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TommyK

To Cancel a gig?

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My band are supposed to be gigging this Saturday night in a pub we have played twice before with no issues... however..


It has become renowned over the last couple of months for becoming the local gypsy fraternity's boozer and some of them are pretty unpleasant/violent characters to say the least. Our usual rent-a-mob fan base ain't keen. It is also St Paddys weekend which could add to the fun??

Also I have a mate who plays in a couple of other bands locally and he told me that the landlord hasn't been paying everyone their agreed fee at the end of the night. (They have always paid us ok up until now)

We are a female fronted pop/rock/funk covers band and my gut tells me to pull the plug on it. Never done that before though....

Thoughts/advice appreciated.

Thanks
TK :)

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Don't do it...you aren't paid enough to HAVE to do it. If you sort them out with a band then even better...
But...don't expect to get another gig there too easily.


But then again, we vet gigs as much as they would vet us. and we do just a handful of pubs.

Edited by JTUK

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Be a professional - approach the landlord with your concerns about the money and ask what he would do to protect you in the event the rough as f*** that have moved into the place of late causing you a problem. Explain that - as a band - you have a zero tolerance policy to trouble causers and will leave the stage until they are ejected but will still expect to be paid in full. No need to sound threatening - just cool and professional. BTW I do realise that most landlords are sub-species but you can still act in a manner fitting normal human beings even if they don't.

If you're not satisfied with the responses - pull it.


Might be worth adding - this is not talk , we have done this or similar several times this past year alone , have left the stage twice and not gone back on once.

Edited by Dr.Dave

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[quote name='TommyK' timestamp='1363191888' post='2009513']
My band are supposed to be gigging this Saturday night in a pub we have played twice before with no issues... however..


It has become renowned over the last couple of months for becoming the local gypsy fraternity's boozer and some of them are pretty unpleasant/violent characters to say the least. Our usual rent-a-mob fan base ain't keen. It is also St Paddys weekend which could add to the fun??

Also I have a mate who plays in a couple of other bands locally and he told me that the landlord hasn't been paying everyone their agreed fee at the end of the night. (They have always paid us ok up until now)

We are a female fronted pop/rock/funk covers band and my gut tells me to pull the plug on it. Never done that before though....

Thoughts/advice appreciated.

Thanks
TK :)
[/quote]

I'd say do it. Travellers only kick off outside, they dont want to get barred! Plus most pubs will be full or Irish anyway. Dont take offence but for most Irish a good night out ends with a scuffle! :D Many years ago I used to date an Irish lady with 4 brothers, saturday nights were never the same! :ph34r:

The Irish love a drink and are spending the money, takings will be up! Happy venue, happy band!

Edited by mentalextra

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Good evening, Tommy...

Contact the landlord and discuss these issues beforehand; make a decision based on the response you get. It's not good 'form' to pull out, unless there are valid reasons, and reasonable measures have not been taken to allow carrying on. It's always difficult to 'vet' an audience beforehand, anyway. Do your best to honour your obligations, but ensure that the venue honours theirs.
Have a great gig.

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I've refused to do a gig because of the past experience of the knuckle dragging clientele. Of course the band got a dep in and of course trouble flared, there was both a glassing and some other dude got a good beating with the heavy end of a pool cue.

So the moral of my story is.......

if you suspect there will be trouble just cancel. Gigging is supposed to be fun not a horrible ordeal.

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[quote name='gjones' timestamp='1363195763' post='2009626']
Gigging is supposed to be fun not a horrible ordeal.[/quote]

This.

If the worry (or potential unpleasantness) isn't worth the fun, pull out.

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Could you nip into the pub on during the week and see what the clientelle is like then? Could you speak to any other band that has played their recently and get their view on the crowd? You may be worrying needlessly but I wouldn't want to be playing any venue with a threatening reputation, we do this for the love of music not to feel intimidated and stressed

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I pulled out of a gig last year. We played our first gig at the venue but I refused to return for the next gig the following month.

Large ammounts of coke snorting was going on (not by the band), a generally threatening atmsosphere throughout our set and then a number of punch ups towards the end of the night.

Even during the pack up I had two drunken herberts crash in to me whilst punching each other and one attempting to glass the other. Decided there and then that I wouldn't be back. The glass could quite easily have been in my face. :(

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[quote name='gjones' timestamp='1363195763' post='2009626']
Gigging is supposed to be fun not a horrible ordeal.
[/quote]

Couldn't agree more. For the majority of us this isn't our sole income and is about enjoying ourselves through providing enjoyment to others. If you're not comfortable with the gig pull out. If I'm totally honest though I think you should have addressed it a little sooner because venues do rely on big calendar days like Paddy's day and it's not really fair to leave them in the lurch so close to the event. That said, the safety of you and your band has to be your priority. Hope it works out ok.

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My view would be that if you are not comfortable doing the gig then cancel. I have played in similar cicumstances and couldn't enjoy it for feeling threatened. I have done a gig where a member of the travelling fraternity was at the bar and just knocked a guy out without any provocation whatsoever.

I understand the comments to the contrary but you should not put yourself in a position where you or your band are in any way potentially in harm's way. Possibly sexist but, with a female up front, I'd be more tempted to pull it (the gig!!!) than ever.

