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J66Bass

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Probably already discussed  on basschat but Made in. Japan or Crafted in Japan,what is the difference?and why Fender allowed that to happen,surely Made in Japan should be easy enough!also is the quality of wood and the rest such as electronic is also better ? I don’t really get it !Does it mean also Fender does not make Bass in Japan any more ?but only crafted?...thanks 

Edited by J66Bass

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It's the different factories that made them. MIJ Fenders & Squiers were originally made by Fujigen Gakki, who, as I understand it, have exclusive use of "Made In Japan" on their Fender products. CIJs were sourced from at least two other factories, Dyna Gakki and Tokai Gakki.

I think MIJs largely stopped in the late 90s, so most recent Japanese Fenders will have been CIJ, with as far as I know, an occasional MIJ/Fujigen batch from time to time. There's not any quality differentiation between the factories.

This was the case while Fender Japan was operated by Kanda Shokai/Yamano Gakki, I know that relationship came to an end a few years ago, but I don't know who's responsible for current Japanese Fenders.

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The Japanese built ones I’ve seen have tended to be massively better than the American built ones.

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2 minutes ago, ambient said:

The Japanese built ones I’ve seen have tended to be massively better than the American built ones.

And of course, that's why they started making them in Japan in the first place.

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I’ve only had 2 japanese ones and I wasn’t overly impressed, IMO the usa ones are the best I’ve had 

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43 minutes ago, Reggaebass said:

I’ve only had 2 japanese ones and I wasn’t overly impressed, IMO the usa ones are the best I’ve had 

I had a 5 string Marcus Miller bass that was embarrassingly bad. Maybe I was just unlucky? The neck joint looked like I’d done it. The little metal inserts/cups for the through-body stringing were loose and kept falling out. 

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For what it's worth my 2007/8 Fender Geddy Lee stated 'Made in Japan' whereas my current Marcus Miller, dating from 2006-2008 states 'Crafted in Japan' 🤷‍♂️🤷‍♂️

I just understood it to be down to being made in different factories iirc.

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11 hours ago, Bassassin said:

It's the different factories that made them. MIJ Fenders & Squiers were originally made by Fujigen Gakki, who, as I understand it, have exclusive use of "Made In Japan" on their Fender products. CIJs were sourced from at least two other factories, Dyna Gakki and Tokai Gakki.

I think MIJs largely stopped in the late 90s, so most recent Japanese Fenders will have been CIJ, with as far as I know, an occasional MIJ/Fujigen batch from time to time. There's not any quality differentiation between the factories.

This was the case while Fender Japan was operated by Kanda Shokai/Yamano Gakki, I know that relationship came to an end a few years ago, but I don't know who's responsible for current Japanese Fenders.

Completely amazing your knowledge is ,very interesting,thanks again 

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16 hours ago, ambient said:

I had a 5 string Marcus Miller bass that was embarrassingly bad. Maybe I was just unlucky? The neck joint looked like I’d done it. The little metal inserts/cups for the through-body stringing were loose and kept falling out. 

To my knowledge the 5 string model was actually built in the USA, not Japan.

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13 minutes ago, Jazzjames said:

To my knowledge the 5 string model was actually built in the USA, not Japan.

That’s my point about the quality of American instruments.

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I think it's probably down to marketingspeak. "Made in" could be taken to mean built by robots/machines in a factory, whereas "Crafted in" is an attempt to suggest skilled, dedicated luthiers painstakingly doing it all by hand in a workshop somewhere picturesque . Unless I'm spending mega amounts on a custom instrument (which I wouldn't - I'm a cheapskate), I'll take built by robots any day. You know the tolerances, etc will be spot on. Machines don't tend to have off days...

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1 hour ago, Dan Dare said:

I think it's probably down to marketingspeak. "Made in" could be taken to mean built by robots/machines in a factory, whereas "Crafted in" is an attempt to suggest skilled, dedicated luthiers painstakingly doing it all by hand in a workshop somewhere picturesque .

Meant the complete opposite in the US. Items designed in the States but built overseas could be "Crafted in USA",a bit like defrosted bananas can be "EU produce" 😃

"Made in USA"  meant the majority were sourced or processed in said country.   There's probably a good reason FMIC use "Made in Corona".

Could the  tonnes of Korean parts delivered every 2 weeks  have some bearing on it  ?

 

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7 hours ago, ambient said:

That’s my point about the quality of American instruments.

Ah okay I'm with you.  I just thought I'd mention it because the 4 string version of the bass is made in Japan.

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6 minutes ago, Jazzjames said:

Ah okay I'm with you.  I just thought I'd mention it because the 4 string version of the bass is made in Japan.

Yeah, I’ve had a Japanese 4 string version, it was far better made.

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On 04/02/2020 at 21:14, ambient said:

The Japanese built ones I’ve seen have tended to be massively better than the American built ones.

I think that you have to be careful making blanket statements like that. I currently have two American Fenders, both made in 2009 (a 57RI P bass and an American Std Jazz) that are very nice, well built basses. I have also played a 2011 American Std P bass that was probably the nicest P bass I’ve ever come across (including various vintage models, etc).

However, virtually every American Fender from the 80s or 90s that I have played have all been awful. I have a 95 Jazz that is far superior to any 80s or 90s Fender that I have come across, but certainly not as good as the more recent US built ones.

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4 hours ago, Dan Dare said:

I think it's probably down to marketingspeak. "Made in" could be taken to mean built by robots/machines in a factory, whereas "Crafted in" is an attempt to suggest skilled, dedicated luthiers painstakingly doing it all by hand in a workshop somewhere picturesque . Unless I'm spending mega amounts on a custom instrument (which I wouldn't - I'm a cheapskate), I'll take built by robots any day. You know the tolerances, etc will be spot on. Machines don't tend to have off days...

The thing is, the two Japanese partner companies that constituted Fender Japan, Kanda & Yamano, are highly unlikely to have any awareness of, never mind interest in the vagaries of the semantics of potential interpretation of English language phrases. Most Fender Japan products were for the Japanese home market.

It really does just refer to which factories made them.

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I believe the Japanese market demands far higher build quality in their instruments, which is why Fender has different ranges for Japan and the rest of the world. Probably why Roger Sadowsky chose Japan to make his non US basses. Also Lakland had a Shoreline range for sale in Japan.

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10 hours ago, peteb said:

I think that you have to be careful making blanket statements like that. I currently have two American Fenders, both made in 2009 (a 57RI P bass and an American Std Jazz) that are very nice, well built basses. I have also played a 2011 American Std P bass that was probably the nicest P bass I’ve ever come across (including various vintage models, etc).

However, virtually every American Fender from the 80s or 90s that I have played have all been awful. I have a 95 Jazz that is far superior to any 80s or 90s Fender that I have come across, but certainly not as good as the more recent US built ones.

I’ve owned a few American built fenders, they’ve all been quite badly built. The main thing has been the neck pocket, everyone has looked like the guy doing it sneezed as he either put the router in in, or took it out. 

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3 hours ago, ambient said:

I’ve owned a few American built fenders, they’ve all been quite badly built. The main thing has been the neck pocket, everyone has looked like the guy doing it sneezed as he either put the router in in, or took it out. 

I agree, especially about the neck pockets. I used to have a couple of 70s P basses many years ago, one of which was a great bass but the other was just poorly put together with a serious problem with the neck pocket. A mate has an 83 jazz (that I think he was hoping was going to acquire vintage status) that was even worse. 

My point is that from about 2005 onwards (maybe  a bit before), Fender seemed to sort out these QC issues and I haven't seen a genuinely poor one from this modern period. 

Edited by peteb
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