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New Mesa Walkabout-style high powered amp WD-800....and new cabs...

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1 minute ago, Al Krow said:

Ok in which case, they should be £999 in the UK allowing for shipping, customs and VAT at 20%.

Not £1,299.

I think that's the crux of it :)

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2 hours ago, agedhorse said:

There sure appears be a lot of negative comments and speculation here on this side of the pond about an amp that you guys have never even played. Not sure why, but here's a video from a player in Germany who spent some time and effort to create something that might help you understand this amp a bit more:

 

 

great demo @agedhorse (mind you I skipped 2/3 of the parametrics!) 

I don't think there's that much negativity here, from my POV and having not heard it, it's probably in the top two of my best and most interesting new amps available now to buy. The features are well thought out and from the demo it nails some of the Walkabout sound that I like. 

However, and in trying to explain some of the feelings you're picking up...

Say I wanted a new amp, and went to our specialist UK bass shops and went to Bassdirect, and the Bass Gallery, I also went online to see what Thomann would sell me.
My spec sheet is I want a new amp in the 700-1200w range from. I want something lightweight so I'm not looking at the SVT options or anything with a valve power stage... So I go online to a great bass forum like Basschat...and maybe google also takes me to Talk bass and I get a list of available makers...

  • Aguilar
  • Ampeg 
  • Ashdown
  • Bergantino
  • Darkglass
  • EBS
  • Eich
  • EA
  • Fender
  • Genzler
  • GK
  • Glockenklang
  • MarkBass
  • Orange
  • Quilter
  • TC Electronic
  • Trickfish
  • Warwick
  • and of course Mesa...

Now having just checked those three retailers websites, I could choose any of the amps manufactured by any of those companies (excepting big SVT and valve power stages) and the Mesa WD-800 is the most expensive option to me, of any of them! I can pick and choose of a worlds worth of high end bass amps, from mass manufactured through to boutique, and the WD800 is the priciest of them all. 

Now I've no doubt it's a great amp, maybe one of the best - but over here, on price alone, Mesa position themselves as the Porsche of the amp world. Maybe that's justified, but a lot of us will never get to own a Porsche. 

 

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I certainly understand the challenge with pricing, that's something that is set by the dealer selling the product which we have no say in. 

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3 minutes ago, agedhorse said:

I certainly understand the challenge with pricing, that's something that is set by the dealer selling the product which we have no say in. 

It’s been like that for years. It’s a shame.

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10 minutes ago, agedhorse said:

I certainly understand the challenge with pricing, that's something that is set by the dealer selling the product which we have no say in. 

Ok the ridiculously high pricing is down to Bassdirect rather than Mesa, if that's the case.

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Posted (edited)
28 minutes ago, Al Krow said:

Ok the ridiculously high pricing is down to Bassdirect rather than Mesa, if that's the case.

I don't think it can be the retailer?  I doubt they make that much margin on these products.  Perhaps it's the distributor for Mesa in Europe who is setting the pricing?

Its a shame, I'd love a MESA rig but, even though I could probably stretch to afford one, as LukeRFC pointed out there are so many other quality options at lower price points it's really hard to justify.

Maybe after Brexit we'll agree a trade deal with the US and prices will tumble down :)

Edited by PJ-Bassist
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21 minutes ago, agedhorse said:

I certainly understand the challenge with pricing, that's something that is set by the dealer selling the product which we have no say in. 

I think it's more how the Mesa>distributer>retailer model works.

Mesa seem to be one of the good guys in the business in terms of how they act, and the products look and sound amazing and there are probably massive benefits in having a distributer doing that work for you, liasing with retailers, and for being that interface to help deal with repairs. I'm not criticising any company being set up that way because it probably makes sense - but it does add on a whack to the prices (both new and for parts) for us, and must limit then number of units you can sell to Europe.

But hey, I'm sure that goes the other way too for other items that are made in the EU or UK.

 

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Posted (edited)
14 hours ago, agedhorse said:

I certainly understand the challenge with pricing, that's something that is set by the dealer selling the product which we have no say in. 

If price is set by the dealer, are you suggesting a conspiracy among dealers in Europe who all agree to set the price at around £500 above the USA level?

Edited by Beedster
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How about just selling direct to stores...because the old style distributor model doesn't work if you ask me.

I'd love to own one of these amps but unfortunately it is extremely expensive in the UK. Massive shame. 

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Posted (edited)

In Mesa's defence the price of the WD-800 and D800 series is a lot lower than the 'new' prices of the original Walkabout (circa £1500 a few years ago) or amps such as the Big Block 750, M6 and M9 that were about £1800 or above to be purchased 'as new' when they were on the market. In that sense, I was honestly expecting the price point of the WD-800 to be in the £1,500 - £2,000 region given its 'newness' and the feature set.

For me, I can live with the price of the WD-800, in the sense that Mesa new premium bass head is £1300 rather than £2,000. However the cost of the new line cabs (£2,175 for the 2x15 and 4x10, £1,575 for the 2x12) is really prohibitive for potential purchasers in the UK, no matter how good the cabs are (I have no doubt that they are exceptional, but so is a lot of the competition).

Edited by thodrik
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Posted (edited)

How many folks over these last 10 pages have spent £1299 or more on a single item of gear? Sure this amp is more expensive than in the USA but it's funny to read comments about cost when folks are playing £1500+ basses, amps, pedal boards with a months wages worth of boxes and devices. At the end of the day we spend our money how we want on the items we feel offer value etc. I get that it's more costly here than the USA but it's Mesa! The Strategy head is nearly £3500!!!

Everyone is free to express their outrage of course...

To add to thodrik's comment. I'd be more outraged at the cost of the cabs if anything! The amp seems positively affordable compared to the cabs!