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Neither of my bands will play places where there is likely to be aggro. It`s very unlikely that bands ever get involved, but it`s the people who come to see us that we don`t want to get caught up in all that. Additionally, we don`t want any kind of reputation following us around as a band where aggro happens at their gigs.

Cancel, let them hit each other if that`s their idea of a good night.

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I think there's more to think about.

You're getting paid so you're working for it, even if it's not your primary income, it's still a case of being paid to do something you might not enjoy. if you want to treat it as a hobby that you can chop and change depending on the wind, you shouldn't put landlords in a place where you can let them down.

The guy's reliably paid you and it's not his fault what clients his pub pulls in, he probably doesn't need his entertainment pulling out on him with no time to replace. It could be damaging to your reputation if you pull out for a vague reason or one you should've known about previously, especially if he's involved in other pubs or mates with other landlords.

I'd at least go there first and check it out.before doing anything. You might go along and it's fine. Without knowing anything first hand, you're risking your band's reputation for hearsay and rumours.

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[quote name='4 Strings' timestamp='1363214714' post='2010068']
Just do what Dr.Dave said.
[/quote]

+1 It's a tricky one - but as Dr.D said, communicate with the Landlord before the gig, be up front about what's worrying you and see what he thinks about it. If you decide to go ahead be prepared to leg it if it goes tits-up. Also I'm really not sure whether being female-fronted is a curse or a blessing. Sometimes a female presence can be a calming influence, other times it can be very provocative... if you think there's a real risk of exposure to violence, don't do it. No band's reputation is worth being traumatised, injured or worse.

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[quote name='ThomBassmonkey' timestamp='1363214774' post='2010071']
You're getting paid so you're working for it, even if it's not your primary income, it's still a case of being paid to do something you might not enjoy. if you want to treat it as a hobby that you can chop and change depending on the wind, you shouldn't put landlords in a place where you can let them down.
[/quote]

I think there's a difference between might not enjoy and don't feel safe. Safety is paramount in any workplace whether it's casual work, hobby work, primary income etc etc. everybody has the right to walk away if they don't feel safe surely.

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[quote name='mrtcat' timestamp='1363215889' post='2010102']
I think there's a difference between might not enjoy and don't feel safe. Safety is paramount in any workplace whether it's casual work, hobby work, primary income etc etc. everybody has the right to walk away if they don't feel safe surely.
[/quote]

If that's the case, then fair enough. He didn't specify though. :)

I've known a lot of very violent people in my years but there's not many that would start fights with random people, they tend to find like minded boneheads to beat the snot out of each other. I never assume someone is dangerous to the average person now just because someone calls them violent.

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To be honest Tommy, I've read all the responses and I really don't know what I'd do in this situation. I'm just glad I'm not facing it. I know this is no help whatsoever but I thought I'd just sympathise cos' I'd have the same qualms if we were playing there on Saturday.

Les

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[quote name='TommyK' timestamp='1363191888' post='2009513']
My band are supposed to be gigging this Saturday night in a pub we have played twice before with no issues... however..


It has become renowned over the last couple of months for becoming the local gypsy fraternity's boozer and some of them are pretty unpleasant/violent characters to say the least. Our usual rent-a-mob fan base ain't keen. It is also St Paddys weekend which could add to the fun??

Also I have a mate who plays in a couple of other bands locally and he told me that the landlord hasn't been paying everyone their agreed fee at the end of the night. (They have always paid us ok up until now)

We are a female fronted pop/rock/funk covers band and my gut tells me to pull the plug on it. Never done that before though....

Thoughts/advice appreciated.

Thanks
TK :)
[/quote]


I feel it's a bit too last minute to cancel without a solid reason.

I would still do it, just be alert... and in the future do not book gigs there if you feel nervous about the place.

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[quote name='mrtcat' timestamp='1363215889' post='2010102']
I think there's a difference between might not enjoy and don't feel safe. Safety is paramount in any workplace whether it's casual work, hobby work, primary income etc etc. everybody has the right to walk away if they don't feel safe surely.
[/quote]

True.
But they have played there before, knew the score, and still booked another gig... It can't have been THAT uncomfortable, or else, why rebook?

Also note that they have not have any issues regarding payment yet. It's all second hand...

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[quote name='mcnach' timestamp='1363224998' post='2010227']
Also note that they have not have any issues regarding payment yet. It's all second hand...
[/quote]

While I'd usually agree with this, I recall there was a chap running a venue in Edinburgh a few years ago who would regularly fail to pay his staff, tradesmen and bands on the basis that Edinburgh had enough of each of them passing through he could stiff 'em all once and it didn't matter if they never came back. A bandmate of mine took him to court over some carpentry work and used to be quite evangelical about warning people not to play or work for him, but they all would anyway. Once.

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I'd be more worried about gear going missing during the packing up part of the evening.
Keep a close eye on everything that night and dont leave the cars un locked.

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We've played a few Irish pubs in the past. We've always honoured any gig we've booked, but just haven't bothered getting repeat bookings any more. There's nearly always an atmosphere of impending violence, very late nights, not particularly decent money, and the constant feeling that the landlord is going to try to rip you off at the end of the night.

Feign some sort of ilness/injury that means you can back out of this one (if that's what you want to do). You'll probably upset the landlord, but without completely burning your bridges. Then have a serious band chat as to whether you really want to play there any more.

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