Nailing your sound.

[JohnFitzgerald]

I've been playing in a new band of late.
More of that to follow.

The rehearsal rooms are fairly well equipped.

The one we've been in the last few weeks has an Ampeg SVT450H into an EBS 8x10.

Every time you go in, it seems that various previous incumbents have been winding all sorts of EQ onto the graphic and the rotary tone section.
Tonight, I set everything flat as a starting point.

I kinda forgot to go back to the EQ after that point.

The Jazz Bass was both pickups full on, mid and top bit of boost, bass left flat. (It's an active one).

Lovely mid range projection, nice bit of presence and cut and decent depth too.
Really, the very sound I've always wanted.

How come it's so simple.
Set it flat, use a decent cabinet - there you go.

The next time my own Trace gets used, everything will be flat with the preshape most certainly off.

Every day's a school day.

[Lozz196]

Yep, I`ve found, on my last 4 or 5 amps, that everything set flat is generally the the best sound the amps make - however if the amp has one, also contour boosted slightly, so just boosting lows/highs a bit, and cutting mids a bit, just places the bass where I need it in the mix.

[gub]

Sorry not trying to hijack the thread but lozz could you tell me what the flat setting is for the orange terror ? Sure I read something you said about it the other day but can't find it now ! ta

[Pinball]

hmm I have settled with pretty much 12 o'clock settings across the board on the amp and then change the guitar settings. I'll give the "flat" set up a try. I think my problem at the moment is that I have yet to settle on favourite guitars and keep switching.

I have settled on sound in terms of pedals though-if I want a heavy sound I have just about given up on distortion pedals in favour of a Hartke Bass Attack. I seem to get the aggressive sound I want from that without loosing the sweet sound of the bass.

Edited August 21, 2012 by Pinball

[Gust0o]

[quote name='Pinball' timestamp='1345587618' post='1779299']
I have settled on sound in terms of pedals though-if I want a heavy sound I have just about given up on distortion pedals in favour of a Hartke Bass Attack. I seem to get the aggressive sound I want from that without loosing the sweet sound of the bass.
[/quote]

I like this

I'll admit, my sound is now just pretty much bass > Hartke HA4000. I know Dave Ellefson goes neat into his Hartke, so there's obviously something to be said for it at all levels of ability!

[xgsjx]

Setting the dials/sliders to "Flat" on an amp doesn't mean the sound is a flat response, you're getting how the manufacturers want the amp to sound. So Flat on an Ampeg is different to Flat on a Hartke & so on.

But yes. I set my Markbass to "flat" & then fiddle the EQ to suit the venue if needed.
My sound is already heavily messed up from the board before hand though!

[brensabre79]

[quote name='xgsjx' timestamp='1345639322' post='1779803']
Setting the dials/sliders to "Flat" on an amp doesn't mean the sound is a flat response, you're getting how the manufacturers want the amp to sound. So Flat on an Ampeg is different to Flat on a Hartke & so on.
[/quote]

+1 its important to get the right amp.

The only EQ I use is to compensate for the room acoustics if required. I use the EQ on my bass if I need a bit more top or boom for a particular song. Otherwise its flat, because I've got the bass, amp and cabinet that's right for me.

EQ is just for compensating really, for the wrong amp, cabinet, bass or room

[BottomE]

Funny how people approach this stuff differently. I shared my rig with someone on Saturday.

Nice chap took a look at my amp during the soundcheck and couldn't understand why i had everything flat. I had taken a little bit of bass as the room was a bit boomy - other than that it was flat as the proverbial.

Turns out this fellow does all his eq on the amp and has his bass flat out on everything. Works for him. I am completely opposite and like to have the amp as flat as poss. .

Different strokes and all that.

[KevB]

I realised that I seemed to have become overcomplicated in my EQ on my gigging rig a year or so back. Nothing too complex, Trace combo 7 band EQ with the usual TE options of preshapes and compression. I had also been using a Hartke Bassattack which added further EQ. So after reading several threads like this one I went back to basics and flattened all the EQ on both the Trace and Hartke pedal. Result? sounded like a bag of sh*te. Spent the next half hour tweaking various things to get a sound I really liked again and, lo and behold all the knobs and buttons were pretty much as I'd always had them in the first place. Lesson? leave well alone, all those things really were contributing to the sound after all. Diff'rent strokes and all that indeed.

