4stringslow

Depends on the gig. I've driven from Norfolk to Wales before now for a gig, but it was a private 'mini-festival' on a farm, 150-200 people, so we made a weekend of it. Great fun as it turned out and we were invited back to play the following year, which we did. We could play it again if we wanted but having done it twice now the trek seems less appealing. We don't really have any 'rules' and just go with how we feel at the time. No big deal when money is not a concern..

[quote name='Marc S' timestamp='1473342339' post='3129322'] - yet his charge was slightly less than mine! Another mistake? [/quote] Perhaps it depends on the nature of the goods? Import duties are not just a single band for everything are they?

Never mind the lights, I waiting to hear what Blue thinks about The Rutles

Yes, it's justified as being the cost of collecting the import charges, documenting it and passing on the import duty to HMRC. Obviously the admin involved is pretty much constant regardless of the actual package value and duty payable, but of course can be significant with low value items. I wonder if this sort of thing will be extended to European countries when we leave the EU? The guy at the collection desk probably deals with this sort of customer frustration every day Having said all that, there's no excuse to be so surly when a simple explanation and, perhaps, a brief explanatory leaflet could be given instead.

Like Lozz, I can't immediately think why the cab should be causing the problem, but with all these sorts of issues reproducing the fault is the first priority and the amp doctor is not going to get very far without this. Is it possible to take the amp [u]and[/u] cab in for a checkup? Preferably with your bass and all cables as well so that you can demonstrate the problem to them. I know it's a pain, but I'm sure there's frustration on both sides - there's nothing more frustrating than a described fault that can't be reproduced on the test bench.

I've got a Korg GA40, which I usually connect to an output on my amp just in case I need it when gigging (I don't use any pedals). But I fancied trying a clip on tuner and bought a TC Polytune-Clip about 6 months ago. It works really well on my P and J basses and the large LED display is really easy to see and I use it all the time for rehearsals. However I've not yet plucked up courage to actually gig with it. I've no doubt about it working but I don't think it's a great image, especially being pure white and looking a bit like an Apple gadget (although that might appeal to some ).

[quote name='BigRedX' timestamp='1473241382' post='3128202'] But you could also repurpose that old golfing cliche about practice and luck to say that for bands the higher your profile the luckier you get. The more you do the more people you get to know and it's much easier to find yourself in the right place at the right time if you are out there gigging and promoting your band as often as possible. Unfortunately, from my experience what has happened over the last 10 years or so is that the industry has reverted to something similar to it's pre-punk attitude where it was almost impossible to get noticed if your band doesn't have someone with a proven track record in it, combined with the fact that there seems to be a lot less right places and right times these days. And to go back to your point about the record labels looking at music colleges for new talent; I imagine these days that music college teaches far more than just how to play your instrument and that the importance of image etc. is also on the curriculum. It makes sense for record labels to target artists who already know how to present themselves, rather than to have to go to the expense of hiring stylists and people to teach them how to get the best out of an interview when this has already been covered in the course. [/quote] Yes, I'm a great believer in making your own luck, and also being able to recognise a bit of good luck when it comes along and being willing to take the jump. Interesting point about music colleges teaching more than music. Would make sense for those aiming for record contracts.

Well it won't be hard to find the full length film on youtube so we can but wait for his reaction (assuming he finds these posts buried I a lighting topic). Meanwhile, I've got tix to see them live in October

[quote name='BigRedX' timestamp='1473166225' post='3127562'] And you are perfectly right about my musical endeavours. None of them were the right thing at the right time to warrant record label investment. However what I was trying to say was that in the past it was fairly easy to get record labels sniffing about at the bands I was involved with even if none of them were ultimately going to do anything more than sniff. In comparison The Terrortones, a band with a far bigger following than anything I've been involved with in the past (and lets fact it popular bands is what the labels want) can't even attract a fraction of the interest I've had previously. [/quote] I'd class myself as very much an outsider compared to that sort of experience so I may be talking tosh, but I've always thought that 'making it' in the music business is more about luck than talent, which makes it the tough nut to crack that it clearly is. The old thing about "it's not what you know, it's who you know" and variations on that theme.

No love for 'Rhythm Stick' then? ( no, I can't play it either!)

[quote name='BigRedX' timestamp='1473157297' post='3127411'] Well strictly from personal experience... [/quote] But did the record industry ever take chances? It would be interesting to know their failure rates today vs yesterday. I don't want to be mean, but perhaps your difficulty in getting a record deal was because the big companies felt you were not the right material? Given that you couldn't make it as a full time job, it could be argued that they were right. Meanwhile, record companies are sniffing around music colleges and signing up the likes of George Ezra and others, then promoting them like crazy for a while. I'm not saying it's necessarily a good thing and, personally, I'm not a fan of one-man-and-a-guitar acts trying to become the next Bob Dylan, but I guess that's the current fashion and the record companies job is to make money not act as some sort of paternalistic guardian of the nation's musical preferences (as if anyone really knows what they may be).

