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Musicman20

What's the big problem with 4x10s?!

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[quote name='Musicman20' timestamp='1343776667' post='1755237']
P basses sound like P basses through whatever you put it through.
I think the Ampeg 8x10 exists because players love the tone and it's a classic cab.
[color=#282828][font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif]I for one would have an 8x10... if I could transport it.[/font][/color][/quote]

I agree totally. Despite everything I've read here and elsewhere over the years regarding lightweight cabs and D-class amps, the most fun I've ever had with my clothes on is with a P bass, an Ampeg SVT-CL and an 8X10 cab. Got the most compliments for my playing while using it, too. This combination always sounds very right to me. Of course, I did have a roadie and a bass tech at the time, heh. :D

Edited by discreet

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[quote name='Mr. Foxen' timestamp='1343777795' post='1755248']


Yeah, hence the 8x10 being much cheaper to design, because it was done by 1969.
[/quote]

True, but expensive design doesn't equate to perfection. Many products are perfect by sheer luck on the first few attempts. Or simply because they know how to get it right.

Aren't most high end pa type bass cabs just basically copied off PA cabs and tweaked?

I mean, is the perfect flat response tone even that interesting?!

Edited by Musicman20

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[quote name='Musicman20' timestamp='1343778512' post='1755259']
Many products are perfect by sheer luck on the first few attempts.[/quote]

*Cough* Fender P-Bass! *Cough* :D

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A live venue is not an anechoic chamber. It is impossible to predict how a particular speaker arrangement will behave in any given venue.

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Just saying... I love my Matamp 4x10. It's sealed, it sounds absolutely amazing and I get MY sound from it alongside it cutting through the mix nicely. Would only ever get another one and make it an 810, think they sound great :) . I've been with 10" speakers for years now and haven't heard anything better. That said I've never been hands on with 12 inch speakers and my rig. Who cares though, I like my sound :) .

Find 15's a bit boomy for my tastes.

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[quote name='Musicman20' timestamp='1343778512' post='1755259']
I mean, is the perfect flat response tone even that interesting?!
[/quote]

I don't think you understand what dispersion is.

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[quote name='ashevans09' timestamp='1343780727' post='1755285']
I've been with 10" speakers for years now and haven't heard anything better...
Find 15s a bit boomy for my tastes.[/quote]

15s aren't boomy any more, but very glad you're happy with your 4X10. :D

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Hilarious the number of people who still think that the sound of a cab is dependent upon the diameter of the speakers in it...

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[size=6][sub]Some 15's certainly are as any pub band will likely show you... :lol:[/sub][/size]
[size=6][sub]Also, some 15's are designed and sold as being room fillers which is a small gig mentality as you wont want to use that with a FOH P.A.[/sub][/size]

[size=6][sub]The reason Ampeg fridges are popular on stage are twofold, IMV...1st, they are now iconic, and 2nd, they got that status because they did a job time and time again[/sub][/size]
[size=6][sub]and so became pretty much the reference point for stage rigs.[/sub][/size]

[size=6][sub]If you are playing stages... which might be the size of some pubs gig rooms.. :lol: you may or may not have a monitor mixer, but the last thig you want is a huge bass presense on that stage... that is what wedges and side fills are for ( if you need more sound and control ) ..so then it literaly become a bass monitor and Ampegs are good at putting out enough sound but not at boomy levels...[/sub][/size]
[size=6][sub]so you hear it but don't flood bleed everywhere else..[/sub][/size]

[size=6][sub]The sound engr likes this...[/sub][/size]



[size=6][sub]So... yes..nothing wrong with 410's... they produce the levels but shouldn't get too bass heavy[/sub][/size]

[size=6][sub]Like everything else...there are 410's and 410's tho...[/sub][/size]

Edited by JTUK

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[quote name='xgsjx' timestamp='1343776200' post='1755233']
If you get a choice of 8Ω or 4Ω versions of the cab you want, why would you want the 4Ω?
[/quote]

I always choose the 4ohm option, purely to prevent the option of buying another cab - which I know would happen. I have no restraint, so ensure the option isn`t there.

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[quote name='Mr. Foxen' timestamp='1343784323' post='1755296']


I don't think you understand what dispersion is.
[/quote]

That wasnt related to dispersion, that was just a comment. I personally wouldn't assume what people do and do not understand. It's not exactly a difficult subject, I'm just entering into discussion over whether the rules of what is right and wrong matter so much. Again, it's a piece of music, it's just bass, it's art if you like. Maybe the imperfections are what makes 'a sound' seem right to certain listeners?!

This surely gets some people over excited doesn't it!

