a customer about a week before Christmas that put it almost exactly that way - "F'ing Amazon said they'd sent it... now I've had to come here" - such a pleasure to deal with - just so happens we had everything they wanted anyway, and the same prices (phew!).

From a Book to a Gong to an Ampeg cab, retailers can source most things - sometimes in less than 24hrs. A guy today couldn't believe that when he ordered his son’s Rockschool Debut Bass book at 3pm yesterday (yes, we’d sold out) he was able to collect it at 10am today.

Online overheads differ due to scale and less chance of theft, but thankfully a lot of good people still love the face to face / browse / discussion of a retail store, and find a service they find lacking elsewhere. Instruments are inspected before sale but if something does go wrong it's easier to resolve face to face – including warranties and repairs. Margins are very tight so we have to enjoy what we do!

I ‘shook my head inside’ when someone bought a guitar at Christmas asking for a "new sealed one". When I explained that stock on display isn't second hand (unless intended to be), they were more concerned about the sealed box than the instrument and didn't want it opened or set up, even if we packed it up carefully again! Of course we can thank the likes of "TV shopping experts" for that kind of misunderstanding, so you just smile, cross your fingers and say thank you as always!

So, thank you for the endorsement, but Carl does a lot of stuff I don't do, and vice versa. A Retail shop is as much about passion than anything else these days. An apology is the important thing. Carl has tried very hard in that respect, but I know it is still annoying if you’re on the receiving end of an error. So, many thanks for those that live with Retail shop occasional inadequacies, but at least we don’t hide behind a mouse click like some of the giants online.

[Rich]

[quote name='cybertect' timestamp='1455018187' post='2975002']
On the matter of Whirlwind cables - I have two Whirlwinds that I bought around 1990 which I'm still gigging with over a quarter of a century later, so I'm pretty happy with them.
[/quote]
I see your 1990 and raise you my two main cables are a pair of Klotzes (sp??) that I bought in 1986 after everything except my Wal was stolen. Used for almost every gig ever since. Having said that, I've just ordered my first obbm cable (for the wireless). So that lot should do me till I croak

[Guest Jecklin]

[quote name='Geek99' timestamp='1455119928' post='2976139']


re youthful staff; in my first job (Sainsburys) I asked this woman customer if she "really was [i]that [/i]stupid". She didn't like it unsurprisingly. Reason was that she had brought some reduced sausages back four full days after their best-before date complaining that they "smelt a bit funny"; they'd spent most of the the fourth day in her shopping basket in Summer as we were her last call of the day. I got told off big time. I did protest that she was in fact stupid and that I was factually correct and the supervisor said "I agree, but just don't [i]tell [/i]her"
[/quote]

To be fair I'd tell someone that now, although using gushing metaphors.
One of my part time day/night jobs is working in a customer services department where although you will always be dealt with pleasantly and genuine help will be given rest assured if you are calling in with problems created by your own stupidity and project a bad acusational attitude this will be pointed out to you.
The customer is not always right.