Which Blues songs?

[Earbrass]

[quote name='skankdelvar' post='1279811' date='Jun 23 2011, 04:53 PM']IMO there's nothing more perfectly buttock-clenching than watching a plump white-collar middle-aged Englishman singing about 'his' experiences on a chain-gang in 1930's Alabama. It's just [i]silly[/i].[/quote]

And by the same token, unless you actually [i][b]have[/b][/i] shot a man in Reno, just to watch him die, I'd avoid the Folsom Prison Blues, too.

[Count Bassy]

[quote name='Bloodaxe' post='1279295' date='Jun 23 2011, 02:07 AM']No, just because of all the slow blues tunes that are available it's [i]always[/i] ******* Red House that floats to the top. Bit like the Allman's take on Stormy Monday & the Santana version of Black Magic Woman.[/quote]

Aah, the good old Mustang Sally effect! A good song that suffers from it's popularity - 'sometimes you just can't win'.

[Count Bassy]

[quote name='Earbrass' post='1279898' date='Jun 23 2011, 05:33 PM']And by the same token, unless you actually [i][b]have[/b][/i] shot a man in Reno, just to watch him die, I'd avoid the Folsom Prison Blues, too.[/quote]

By that token though there's very few songs first person songs that anyone can legitimately sing. (E.g. shake your money maker - I haven't got a girl who lives up in the hill - does that mean I can't play it).
Also, AFAIK, Johnny Cash didn't actually shoot a man in Reno, so what was he doing writing that song in the first place?

[chris_b]

I was dusting my broom earlier so I'm OK.

[skankdelvar]

[quote name='Happy Jack' post='1279846' date='Jun 23 2011, 05:08 PM']In all fairness, Paul, if it wasn't for bad luck then I'd have no luck at all.[/quote]
Where falling off bikes is concerned, that would indeed seem to be the case.

[quote name='chris_b' post='1279930' date='Jun 23 2011, 06:06 PM']I was dusting my broom earlier so I'm OK.[/quote]
I once heard this (incorrectly) delivered as "I beleeeeve, I beleeeve I'll dust my room". Images of Elmore James in a floral pinafore with a can of Pledge.

Edited June 23, 2011 by skankdelvar

[leschirons]

Assuming you're not all going to be sitting down on the front porch and banging you feet in time to a 3 string slide guitar, you could listen to some of the more rockier versions of stuff. Check out The L.A. Blues authority. The line up changes every album and they usually have lots of "guest" guitarists to give different slants on numbers.

[pete.young]

[quote name='skankdelvar' post='1279956' date='Jun 23 2011, 06:30 PM']Where falling off bikes is concerned, that would indeed seem to be the case. [/quote]

It could have worse, at least the ground was there to break his fall.

Big +1 for Heathy for mentioning the great Rory Gallagher - I think 'Hands Off' is a brilliant song which doesn't use the 12-bar format.

There are several people in this forum who should be singing the wise words of the legendary Martin Mull:

Well I woke up this afternoon, and both cars were gone
I was so upset, I threw my drink across the lawn.

[Earbrass]

[quote name='Count Bassy' post='1279912' date='Jun 23 2011, 05:44 PM']By that token though there's very few songs first person songs that anyone can legitimately sing. (E.g. shake your money maker - I haven't got a girl who lives up in the hill - does that mean I can't play it).
Also, AFAIK, Johnny Cash didn't actually shoot a man in Reno, so what was he doing writing that song in the first place?[/quote]

Yes, that was the point I was trying to make, in a roundabout kind of way. I agree with Skank's point to some extent - but as you say, where do you stop? Singing is often also acting - I suppose the question is whether the singer can adequately act the role required by the song.

You get a similar issue arising in traditional English folk music as well. Most folk singers nowadays have never even seen a gander-bag, let alone a cordwangle. (showing my age again, I fear)

Edited June 23, 2011 by Earbrass

[skankdelvar]

[quote name='Earbrass' post='1280352' date='Jun 23 2011, 11:38 PM']Most folk singers nowadays have never even seen a gander-bag, let alone a cordwangle.[/quote]
Beyond my ken, I'm afraid.

FWIW, I'm believe that everyone everywhere should play whatever they like. It would just be nice if [i]some[/i] singers could deliver a blues in such a way as the words make some kind of sense as a communication. Or write some songs about something that happened yesterday rather than fifty years ago.

Edited June 24, 2011 by skankdelvar

[chris_b]

[quote name='skankdelvar' post='1280420' date='Jun 24 2011, 01:08 AM']....Or write some songs about something that happened yesterday rather than fifty years ago....[/quote]
Help The Poor seems pretty relevant these days, especially if you're a musician!