[brensabre79]

Not saying you do this Kev, but when I used to do sound for 3 or 4 bands a night at a venue I noticed a lot of players who had all the pre-shape buttons in and graphics on (set to smiley face or sad face depending on the music) and usually loads of pedals. The general theme I observed was: Graphic set to smiley face, pre-shape to add treble and bass, then some sort of mid/level boosting pedal to counteract the whole thing, or in some cases, they would just complain they couldn't hear themselves on stage, whilst the rest of the band would say the bass is too loud because their internal organs are vibrating. No mids see...

I'd usually DI straight from the bass (before the pedals) and get pretty much the same sound out of the PA as they had from their amp without touching a dial!

The lesson? You might find all of the things in your signal chain counteract each other, then again like Kev, you might not. But its worth a fiddle

[KevB]

I assumed that was happening when I carried out the original experiment and started taking stuff out systematically to see what might be compensating for each other but when I got to a genuine flat EQ it really was quite weedy sounding. I was just playing pubs where we didn't go through the PA so I needed a decent backline sound as that was all the punters heard. Fortunately I was also using wireless and could go out front at the sound check and make sure the sound was good in among the other instruments. It became more important in the last band as it was just a trio.

[Mornats]

[quote name='gub' timestamp='1345587203' post='1779285']
Sorry not trying to hijack the thread but lozz could you tell me what the flat setting is for the orange terror ? Sure I read something you said about it the other day but can't find it now ! ta
[/quote]

It might be the same as my ashdown hybrid amp in which case it would be bass and mid at 9 o'clock and treble at 3 o'clock so I've heard.

[dmccombe7]

YEP i'm another one who starts with a flat setting on both amps (paralleled amps into various cabs)
Occasionally dial in a little mid when strings fading a bit or remove a little bass depending on venue.

Dave

[Lozz196]

[quote name='gub' timestamp='1345587203' post='1779285']
Sorry not trying to hijack the thread but lozz could you tell me what the flat setting is for the orange terror ? Sure I read something you said about it the other day but can't find it now ! ta
[/quote]

I`m sure I read somewhere it was something like Bass & Treb on 2 or 3, and Mids on 9. But, I`ve seen other comments saying it`s Bass/Treb on 4, Mids on 6. So I`m none the wiser

[Pinball]

I learned a lot from from playing lead. My first amp was a line 6 I picked up cheap with loads of modulating options but then I found that when I started adding in effects/multi-effects pedals I ended up endlessly fidling around with settings rather than playing. I changed the line 6 for a simpler peavy bandit, never touch the settings and have never looked back. I'm taking the same approach with bass and am sticking to 3 pedals-"keep it simple stupid" is my approach.

[bluesparky]

I was the proud owner of a Trace SMX rig a long time ago, and I'd spend ages fiddling with the EQ to dial in the perfect sound that I was after and ultimately I got there and I was really happy.
However at a gig I was playing at I let a chap from a support band use it and he promptly set it flat and then boosted the bass right up - without even asking or apologising - when I came to play I did my best to try and dial in what i had before but I just couldn't quite get the sound I had / was expecting to have and I was gutted and angry with myself for not sounding my best and also made me think twice about letting people I don't know use my stuff in the future.

Shortly afterwards I sold the whole rig and moved onto much simpler rigs (I've currently got a TC RH rig) and I'm loving the fact that it all sounds amazing straight out of the box.
Maybe I was being unnecessarily anal and obsessing about things with my Trace and there was barely any difference in the tweakings I was doing or it really did need that my of my work to get the sound I wanted out of it.
Who knows! But i'm happy with what I've got now and it's an system that barely has an EQ used on it except for a little nudge / boost / cut here and there depending on the room.

[Happy Jack]

[quote name='Lozz196' timestamp='1345678977' post='1780537']
I`m sure I read somewhere it was something like Bass & Treb on 2 or 3, and Mids on 9. But, I`ve seen other comments saying it`s Bass/Treb on 4, Mids on 6. So I`m none the wiser
[/quote]

Try starting with Bass and Treb set at 9 o'clock, and Mids at 12 o'clock. But be aware (stating the blindingly obvious) that you'll need different settings with pretty much every combination of bass + pedals.

