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Matt P

Another Promethean Clone?

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[quote name='Budgetneil' timestamp='1331928079' post='1581166']
Ta for the review - my interest bad been pricked by the description on the G4M website but real world feedback is useful to calm "too good to be true" fears.

I've got a couple of questions:
How many speaker sockets are on the head?
If more than one, is it possible to connect up an extension cab with the head still in the combo and connected to it?
Cheers in advance.
[/quote]

There are 2 speaker sockets, 1 jack and 1 speakon. The speaker in the combo uses the jack socket. I haven't got a speakon equipped cable so I haven't been able to test this yet. Further complication is that my only 8 ohm cab has no speakon inputs, so I would need an even less useful speakon to jack cable.

I presume it would be possible, after all one of the attractive possibilities is putting a 1x10 extension underneath the main box to form a modular 2x10.

Anyone nearby able to help me out with a test? Either a shottie of a speakon > jack cable or a speakon equipped 8 ohm cab?

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[quote name='neepheid' timestamp='1331928915' post='1581185']
...Anyone nearby able to help me out with a test? Either a shottie of a speakon > jack cable or a speakon equipped 8 ohm cab?
[/quote]

I have the latter. ;)

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[quote name='neepheid' timestamp='1331928915' post='1581185']
There are 2 speaker sockets, 1 jack and 1 speakon. The speaker in the combo uses the jack socket. I haven't got a speakon equipped cable so I haven't been able to test this yet. Further complication is that my only 8 ohm cab has no speakon inputs, so I would need an even less useful speakon to jack cable.

I presume it would be possible, after all one of the attractive possibilities is putting a 1x10 extension underneath the main box to form a modular 2x10.

Anyone nearby able to help me out with a test? Either a shottie of a speakon > jack cable or a speakon equipped 8 ohm cab?
[/quote]

Most Speakon sockets on amps are comination Speakon/jack sockets. Have a closer look, might be able to put a jack into the middle. (On cabs they are not usually combinations as the intention is to seal the cab, jacks fail to do this).

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[quote name='4 Strings' timestamp='1331985117' post='1581692']
Most Speakon sockets on amps are comination Speakon/jack sockets. Have a closer look, might be able to put a jack into the middle. (On cabs they are not usually combinations as the intention is to seal the cab, jacks fail to do this).
[/quote]

Be careful with this...... it's only the Neutrik [b]NLJ2MD-V [/b]that allows you to do this. Most manufacturers do no use this as standard as it's an expensive socket. You could end up with a jack plug stuck in a Speakon socket if you are not careful

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[quote name='crez5150' timestamp='1331989477' post='1581779']
Be careful with this...... it's only the Neutrik [b]NLJ2MD-V [/b]that allows you to do this. Most manufacturers do no use this as standard as it's an expensive socket. You could end up with a jack plug stuck in a Speakon socket if you are not careful
[/quote]

No danger with this, the hole in the middle is too small to even think about accommodating a 1/4" jack :)

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Looks like an ideal amp for gigs where only stage-monitoring is needed. Just did a gig like that in fact, and the house bass amp was a Fender Rumble 100. Great sound, but nowhere near loud enough. Looks like this little fella would work a treat for those type of gigs.

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Right, for all you amp geeks I took the lid off yesterday:





All looks compact and bijou in there. If it goes pop then I guess it'll just go pop though - looks a lot closer to the definition of "no user serviceable parts inside" than my old Hartke HA3500 ;)

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[quote name='discreet' timestamp='1331655573' post='1576677']

I have an LM250 with no pre/post switch, and Markbass tell me the DI is post EQ.
[/quote]

Bit off-topic, but if it's like the LMII you can change it to pre EQ by moving a jumper inside the case.

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Matt, I must take some pics of the Promethean for comparison.
Yours look fairly neat though :)

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I ordered the 250w head version of that thing, plan to use it with a self-made cabinet with Eminence 15" woofer (so the eventually bad enclosure of the combo is out of the equation). Should receive it tuesday.