[Bloodaxe]

[quote name='skankdelvar' post='1280420' date='Jun 24 2011, 01:08 AM']Beyond my ken, I'm afraid.

FWIW, I'm believe that everyone everywhere should play whatever they like. It would just be nice if [i]some[/i] singers could deliver a blues in such a way as the words make some kind of sense as a communication. Or write some songs about something that happened yesterday rather than fifty years ago. [/quote]
Broadly agree.

I do find it wryly amusing [i]and[/i] a bit naff to see a 50-something cab driver from Essex proclaim that he 'was born in Chicago in 1941'. Still a good tune though.

[Jazzneck]

[quote name='Bloodaxe' post='1280444' date='Jun 24 2011, 02:19 AM']Broadly agree.

I do find it wryly amusing [i]and[/i] a bit naff to see a 50-something cab driver from Essex proclaim that he 'was born in Chicago in 1941'. Still a good tune though.[/quote]

I met and jammed with a 50 something [b] American[/b] cab driver living and working in Essex a few years ago - minor problem though, he's a drummer!

[Happy Jack]

[quote name='Earbrass' post='1279898' date='Jun 23 2011, 05:33 PM']And by the same token, unless you actually [i][b]have[/b][/i] shot a man in Reno, just to watch him die, I'd avoid the Folsom Prison Blues, too.[/quote]

That song has become one of the highlights of our gigs, but our singer changes that word.

In recent weeks, he's shot a man in Acton, in Brentford, and in Chiswick. Routinely gets a laugh from the punters.

[Ian Savage]

[quote name='skankdelvar' post='1280420' date='Jun 24 2011, 01:08 AM']Or write some songs about something that happened yesterday rather than fifty years ago. [/quote]

Ian Siegal - Bloodshot

Well I woke up, I was fully clothed,
I got bloodstains all around my nose.
And somebody stole my telephone,
And I don't know how in the world I got home...

[Slipperydick]

Whatever numbeers you choose to do - make sure it actually is Blues.

[url="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xP5EC1S_F20"]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xP5EC1S_F20[/url]


[url="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nU1Kulp-wvA&NR=1"]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nU1Kulp-wvA&NR=1[/url]

Edited June 24, 2011 by Slipperydick

[timmyo]

[quote name='skankdelvar' post='1279811' date='Jun 23 2011, 04:53 PM']You touch upon an area which has energised me for some time. IMO there's nothing more perfectly buttock-clenching than watching a plump white-collar middle-aged Englishman singing about 'his' experiences on a chain-gang in 1930's Alabama. It's just [i]silly[/i]. Parchman Farm. Don't go there.

Not sure that it's [i]wrong[/i], though. If someone wants to cover a song they like and with whose sentiments they sympathise, then it's between them and their audience. But I think they're missing the point about da Blooz, which is that it was - originally - mostly about personal or contemporary 'issues'. Problem is, people deliver the old songs without really understanding what they mean. The words are just sounds that they're trying to reproduce.

For me, performance is about engaging minds as well as feet. So blues without meaning - and I don't mean this unkindly - is lacking in foundation. If one wishes to more fruitfully engage with the blues, it might be more rewarding to update and more precisely localise the message. This entails re-writes or originals, which flies in the face of certain audiences' expectations. It's not easy.

Equally - given that much of the blues canon was informed by then-prevailing social and political circumstances, it's difficult [i]not[/i] to step on someone's long-dead toes. Even though the motivating social deprivation is entirely unarticulated, one might argue that "Saturday Night Fish Fry" or "House Rent Boogie" or "Born under a bad sign" should be equally off-limits.

At which point the pool of available covers would shrink by an order of magnitude such as to clog setlists with even more renditions of the 'same old songs'. Back to the drawing board.[/quote]

I'm going to register a big fat "disagree" with this

Similarly unless I really have been shook all night long, is ACDC off limits? What if I don't know anyone called Angie? Stones denied?

Piffle.

Enjoy the music. If you can feel the groove, and plant that in your audience, get on with it. If you can identify, with any aspect of a song, even in a fairly oblique sense, and it helps you put that song across even better, then that's fantastic. But nothing is off limits on the grounds of 'credibility'.

[skankdelvar]

[quote name='timmyo' post='1283103' date='Jun 26 2011, 04:20 PM']I'm going to register a big fat "disagree" with this ... Enjoy the music. If you can feel the groove, and plant that in your audience, get on with it.[/quote]
I'm a bit confused. Which bit did you disagree with? This bit?