With a Precision straight into my OTB on those settings, it sounds +++ AWESOME +++.

With a Wal Custom II straight in, it sounds +++ LIGHTWEIGHT +++. Roll that Bass knob back up again.

[Haydenr25]

[quote name='JohnFitzgerald' timestamp='1345585177' post='1779236']
I've been playing in a new band of late.
More of that to follow.

The rehearsal rooms are fairly well equipped.

The one we've been in the last few weeks has an Ampeg SVT450H into an EBS 8x10.
[/quote]

You don't happen to be in West Midlands, England do you? It's just there's a studio near me who uses those bass rigs.

[Jigster]

[quote name='Haydenr25' timestamp='1345708456' post='1780658']
You don't happen to be in West Midlands, England do you? It's just there's a studio near me who uses those bass rigs.
[/quote]

Robannas, Birmingham?

[gjones]

[quote name='bluesparky' timestamp='1345704447' post='1780603']
I was the proud owner of a Trace SMX rig a long time ago, and I'd spend ages fiddling with the EQ to dial in the perfect sound that I was after and ultimately I got there and I was really happy.
However at a gig I was playing at I let a chap from a support band use it and he promptly set it flat and then boosted the bass right up - without even asking or apologising - when I came to play I did my best to try and dial in what i had before but I just couldn't quite get the sound I had / was expecting to have and I was gutted and angry with myself for not sounding my best and also made me think twice about letting people I don't know use my stuff in the future.

Shortly afterwards I sold the whole rig and moved onto much simpler rigs (I've currently got a TC RH rig) and I'm loving the fact that it all sounds amazing straight out of the box.
Maybe I was being unnecessarily anal and obsessing about things with my Trace and there was barely any difference in the tweakings I was doing or it really did need that my of my work to get the sound I wanted out of it.
Who knows! But i'm happy with what I've got now and it's an system that barely has an EQ used on it except for a little nudge / boost / cut here and there depending on the room.
[/quote]

For whatever reason, whenever I have to play through a TE amp, it needs a lot of tweaking to get a usable sound.

[KevB]

[quote name='gjones' timestamp='1345710608' post='1780684']
For whatever reason, whenever I have to play through a TE amp, it needs a lot of tweaking to get a usable sound.
[/quote]

True to an extent but I found that once I got a sound I liked I didn't have to change it much more for different rooms etc. I still think that a well set up Trace rig is, considering the little money the older ones are going for these days second hand, as good a value for money set up as you are likely to get in the UK. I got a 1x15 combo plus 4x10 extension speaker for a total of £400 and I only retired the extension cab due to the weight and awkwardness of taking it to upstairs gigs, it was still performing well. Played through all sorts of rigs at jam sessions and rehearsal rooms that were way more expensive than my Trace but none of them were vastly superior in tone to my ears.

[Bilbo]

I know that Eden amps were always sold on the basis that your starting point eq-wise was everything flat and them tweak for room acoustic. I find that 'awesome' bass sounds don't work in the context of most of the gigs I do so my Wal sounds nice and, errr, un-awesome when it is plugged in. But I find the flat sound using my Eden to have too many mids so I am either trying to add more bass/treble to counter or roll off the mids, depending on the room, the music being played, the band (horns/piano or el gtr/keyboard/vox), the volume etc. I guess I like the versatility of my set up rather than there being one sound.

Regrettably, though, however hard I try, I always end up sounding like me.

[Raymondo]

[quote name='Jigster' timestamp='1345709514' post='1780672']
Robannas, Birmingham?
[/quote]
I thought that when I read the op......they also have some rooms with fabulous ahsdown rigs......I know ..I know ....personal opinion etc etc

[bluesparky]

[quote name='KevB' timestamp='1345712477' post='1780714']
I got a 1x15 combo plus 4x10 extension speaker
[/quote]

That's what I had too, I did really love it - it looked really cool too! But I was so annoyed about the issue at the gig, and coupled with the weight of the 4x10" cab I decided to let it all go for an overall more lightweight option

[Haydenr25]

[quote name='Jigster' timestamp='1345709514' post='1780672']
Robannas, Birmingham?
[/quote]

That's not the one, i'm in Walsall (just down the road) but funnily enough they have those rigs at a studio near me.

Edited August 23, 2012 by Haydenr25