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[quote name='Matte_black' timestamp='1332719524' post='1592187']
I ordered the 250w head version of that thing, plan to use it with a self-made cabinet with Eminence 15" woofer [b](so the eventually bad enclosure of the combo is out of the equation)[/b]. Should receive it tuesday.
[/quote]

Can you expand upon the phrase in bold? I don't understand what you mean there. What does "eventually bad" mean? Over time it'll break? You'll outgrow it? :huh:

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I played through Matt's wee boxy yesterday... I have to say I was both surprised and impressed.

I once had a plonk through a Promethean 10" and in all honesty I didn't think much of it (sorry peeps) - it was aggressive and occupied a mid spot that wasn't good for my ears... to be fair it may just have been not set how I would have liked it... and yet despite others fiddling about with the settings I still never heard anything that blew my fringe back... even allowing for the tiny footprint. One could argue that this pronounced mid hump offers greater projection in a live situation and I agree but to me it was rather too exagerated.

When Matt said he was bringing his new toy around I expected it to be a poor facsimile of it's richer cousin.

Alas, my expectations were pleasantly crushed. I honestly think this sounded nicer. I can't say it's a Promethean killer because I haven't explored the Ibby enough but from my experiences of both, the RedSub impressed me the most.
Of course as a single 10 it was pushing the mids but I found it was focused while still allowing the character of the bass to come through. It was surprisingly flexible too and could produce a fair range of tones - including at the mere push of a bass or treble boost button some unexpectedly good sub-bass (probably not audible in anything other than a small room or through the aux out to headphones - I think the DI is post but we obviously didn't go down that route) or a lo-o-o-o-ot of ear-splitting top end sizzle. The EQ basically did what you asked it to do (ie reign in some mids - which I found necessary) without leaving you wanting a lot more tweakage. And the wee screw in foot brought it off the deck and improved the focus.

It wasn't all shits and giggles though (I promised Matt an honest review) after seeing what the wee combo could do on it's own, we soloed the head into my new 4ohm 2x10 and suddenly it came across sort of weedy - I don't mean weedy as in lacking power or bottom end (far from it - a school photo actually fell off a bookshelf while we were mucking about :D) but in the way that the more articulate cab accentuated some of the head's shortcomings, notably it's lack of warmth. Matt tried his best to adjust the colour and contour knobs (one of which was a sort of subtle version of the MB VLE) to correct this but we just couldn't quite find the clarity and warmth I'm used to from the LittleMark.
Another thing worth mentioning, I was playing an old '70's P bass (it was the most suitable all-rounder that wasn't detuned all to hell close to hand) and it's not the most wonderfully earthed bass at the best of times - through the LM + 2x10 you could here a little hiss which stopped once you earthed it by touching a string, through the RedSub you could hear a lot of hiss which was quelled but still remained audible when you touched an earth - so I suspect the RedSub head may be introducing a little errant noise (above that of the fan ;)). I don't suppose we should expect perfection considering the price point of the RedSub and perhaps comparing it to a LittleMark is unfair.
As experiments go the 2x10 was a little bit of a let down because of what it revealed about the head but if you think about it, it also proved how it's own wee cab is so very well designed to suit the head's characteristics and makes the most out of what it has to offer.
Speaking of the cab itself, I was taken aback at how solid it is for such a small box, not unmanageable by any stretch of the imagination but I expected it to be lighter - look how thick the side walls appear to be when seen from the front (must be about an inch thick) compared to the Promethean.

Overall I'd say that this combo should be quite usable for gigging small venues, marquees etc... but above all else it has to be said this wee combo is astronomic value for money... obviously some corners must have been cut to produce it at this price point (one would imagine it has cheaper components than the Promethean) and the hardware looks about right for the money. I suppose time will tell how reliable it ends up being but for now I say Matt's picked a winner. :)

Edited by Ou7shined

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[quote name='Ou7shined' timestamp='1332759400' post='1592542']
...I suppose time will tell how reliable it ends up being but for now I say Matt's picked a winner.
[/quote]

Very interesting indeed Rich, thanks very much for this review. :D

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I think the cabinet has a very important role in the final sound. Tomorrow I'll find out how the head works with a good quality cabinet. Of course if it's really disappointing I'm going to return it. :rolleyes:

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IME that mid spot on the Promethean is calmed by pulling the 800Hz slider down a bit.