[quote]If someone wants to cover a song they like and with whose sentiments they sympathise, then it's between them and their audience[/quote]
Or from a follow-up post:

[quote]FWIW, I'm (sic) believe that everyone everywhere should play whatever they like.[/quote]
So, actually, we're in agreement on that. Like you, I was posting to disagree with the proposition that certain songs should be off-limits

Perhaps I've lost my Mojo. If you'd like to revisit my posts, you'll see that - for myself - I think it would be nice if the blues had a bit more contemporary relevance. And that I find wobbly Brits overdoing the old-school bluesman thing a bit embarrassing. That's just me. Perhaps it's the obligatory hats.

Edited June 26, 2011 by skankdelvar

[SteveK]

[quote name='timmyo' post='1283103' date='Jun 26 2011, 04:20 PM']I'm going to register a big fat "disagree" with this

Similarly unless I really have been shook all night long, is ACDC off limits? What if I don't know anyone called Angie? Stones denied?

Piffle.[/quote]
Yeah, you've got a point.
Not knowing a young lady called Angie is really quite similar to never having experienced the appalling, brutal treatment of African Americans.

Kinda feels to me like saying to someone who has lost a baby in the most awful circumstances, "I know how you feel". Fact is, most of us don't have a clue.

Anyway, I didn't want to make a big deal of it. As I said in post #22 it is only my view, and having discussed this subject with many musicians over the years, I am fully aware that I'm in the minority.

[timmyo]

[quote name='SteveK' post='1283450' date='Jun 26 2011, 10:34 PM']Yeah, you've got a point.
Not knowing a young lady called Angie is really quite similar to never having experienced the appalling, brutal treatment of African Americans.

Kinda feels to me like saying to someone who has lost a baby in the most awful circumstances, "I know how you feel". Fact is, most of us don't have a clue.

Anyway, I didn't want to make a big deal of it. As I said in post #22 it is only my view, and having discussed this subject with many musicians over the years, I am fully aware that I'm in the minority. [/quote]

Making a very bold statement then drawing back with 'I don't want to make a big deal' is classic passive-aggressive behaviour - do you want to discuss it or not?

For the record, that doesn't kinda feel anything like similar. I just find the whole "white men can't sing the blues" argument to be a silly one.

[SteveK]

[quote]Making a very bold statement then drawing back with 'I don't want to make a big deal' is classic passive-aggressive behaviour[/quote] Wasn't aware that I had made "a very bold statement"

[i]classic passive-aggressive behaviour[/i]??

[quote]do you want to discuss it or not?[/quote]There's nothing to discuss... said my piece... end of!

[quote]I just find the whole "white men can't sing the blues" argument to be a silly one.[/quote]I'd agree with that...but, who, in this thread, has said that?

[spinynorman]

In "Escaping the Delta" Elijah Wald makes a pretty strong case that the whole blues-oppression-slavery idea was a myth created by American folklorists and that most of the old blues players were as up for the contemporary equivalent of Mustang Sally as anyone.

"Born under a Bad Sign" was written by Booker T, of Green Onions fame.

As the Bonzos said, can blue men sing the whites?

[timmyo]

[quote name='SteveK' post='1283841' date='Jun 27 2011, 10:54 AM'] Wasn't aware that I had made "a very bold statement"[/quote]

The one about dead children? Yeah, silly me.

[quote name='SteveK' post='1283841' date='Jun 27 2011, 10:54 AM'][i]classic passive-aggressive behaviour[/i]?? [/quote]

If you can't see it, again in those posts, then yep, that's funny.

[tauzero]

[quote name='Earbrass' post='1279898' date='Jun 23 2011, 05:33 PM']And by the same token, unless you actually [i][b]have[/b][/i] shot a man in Reno, just to watch him die, I'd avoid the Folsom Prison Blues, too.[/quote]
Under new EC regulations, shooting a man in Reno just to watch him die must be done alongside a control experiment where a man in Reno is not shot.

[SteveK]

[quote name='timmyo' post='1284988' date='Jun 28 2011, 09:44 AM']The one about dead children? Yeah, silly me.



If you can't see it, again in those posts, then yep, that's funny.[/quote]
Oh dear, I do seem to have ruffled your feathers!

Edited June 28, 2011 by SteveK

[JTUK]

[quote name='danweb22' post='1278594' date='Jun 22 2011, 03:00 PM']Hi all,

Been asked to play bass in a blues cover band, any suggestions on what songs would go down well/popular choices?

Don't really know many blues songs apart from the obvious Hendrix/Clapton stuff.

Thanks in advance! [/quote]


Haven't read through all this but to the OP..

Consider a blues song as literally a template that you can take anywhere and give the playes a chance to stretch out...but not to silly proportions.and only if they have anything to say musically...but then I'd apply this to most covers..but that is another 50 threads on here..!!