[quote name='Barking Spiders' timestamp='1473156296' post='3127393'] I like informal get-togethers but can't be doing with organised functions. Just the way I roll. [/quote] +1 I much prefer unbirthdays - more opportunities to treat oneself and loved ones.

[quote name='PaulWarning' timestamp='1473152862' post='3127339'] not on anywhere near the scale it used to be, Record Companies are very reluctant to take a chance on an artist these days, and the rewards are nowhere near what they used to be with CD sales falling off a cliff, trouble with self promotion in the digital age is anyone can do it with not much effort which means it's very difficult to stand out from the huge amount of bands doing it [/quote] I'd be interested to see some figures on this. Are all the artists queuing up for things like the 'BBC Introducing' and on the myriad similar stages at Glastonbury and other festivals just self-promoting? I've always assumed they were being pushed by the record companies. I know for a fact that they 'sniff around' the various music colleges looking for artists to sign up so have assumed it, a more or less business as usual for the record companies, albeit managing a lower [u]proportion[/u] of artists because of the boom of self-promotion enabled by the digital age etc. I agree that record sales are down compared to the good old days, but doesn't that make it even more important for record companies to sign up new artists and push them out on the road where higher than ever ticket prices can help fill their coffers?

Blue, a good place to start with ex-Bonzo's would be Neil Innes' work helping to create The Rutles. Also, as you've said you love British humour, then The Rutles film is a must see!! http://www.rutles.org http://youtu.be/fJqp_KvOHts

[quote name='PaulWarning' timestamp='1473148849' post='3127281'] Which in the old days was the record companies job, you got signed, got an advance, got put on tours with established acts and got the record companies publicity machine, oh, for the days of the big nasty record companies, we all thought it was a hoot when the got a bloody nose with the coming of the digital age, the law of unforeseen consequences eh? [/quote] Surely all that still happens today? There are plenty of artists being signed up and subsequently promoted and toured by record companies. Obviously they won't or can't sign up [u]every[/u] wannabe artist but to suggest that whole model is nowadays broken is simply not true. I suspect what has changed in our 'digital age' is that those wannabe artists who don't get record deals now have more scope for self-promotion, something almost impossible in the 'good old days', so there are now more wannabes out there trying to make it and everyone more aware about how the music scene is actually a pretty difficult way to earn a living.

These sorts of arrangements are fine until something goes wrong. The OP is clearly unhappy about it and I think I would be too. If it were me, I'd have a chat with the owner about my concerns, possibly by email so there is a written record even though I'd generally prefer a face to face chat. Perhaps a chat first followed up with an email just to confirm what was discussed?

[quote name='BigRedX' timestamp='1473084676' post='3126727'] I don't think that songwriting is the problem. There's at least a couple of decent songs in every originals band. And remember that very few "signed" bands are much better. How many albums (that aren't greatest hits/best of) do you own where every song is a classic, and how many times have you bought an album on the strength of a great single only to find that is the only good track on there? The problem most bands have is that they simply don't have the ability to perform those songs in a way that is entertaining to an audience. The number of times I've seen bands struggle to project beyond the edge of the stage or simply play as though they are still in the rehearsal room and the audience might as well not even exist. And with the "product" now being the live performance it should be easier than ever to be able to hone your act so that it entertaining on stage. After all you just need to use your rehearsal room time properly. That's relatively cheap compared with what you used to need in order to make a recording that could compete with what was in the charts. [/quote] Good points, especially live performance and putting on a show. I played at a family wedding recently, not with my band but with other family members. It was under some duress because I thought it would be embarrassingly under-rehearsed and none of the other family members regularly played in a band except for the drummer who had only recently joined one. In the end I couldn't really refuse because I was the 'best qualified' to play and it would have seemed churlish to refuse, but I wasn't happy and insisted on more rehearsal than they wanted to bother with. We decided on some cheesy covers (Smoke on the water, 20th century boy, suspicious minds, delilah & Jumping Jack Flash) and some interesting arrangements given we only had drums, bass and keys plus the singer. Come the day, I was ready for some gentle ridicule but thought we could at least shrug it off as being a bit of a laugh. However, in worrying about our fairly 'loose' musical performance, I completely under-estimated the lead singer. He had a decent voice but the killer was that he was a total extrovert and showman. He dressed for the part, wore an outrageous wig, unashamedly played to the crowd and basically had them in the palm of his hand. By the time we played Delilah we had 150 people singing along at the top of their voices and having a great time. It certainly made me realise the impact a good front man can have - I guess it's the difference between a concert and a show and, if I'm brutally honest, my band could do with working on its show!