Edited by Musicman20

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[quote name='JTUK' timestamp='1343803147' post='1755330']
[size=6][sub]Some 15's certainly are as any pub band will likely show you... :lol:[/sub][/size]
[size=6][sub]Also, some 15's are designed and sold as being room fillers which is a small gig mentality as you wont want to use that with a FOH P.A.[/sub][/size]

[size=6][sub]The reason Ampeg fridges are popular on stage are twofold, IMV...1st, they are now iconic, and 2nd, they got that status because they did a job time and time again[/sub][/size]
[size=6][sub]and so became pretty much the reference point for stage rigs.[/sub][/size]

[size=6][sub]If you are playing stages... which might be the size of some pubs gig rooms.. :lol: you may or may not have a monitor mixer, but the last thig you want is a huge bass presense on that stage... that is what wedges and side fills are for ( if you need more sound and control ) ..so then it literaly become a bass monitor and Ampegs are good at putting out enough sound but not at boomy levels...[/sub][/size]
[size=6][sub]so you hear it but don't flood bleed everywhere else..[/sub][/size]

[size=6][sub]The sound engr likes this...[/sub][/size]



[size=6][sub]So... yes..nothing wrong with 410's... they produce the levels but shouldn't get too bass heavy[/sub][/size]

[size=6][sub]Like everything else...there are 410's and 410's tho...[/sub][/size]
[/quote]

Exactly. There are awful 4x10s around. Just like there are many cabs loaded with 15s that can be boomy which has led to what we perceive. This isn't the case with all 15s.

Edited by Musicman20

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Have we had the standard "410s suck because dispersion is terrible" and "cab manufacturers don't know what they're doing" replies yet?

For me the only problem with 410s is weight. I'd use my 410RBHs in a heartbeat if I could be bothered to lug them around. My 212s sound just as good (though very different) and weigh less than half the weight so they're more practical. The music industry has used 410s as standard for decades, I'm sure if they've endured this long, they're capable of doing the job.

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[quote name='ThomBassmonkey' timestamp='1343805653' post='1755355']The music industry has used 410s as standard for decades, I'm sure if they've endured this long, they're capable of doing the job. [/quote]

They endured cassette tapes for a long time too. But CDs are a better medium.

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[quote name='xgsjx' timestamp='1343806160' post='1755363']
They endured cassette tapes for a long time too. But CDs are a better medium.
[/quote]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I'm pretty sure 210s aren't a new invention. ;)

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[quote name='ThomBassmonkey' timestamp='1343806258' post='1755364']
Correct me if I'm wrong, but I'm pretty sure 210s aren't a new invention. ;)
[/quote]

Nope, but our understanding of speakers has moved on from what it was in the 60s. :)

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The "problem" with dispersion and horizontal aligned speakers is that at the level most of us play it mostly affects the audience, not the player and then it's competing with far more obvious acoustic issues of the venue itself.

I'd also suggest that the reason most of the older bass "solutions" are deemed to sound good is mostly one of 50 years of familiarity of the sound.

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Orange obc 410 is the most amazing cab I've ever heard or used

Trouble is moving it

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[quote name='lojo' timestamp='1343807422' post='1755384']
Trouble is moving it
[/quote]

[url="http://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B0015NNON6/?tag=hydra0b-21&hvadid=9550944669&ref=asc_df_B0015NNON6"]http://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B0015NNON6/?tag=hydra0b-21&hvadid=9550944669&ref=asc_df_B0015NNON6[/url]

Job done ;)

T

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I love the fact there is always pages of this stuff on Basschat. If you spent more time playing with the gear that you have got, you'd find it easier to work round any short coming that you may or may not have in your gear.

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[quote name='EBS_freak' timestamp='1343808314' post='1755404']
I love the fact there is always pages of this stuff on Basschat. If you spent more time playing with the gear that you have got, you'd find it easier to work round any short coming that you may or may not have in your gear.
[/quote]

Kinda where I was coming from, ish. Shortcomings or not, a good 4x10 works.

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[quote name='xgsjx' timestamp='1343806160' post='1755363']


They endured cassette tapes for a long time too. But CDs are a better medium.
[/quote]

Vinyl.

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[quote name='Musicman20' timestamp='1343809975' post='1755433']
Vinyl.
[/quote]

I like vinyl, but it's downside is it's easily scratched & it jumps when you try playing it in a moving car. :)

I'm not saying 4x10s are rubbish. Far from it. But doesn't it make sense to have the knowledge about what a cab can & can't do & how well it projects across the audience (especially if your backline is your only sound source)?
Ideally you'd just have a wall of 10" drivers taking up the full wall. Then there'd be no dispersion issues.

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I like 4x10s because they look good on a stage. I think it's silly to say I like them because they have a particular sound because they don't. But yeah they're a bit heavy and awkward most of the time innit?

Truckstop

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The funny thing is, 99.9 % of the people on here wouldn't have thought anything about various speakers, designs, layouts whatever unless somebody else had planted that idea in their head.

Seriously, how many people on here have gone to a gig and gone, yup, that bass players sound is really letting him down due to his use of XYZ speaker cab?

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