Attendance Concerns

[Bluewine]

On 13/10/2025 at 07:07, Steve Browning said:

An interesting contribution to a Facebook thread (not from me, I should add) that has relevance ot us here.

 

I’d just like to chip in my views on all of this, as I hold some pretty strong opinions on the state of things right now. I’m both a hospitality consultant and a musician that plays across the UK, so I can see the issues on both sides. I feel this gives me a fairly balanced take on the problems, though I do think the blame rests mostly with venue operators.

1st issue:

Many venues book the band but then expect the band to do everything. The ones that offer ticket split type shows are the worst for not promoting anything. They already have their captive audience, but it has to be a team effort when it comes to marketing.

2nd issue:

You have to spend money on promotions. Gone are the days where a crappy poster and a couple of Facebook posts were enough. The time has to go into it. We’ve played around 30-40 gigs this year and most of them have sold out. The common denominator is that both the venue and ourselves have spent money on sponsored posts and time on content. That’s the world we live in now. A crappy Facebook event isn’t bringing anyone that wasn’t already going to come. This should be agreed and decided at the point of booking - it pays dividends on the night.

3rd issue:

If it’s a fixed fee, the venue and band should decide what’s being spent on marketing, and that should be factored into any payments or costs. For covers and tribute bands, the best policy is usually for the venue or promoter to head up marketing. It makes the biggest difference as they have the captive audience in their area.

4th issue:

Venues need to understand that bands aren’t cheap and stop mugging people off. It’s often a 10-12 hour day including travel. £300 between six people should not happen. Bands also need to stop selling themselves short for £5 an hour. If a venue can’t afford to pay a band properly, they need to rethink their goals - book solo acts, duos, or DJs instead who are better quality. If you’re getting £300 bands, no wonder nobody’s coming. It’s because they’re probably shit and you’ve built a rep for having mediocre bands

5th issue:

We can’t change the world, so we have to live with it as it is. Stop trying to run pubs like it’s 1970. It’s a digital world now. If you can’t get on board with socials as a pub manager, employ a company to do it all - otherwise you will inevitably fail.

6th issue:

I wouldn’t worry too much about pubs having gigs listed on their website. Most pub websites get very few views aside from people checking opening times and menus. It’s handy as a ticket outlet with direct links from socials, but that’s about it. Socials are the absolute decider in whether venues fill or not.

Lastly, for bands:

Work on actually creating a brand and image for yourselves. Don’t just be another dad rock band or claim to be the number one tribute. Put some effort into creating something memorable that stands out and stop accepting shitty gigs. Be more selective about who you work with and where you play - it all adds to your image. The first thing I look at before booking anyone is where else they’ve played. If it’s a bunch of skanky, run down pubs that are on their last legs, I’m probably going to look elsewhere.

In short, both sides have got lazy or are too stubborn to move with the times. Both must.

Formula for a dead night:

Shit band + no promotion.

Cost to average size venue: the band and

Running at 50% capacity. Let’s say a venue can take £6k on the bar on a busy night - you lose £300 on a cheap band and miss out on £3k of sales.

Gross for the night: £2.7k (without other factors or overcomplicating it).

Formula to sell the place out:

Fairly decent band (£800) + £200 on marketing.

Venue at 100% capacity.

Gross for the night: £5k. Even more if it’s ticketed. Plus a growing rep for having the best bands around on.

Why venues don’t understand these simple maths is beyond me. There’s no excuse.

If a venue says “Even if I promote it, it doesn’t work”, then either you’re promoting it wrong, or your venue is already past the point of no return and you probably need to start thinking of a plan B.

 

Agreed. Would you agree that some pubs and bars are just not good for live music. After 15 years, I have to say we turn down more gigs than we accept.  And we play close to 65 shows a year.

 

Of course a lot depends on your location.  We still have a few live venues with a built in crowd. Meaning when we play there we'll have a good crowd without exception. And how about the gig where the venue is packed and the crowd has zero interest in your band or anyone else's band.

 

And here's another thought . What some of us think is a good crowd might not be a good crowd to someone else.

 

When we play The Bend Theatre we always have close to a full house. Last month we sold 230 seats . The theater holds 300. We were not fully responsible for selling 230 seats. It's an established well organized venue with a " built in " crowd.

 

I'll post the puc from from the last gig we played at The Harley Motor Museum & Restaurant.  It's an example of poor planning by inexperienced people. 

 

Daryl

Edited 7 hours ago by Bluewine