[quote name='TimR' timestamp='1473078919' post='3126624'] I'm pretty sure more than three men and their dog listen to Mahler. [/quote] Probably, and probably even more listen to Mustang Sally Interesting points LD and I entirely agree that most musicians can judge quality of music over popularity, but this thread is about playing to near-empty venues, which suggests that popularity is the key for band success. Even if they play high quality but 'obscure' music, they still need to be 'popular' enough to fill the venue being played and the more obscure the material probably the wider catchment area they will need to draw their audience from, making it more difficult than playing classic covers. We play mostly original songs but I'll freely admit they're more derivative than ground breaking, though we've not yet been sued for plagiarism . As for their musical quality, some of them have five chords . . .

[quote name='luckydog' timestamp='1473074710' post='3126549'] One shouldn't confuse popularity with quality, as a measure of success in such things. Is Mustang Sally really worthy of notable merit as a song ? The pinnacle of aspiration ? I think not. [/quote] That's an interesting point, but what would be an alternative measure of quality? In a band context, isn't the most important thing entertainment, in which case popularity would seem to be a good metric? I've no doubt we could have a very worthy academic discussion about the 'quality' of a piece of music but if a three chord ditty is enjoyed by more people then what's the point?

[quote name='chris_b' timestamp='1473069546' post='3126490'] Really? Mustang Sally and Sex On Fire are original songs by writers who cared about what they did and wanted success by reaching the largest audience possible with their songs. They are exactly like every other pub band who write their own songs. . . . except their songs are successful. Isn't that what every song writer wants? [b]Who has a hero in their field of interest who is a failure?[/b] [/quote] Ah, but isn't heroic failure the Great British way Eddie the Eagle Sir Clive Sinclair Tim Henman England football team Beagle 2 Concorde Advanced Passenger Train . . .

[quote name='TimR' timestamp='1473025147' post='3126262'] People are spending too much time and energy in the wrong areas. All that casual networking is actually what's getting the gigs. It's not a hard sell. It really depends on who you are approaching. [/quote] Could be. Reminds me of the old saying about advertising; half of it is a complete waste of time - trouble is, no one knows which half Casual certainly describes our efforts, but it seems to work for our low level of ambition.

LEDs are definitely the way to go IMO. Other types can get very hot as well as drawing lots of power. You're probably right to start small. I started with a 4x LED bar stand but have actually only used them separately. I later added another four of these Thomann ones: https://www.thomann.de/gb/stairville_led_par_64_10_mm_black_floor.htm It's fun playing around with DMX but actually much easier just to use them in sound-to-light mode. I've not yet managed to program a light show to match specific songs - it's a lot of work!

At the pub and other small venue level, what percentage of the audience has actually travelled specifically to see ’your' band rather than just turning up to see whatever live band that happened to be playing at that time? In other words, how often does the audience come to band rather than the band coming to the audience?

[quote name='mcnach' timestamp='1473017887' post='3126144'] I don't think so. Things may be changing sometimes... but there's always room for live music. I can't see how that could change. [/quote] That was my initial thought as well, but thinking about it I'm now less sure. The long history of music is one of live performance. You had to play yourself or listen to others play live because there was no such thing as recording. This also meant that music was quite exclusive. Today, only around 100 years since recording became possible, the vast majority of the music we hear is recorded and it is completely ubiquitous rather than exclusive. Indeed, with today's ticket prices for main acts, it is live music that is becoming exclusive while recorded music is all around and largely free. Personally, I'd think it a tragedy for live music to almost disappear, but I'm not sure I'd bet against it

[quote name='TimR' timestamp='1473016483' post='3126121'] I suspect you have a leader who is actually a pretty good salesman. You just don't realise it. You don't just walk into a venue with your gear and start playing. Somewhere along the line someone has had to persuade someone to let you play. [/quote] That's a fair point, though in our case it's more casual networking than being a proactive. A pub we've played many times is the 'local' of our singer. He once mentioned he was in a band and was then invited to come along and play, which we duly did and have been asked back many times since. So I take your point that gigs don't arrive out of thin air, but equally it's not as if we're out there all the time delivering flyers to every venue we can find. We don't even have a demo CD or a web presence . . . although it's something we keep talking about and have have made a few recordings in preparation. Trouble is, I never think they're good enough and always want to improve them before burning loads of CDs, meanwhile the rest of the band loses interest and we make no progress.