Mind you, that only applies to solo practice. If I do anything with a band, the slider goes back to 0db...

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[quote name='Ou7shined' timestamp='1331936229' post='1581319']


I have the latter. ;)
[/quote]

Bring em all to the captains for an A-B test :)

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I must admit this amp is incredible. Mind you, I owned and tested several amps in these years... a friend of mine has a LittleMark250 and the BA250 sounds much better and is louder too (costing LESS than 50%!!!).
He came today and confirmed everything, so it's not due to the fact I'm deaf :lol:

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The head out of the RedSub got its first gig last night and it did a great job paired with my Zoot 4x10 - plenty loud enough not to need PA support (just as well as it wasn't on the cards) and a substantial, thick, chunky bass sound with my RD Artist. All bands used my rig without issue, one of them was using a P bass and while he might have had it turned up a mite too high for the relatively laid back band he was playing in it certainly made itself heard.

Plenty scope left in the EQ that I didn't need, enough oomph to fill a pretty big room on its own, and all contained in a laptop bag. I'm delighted with it and I think I've got a winner here.

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Hey neepheid, I notice you have a Hartke 3500 as well,I foolishly sold my one of these a few years back, and am now thinking of getting a redsub 500w head to replace my heavy Peavey tour450, how does the Redsub compare to the Hartke in terms of tone and volume? Seems too good to be true at that price and only weighing that much!! I play heavy rock, originals and covers, mostly using a Warwick standard corvette. Thanks in anticipation.....

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I've owned several heads, big and small... the Harley Benton has a very, very good power section. It doesn't have the "hole" in the bass frequencies that many class D have. The low end is thick and solid. I love mine. Probably will get the 500 too! :lol:

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[quote name='sykilz' timestamp='1333277103' post='1599424']
Hey neepheid, I notice you have a Hartke 3500 as well,I foolishly sold my one of these a few years back, and am now thinking of getting a redsub 500w head to replace my heavy Peavey tour450, how does the Redsub compare to the Hartke in terms of tone and volume? Seems too good to be true at that price and only weighing that much!! I play heavy rock, originals and covers, mostly using a Warwick standard corvette. Thanks in anticipation.....
[/quote]

It's a bit early to tell as I've only done one gig with it and in a brand new (to me) venue so I've no experience to A-B with. It certainly has no problem kicking up a fuss - for the gig the master was set to a little under half and the gain wasn't set super high, about 3/4 and it was plenty loud enough to be heard over the rest of the band and fill the pub with bass (minus a few blind spots downstairs) with no PA support. EQ-wise I had bass and treble boost on with the low/high controls at about 2 o' clock, a slight hump in the low mids on the graphic and the contour set in the middle (which is like half way round). Still playing around with it, but there's plenty to play around with so I'm happy with the initial outing and I'm confident that there's plenty scope in the EQ to cover most eventualities. The guy in the band before us used a P bass and it was doing its P bass thing in a most authoritative fashion. If anything it was maybe a bit too loud for their band - it was a more folky outfit with acoustic guitar, violin and a drummer playing with brushes. It blew them out of the water - normally this would be a bad thing but his mistake meant I could hear the bass super clear and I was pleased with what I heard :)

In summary, I will likely be moving the Hartke on - loyal servant though it has been it's such a big, burly beastie and once you've gone mini head it's a pain to go back. Perhaps there's a little more warmth in that valve preamp, but to be perfectly honest I didn't really notice much difference between the valve and solid state preamps in the HA3500, someone will tell me I must be deaf but I really didn't hear what all the fuss is about. What I always liked about the Hartke was the directness and preciseness in the sound, it was bright and modern and just sounded great straight away - I never used the high/low controls on it and just put a bit of a sad face on the graphic for live and a happy face for playing by myself and cracked on with it. There's more to fiddle with on the RedSub and fiddle I shall. It doesn't sound as good as the Hartke when everything's flat, I'll tell you that - a bit harsh, a bit too "middy" but it's that's easy to tame with the contour control. Then EQ for additional flavour/room suitability.

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