Edited by krispn
Updated
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1 hour ago, thodrik said:

In Mesa's defence the price of the WD-800 and D800 series is a lot lower than the 'new' prices of the original Walkabout (circa £1500 a few years ago) or amps such as the Big Block 750, M6 and M9 that were about £1800 or above to be purchased 'as new' when they were on the market. In that sense, I was honestly expecting the price point of the WD-800 to be in the £1,500 - £2,000 region given its 'newness' and the feature set.

For me, I can live with the price of the WD-800, in the sense that Mesa new premium bass head is £1300 rather than £2,000. However the cost of the new line cabs (£2,175 for the 2x15 and 4x10, £1,575 for the 2x12) is really prohibitive for potential purchasers in the UK, no matter how good the cabs are (I have no doubt that they are exceptional, but so is a lot of the competition).

 

1 hour ago, krispn said:

How many folks over these last 10 pages have spent £1299 or more on a single item of gear? Sure this amp is more expensive than in the USA but it's funny to read comments about cost when folks are playing £1500+ basses, amps, pedal boards with a months wages worth of boxes and devices. At the end of the day we spend our money how we want on the items we feel offer value etc. I get that it's more costly here than the USA but it's Mesa! The Strategy head is nearly £3500!!!

Everyone is free to express their outrage of course...

To add to thodrik's comment. I'd be more outraged at the cost of the cabs if anything! The amp seems positively affordable compared to the cabs!

I don't disagree with either point, I think it's the differential between US and UK prices that's the issue, which appears to be an $800 mark-up on a $999 unit in this case. Mesa gear always appears disproportionately more expensive in this context? 

 

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The price of my brand new 400+ was just shy of £1500 in the late 90's. The Bass Centre ordered it for me and were surprised to find Mesa dictating the price to me and their mark up. I have no idea what Mesa do now but back then they had a reputation for rigidly controlling the prices of their products.

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Personally I don't think it's unreasonably priced due to some of it's features.  I'm still struggling to get my head around most of the price increases of the past few years. 

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I'll be interested to hear from the folks who find the prices reasonable once they put their money where their mouth is...no, I really would - user reviews are great 😀  I shan't be holding my breath, though...I have spent over £1300 on a couple of occasions, but not on anything that can be bought elsewhere for almost half that price...that Mug feeling would never go away...

I hadn't even seen the cab prices. Lawdy... 😮

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There’s a user review video posted so you can hear for yourself. Someone else has already taken the plunge on our behalf. 

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Posted (edited)

Interesting that, for example, list price of a DB-751 here is £2,400 and in the USA it's $2,395 (£1,804). That's approx a 33% mark up on what is a bloody heavy and large unit to ship compared to the WD800. You also have to factor the higher VAT/import duty on account of the higher price into the DB-751 price here. That seems quite reasonable. However, the mark-up on the WD-800 is massive by comparison at around 75%, that with lower VAT/import duty to pay due to the lower unit cost?

OK, crude analysis (if you can call it an analysis at all), but my argument has nothing to do with the quality of the amp per se, which I'm sure is amazing, just that despite what has been proposed above, we probably are not getting £1,300 of value if it sells for a little over half that in real terms in the US?

I may have missed a few details here, my apologies if so.

 

Edited by Beedster

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I just did a little experiment to see how much importing one from the states would be.  Allowing for 100 USD shipping (generous as it seems to about 50 USD, but I'm adding insurance) then 24 % duty + VAT, you get to about £1050 on your doorstep.

That suggests that the rule of thumb that a US made product should sell for approx the same sticker amount but in pounds is correct.  You would hope that an importer would get much better shipping terms than an individual too.

Caveat: I know that to import this way would void the warranty, its just a price comparison.  I can actually see how having a separate warranty system in Europe would add to the retail cost, but that's quite a lot extra.

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12 hours ago, Beedster said:

If price is set by the dealer, are you suggesting a conspiracy among dealers in Europe who all agree to set the price at around £500 above the USA level?

No, that is not what I am suggesting. We do not dictate in any way the selling price of the product.

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16 minutes ago, agedhorse said:

No, that is not what I am suggesting. We do not dictate in any way the selling price of the product.

Mmmm, that's not really what I was asking though is it?

I love Mesa gear, but I worry that the very very high prices, plus the discontinuation of all-tube bass heads to compete in an already very overcrowded Class-D marketplace, is a very bad strategy (excuse the pun). I hope I'm wrong

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2 hours ago, Beedster said:

If price is set by the dealer, are you suggesting a conspiracy among dealers in Europe who all agree to set the price at around £500 above the USA level?

======================

Mmmm, that's not really what I was asking though is it?

 

You asked if I was suggesting a conspiracy, that's EXACTLY the question I answered.  Was there a different question I missed???

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Posted (edited)
31 minutes ago, agedhorse said:

You asked if I was suggesting a conspiracy, that's EXACTLY the question I answered.  Was there a different question I missed???

Presumably he’s asking if retailers who sell Mesa have organised themselves into one big price fixing team ? 

Edited by LukeFRC

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1 hour ago, LukeFRC said:

Presumably he’s asking if retailers who sell Mesa have organised themselves into one big price fixing team ? 

Seriously, I doubt two retailers could even agree on where to eat lunch. 

 

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@agedhorse i think to solve this issue you need to get the folks at MESA to agree to providing basschatters with a £300 cashback reward for every new WD-800 purchase.

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Just now, PJ-Bassist said:

@agedhorse i think to solve this issue you need to get the folks at MESA to agree to providing basschatters with a £300 cashback reward for every new WD-800 purchase.

Or send a few freebies over to trial. 😂 I’d like to try one against my carbine (which I love!) 

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