sirmuppet Posted October 12, 2023 Share Posted October 12, 2023 Hi all. Am pretty certain this is a fake but just looking for confirmation. Wasn't given a model but I believe it's meant to be a 4001c64s based on the Paul McCartney bass. Has everything it should like Ric branded tuners, case and case candy. Truss rod cover looks genuine as does the bridge. The later I'm not 100% on the saddles. Has the satin finish that it should, reverse headstock and truss cover. Even has the zreo fret. Taking the pickguard off though and things start to look fake. The routing for the neck pickup to the control cavity looks bad. The final warning light is the trus rod, yup just one. I've owned a couple of Rics and this feels very good and if I hadn't have taken the pickguard ond cover off I'd have believed it to be genuine. Am just checking that I'm 100% correct that it's a fake before I go back, just in case they put a single truss rod in the model, I don't think they did but I have heard Rickenbacker are now using single truss rods. It's a niche model I'd think to fake and I can't find any of these fakes online. Any help would be great for going back to the seller. Thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kodiakblair Posted October 12, 2023 Share Posted October 12, 2023 17 minutes ago, sirmuppet said: The routing for the neck pickup to the control cavity looks bad. Looks better than some of their work. Here's a few Reverb photos. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AMV001 Posted October 12, 2023 Share Posted October 12, 2023 (edited) Since when did Rickenbacker start using mini pots? Shouldn't they be full size CTS? Caveat- I could be completely out of touch. I've only seen the inside of original 4001's. Edited October 12, 2023 by AMV001 Punctuation 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doctor J Posted October 12, 2023 Share Posted October 12, 2023 (edited) . Edited October 12, 2023 by Doctor J Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skybone Posted October 12, 2023 Share Posted October 12, 2023 I'm no expert on these, but the truss rod area and the neck pickup rout just don't look quite right. And shouldn't they have a "skunk stripe" as well? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sirmuppet Posted October 12, 2023 Author Share Posted October 12, 2023 2 hours ago, kodiakblair said: Looks better than some of their work. Here's a few Reverb photos. Ok, so that may not be a tell tail then, lol. Cheers for sending them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sirmuppet Posted October 12, 2023 Author Share Posted October 12, 2023 2 hours ago, AMV001 said: Since when did Rickenbacker start using mini pots? Shouldn't they be full size CTS? Caveat- I could be completely out of touch. I've only seen the inside of original 4001's. I did wonder that but haven't ever opened one up. I twice had Fenders that used mini pots when they generally use full size ones. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sirmuppet Posted October 12, 2023 Author Share Posted October 12, 2023 (edited) 1 hour ago, Skybone said: I'm no expert on these, but the truss rod area and the neck pickup rout just don't look quite right. And shouldn't they have a "skunk stripe" as well? Pickup route looked off to me. That said the channel is messy but lines up with what @kodiakblair posted but the pickup pocket doesn't look quite the same. The truss rod route looks fine but not as wide as it only has a single truss rod. The 4001C64S doesn't have a skunk stripe, so at least that looks correct. Edited October 12, 2023 by sirmuppet Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skybone Posted October 13, 2023 Share Posted October 13, 2023 The TRC doesn't look quite right either, it looks as though it's printed, rather than the usual "raised" lettering. Might be a build by a certain British luthier who does very accurate replicas. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sirmuppet Posted October 13, 2023 Author Share Posted October 13, 2023 22 minutes ago, Skybone said: The TRC doesn't look quite right either, it looks as though it's printed, rather than the usual "raised" lettering. Might be a build by a certain British luthier who does very accurate replicas. You're right it is flat. Is flat under but under a clear plexi. After much searching I did manage to find one of these on Aliexpress. It's a very good copy but there is an issue with the neck pickup. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
miles'tone Posted October 13, 2023 Share Posted October 13, 2023 Serial number on the jack socket plate? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hellzero Posted October 13, 2023 Share Posted October 13, 2023 (edited) Fake: There should be two truss rods! Edited October 13, 2023 by Hellzero Never type in a moving car... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NikNik Posted October 13, 2023 Share Posted October 13, 2023 (edited) Looks like a 4001 C64S carcass. Or one made by HW Edited October 13, 2023 by NikNik Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlueMoon Posted October 13, 2023 Share Posted October 13, 2023 Me thinks it’s a faker too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skybone Posted October 13, 2023 Share Posted October 13, 2023 5 hours ago, NikNik said: Looks like a 4001 C64S carcass. Or one made by HW I think it's a HW 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MungoBass Posted October 14, 2023 Share Posted October 14, 2023 (edited) I can’t recall seeing a Ric with a zero fret….was it special to this model? Edited October 14, 2023 by MungoBass 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
