Short Scale Neck-Dive Question

[thebrig]

I play mainly P basses because they just fit perfectly with the music I play, but I do suffer from back and shoulder problems and have tried a few short scale basses over the years such as Mustangs, but although they were much lighter and easier to play because of their compact size, I just couldn't get on with the neck-dive and felt that I was holding the neck up all the time whilst playing.

 

So my question is: If I stuck with them, would I eventually get used to them?

Edited October 13, 2023 by thebrig

[Jono Bolton]

A stool is generally cheaper than a new bass

[Jono Bolton]

Being serious though, I've not tried any Fender-style short scales that didn't have a bit of neck dive. I'd probably look at swapping the tuners for lightweight ones to see if it helps balance things out

[thebrig]

6 minutes ago, Jono Bolton said:

Being serious though, I've not tried any Fender-style short scales that didn't have a bit of neck dive. I'd probably look at swapping the tuners for lightweight ones to see if it helps balance things out

Yes that might might a difference because the tuners on a Mustang are full size heavy tuners.

Edited October 13, 2023 by thebrig

[Lozz196]

I’ve switched allegiances from Precisions to Mustangs this year and whilst there’s a bit of neck dive if I remove my left hand completely from the neck I don’t notice it otherwise.

[BigRedX]

Only one of the many short scale basses I've owned has ever exhibited any neck dive and that was down to the body shape rather than the scale length. On the other hand none of them have been even vaguely Fender-like in design.

[neepheid]

What kind of strap are you using?

[Rexel Matador]

No solutions from me I'm afraid but I'm curious - why do Mustangs have worse neck-dive than Precisions? They both seem to have the upper horn strap button roughly in line with the 12th fret and you would think that the shorter neck gave it less torque. Is it because the body is lighter providing less counter-weight?

[thebrig]

53 minutes ago, neepheid said:

What kind of strap are you using?

I use a wide leather strap which I've used for years

[thebrig]

35 minutes ago, Rexel Matador said:

No solutions from me I'm afraid but I'm curious - why do Mustangs have worse neck-dive than Precisions? They both seem to have the upper horn strap button roughly in line with the 12th fret and you would think that the shorter neck gave it less torque. Is it because the body is lighter providing less counter-weight?

I would imagine it's because the body of the Mustang is considerably shorter than that of a P bass, meaning it doesn't balance so well.

[three]

I've sort of given-up on perseverance with neck diving shorties.  Some seem to be much worse than others (Alembic small-bodied shorties for example).  I suspect the OP is right re: body dimensions with the Mustangs.  I used to love Mustangs and learned on one as a much younger man - the dive didn't bother me then.  If there's a chance, try a Wilcock or Spector Bantam/Shorty - I haven't experienced any dive with either.  So in short, and to answer directly, I stuck with it, didn't get used to it, and made changes to non-diving alternatives.

[ezbass]

One would think that the Ibanez, headless shorty (EHB1000S) would be dive free, but I have no practical experience of it.

[fretmeister]

Sandberg Lionels don't neck dive. They already use super lightweight tuners. The body shape is slightly different from a usual Fender to make them lighter and have better balance.

 

Replacing Mustang tuners with USA Hipshot Ultralites will knock off nearly 1/3 of a pound from the end of the neck - that makes a massive difference for balance. The Mustang shape just isn't great for balance otherwise.

 

Grippy straps can be a help but really all they are doing is causing a weird forward pulling on your shoulder that causes its own problems. Having the bass designed properly in the first place is a far better option.

[TheGreek]

Isn't there another thread running currently with a "gadget " built by one of our members to offset the neckdive. 

 

I'll see if I can find it.

[Lozz196]

I might just sort some Ultralites for the 2 Mustangs I use with my bands, I’m sure Hipshot will advise which ones I’d need for a JMJ.

[bassist_lewis]

I've never played a Mustang with neck dive. I'd say try a different one.

[TheGreek]

Try the "Shortscale Bass Comparison in Pictures" thread

[Franticsmurf]

4 hours ago, ezbass said:

One would think that the Ibanez, headless shorty (EHB1000S) would be dive free, but I have no practical experience of it.

I have an EHB1000s and there's no neck dive, as you correctly suspected.

 

I used to play an Epiphone EB0 and that had bad neck dive. I got used to it when playing but between songs it would slip if I wasn't hanging on and that was annoying enough to eventually let it go.

[meterman]

Every time I’ve had a a bass or guitar that has a bit of neck dive I’d use an old vintage strap that has a rough suede back to it. The grippiness of the strap would usually fix any neck dive issues.

 

Except on my Hofner violin bass, which was one of the reasons I never kept it. But generally, a grippy strap worked well for me 👍

[MJJS]

Sire U5 ( which is 4 string )

 

Atelier ZPO 4 (if you can find one)

 

If your budget runs to an ACG you won’t be disappointed.

 

[crazycloud]

On 14/10/2023 at 00:14, thebrig said:

So my question is: If I stuck with them, would I eventually get used to them?

I sold my Jag because of the stupid overlarge paddle of a headstock and heavy tuners, and kept my Samick SS with tiny headstock that otherwise looked similar, has perfect balance, sounded great and cost about 70 quid S/H mint.

 

On 14/10/2023 at 00:22, Jono Bolton said:

A stool is generally cheaper than a new bass

Perfect description of the Jag.

Why pay for and carry a seat and be limited in movement on stage due to foolish ergonomics?