borntohang Posted October 15, 2023 Share Posted October 15, 2023 On 13/10/2023 at 08:03, sirmuppet said: You're right it is flat. Is flat under but under a clear plexi. After much searching I did manage to find one of these on Aliexpress. It's a very good copy but there is an issue with the neck pickup. The C64 and other reissues come with the original plexi-style printed plate rather than the raised version. Wiring isn't factory. The channel route is accurate. I haven't seen enough of the new single-truss models to have an opinion yet. If its a faker it's a significant jump above the average. Only thing that would really put me off is considering how few guitars Ric makes a year I can't see them prioritising a C64 run in the short time since they went to single truss. Have you sent Ric the Serial number yet? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chriswareham Posted October 15, 2023 Share Posted October 15, 2023 The single truss rod came out first on the Al Cisneros model bass a few years ago. I think it was then put into limited run models made over the next couple of years, which may account for this niche 4001C64S having one. So if the serial number indicates it being made in 2020 or so, it could be genuine. The cavities under the scratchplate looks the typical mixed bag of clean areas and then that bodgery with presumably a Forstner bit between the control cavity and neck pickup cavity. My genuine Rick 4003 has marker pen writing near the controls as well, so that may be factory. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rwillett Posted October 16, 2023 Share Posted October 16, 2023 What an interesting thread. I would have said it was fake based on the routing, it looks like I did it and was not what I would expect of an expensive guitar. Shows how little I know about Rickenbackers. Be interested in how this finishes. Always like learning new things. Thanks Rob 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
miles'tone Posted October 16, 2023 Share Posted October 16, 2023 I don't think Rickenbacker have made C64s for a decade or more so would have had the dual trussrods (especially because they were the more pricey "vintage correct" model. Kinda. A right handed version of a lefty...They also didn't have a zero fret. I'm going for a HW custom order tribute passed on as genuine. Happy to be wrong but that's where I'd place my bet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neepheid Posted October 16, 2023 Share Posted October 16, 2023 Wait, when did Rickenbacker start making Commodore 64s? 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doctor J Posted October 16, 2023 Share Posted October 16, 2023 50 minutes ago, miles'tone said: I don't think Rickenbacker have made C64s for a decade or more so would have had the dual trussrods (especially because they were the more pricey "vintage correct" model. Kinda. A right handed version of a lefty...They also didn't have a zero fret. I'm going for a HW custom order tribute passed on as genuine. Happy to be wrong but that's where I'd place my bet. I thought that about the zero fret, too, but there seem to be loads of them out there when you search for 4001c64s https://guitarchimp.com/products/2009-rickenbacker-4001c64s-mg-satin-mapleglo-bass-guitar-2 https://guitarchimp.com/products/2005-rickenbacker-4001c64-jetglo-bass-guitar 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bassassin Posted October 16, 2023 Share Posted October 16, 2023 (edited) I think this is a 70s/80s Japanese copy that someone's trying to fob off as genuine. To make it look more 'authentic' they've tried to make the pickup routing look rough & gone over the wiring channel with a forstner bit - notice how it's dead straight rather than the slight curve of the routing on genuine 4001s. The hardware (apart from the tuners) back up the theory - the chrome saddles & round tailpiece holes (real ones are more square) indicate it's a copy bridge, & the bridge pickup looks like the unit found in MIJ Shaftesbury 4001 fakers - the corners of the bobbin are much more squared-off than the genuine unit & the poles have rounded heads, not the hex heads of a modern Rick Hi-Gain or the squared-off slugs the pretendy horseshoe reissues have. The neck unit (which I assume is a toaster) has a single magnet rather than 6 individual poles a genuine toaster should have. Several Japanese brands had specific McCartney replicas - amongst others Greco, Kasuga/Heerby & Fernandes sold them in their home market in the 80s/90s (and probably later) and all of those would have had a single truss rod. A tenner says the one on this bass will be metric rather than the imperial size you'd imagine Rickenbacker would insist on! Edited October 16, 2023 by Bassassin 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MungoBass Posted October 16, 2023 Share Posted October 16, 2023 On 13/10/2023 at 11:12, NikNik said: Looks like a 4001 C64S carcass. Or one made by HW Who or what is HW? Don’t think I’ve heard of them… Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geddys nose Posted October 16, 2023 Share Posted October 16, 2023 Is this the Cash converter one with no serial number? If it is it sold on EBay for a BIN of £3000 but then turns up at Cash Convertors at half that. I thought it was a fake just off the photos, it looks like it trying to be genuine but something is not right. Hope you can get your money back. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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