Jazz basses, what's the point?

[Danuman]

I agree with Paul. A dash of judicious eq-ing goes a long way. You're probably not going to get that nasal Jaco thing from a P, but you can play the Chicken just fine.

[CrackerJackLee]

The OP's question was "Jazz basses, what's the point?".

I think Fender's point with the J was to widen the tonal spectrum for Fender. I always felt that the J complimented the P. I've played a fretless P since 1969 and finally added a fretted J Geddy Lee to widen my tonal range.

I found it odd, that in spite of the 43 years between these different bass models, both necks are fairly identical. Both are "C" shapes with a taper of 0.8-0.9" from frets 1-12. The P nut width is 1.59" (2.21" at fret 12). The J nut width is 1.53" (2.26" at fret 12). Once I tried the Geddy, I saw that I wouldn't need any break-in time.

I tried to make each bass sound as different as possible to cover different styles of music.

Since the P has a fretless rosewood fingerboard, I added a strip of soft rubber to mute and strung it with La Bella Original 1954 Flats 110-52. I use the P for fingerstyle blues, jazz and soul and it gets a good Motown sound.

The J has a fretted maple fingerboard and I strung it with D'Addario XL Chromes Flats 105-50. I use the J for classic rock, surf and pop and it has a spectacular sound when played with a plectrum and palm muting. With a fretted bass I get to try some slap/pop at times.

Both basses have Badass bridges. I can always mute, but the high mass bridge provides sustain if needed and a more precise intonation at set-up.

My point is that by having both a P and a J, I can apply myself to any musical situation. If my mates want one or the other, it's up to me, but at least I am able to accommodate their wishes, as I value their friendship and look for any excuse to play either. But, if a stranger were to decide for me on what bass I should play, he better be offering me a decent paycheque. Because today, everyone wants to tell you what to do...

A friend once told me of his neighbor's wife who spent all day at his house telling his wife what to do. He came home from work one day, and she started telling him what to do...! He flipped out and she ran out... People will boss you... if you let 'em.

Edited November 14, 2016 by CrackerJackLee

[CrackerJackLee]

[quote name='Freddy Le Cragg' timestamp='1478896850' post='3172625']
All basses sound the same to me.....
[/quote]

LOL! You have a point... whenever I listen to a recording, the bass sounds pretty much the same as other recordings. But in a live mix, your tone is more obvious. Or when practicing, you can really hear your tone.

But rather than tone, I should say there is a Personal Sound that includes a chain of factors, such as:

Artist > Audience
Artist > Instrument > Audience
Artist > Skill > Instrument > Room > Audience
Artist > Rhythm > Musicality > Skill > Instrument > Signal > Room > Audience
Artist > Rhythm > Musicality > Skill > Instrument > Signal > Cab > Room > Air > Audience

[LukeFRC]

I'm more a P man than a J ... or a j with a bit of eq that works to give it a bit of thump and I'm happy. I've found them very sensitive to pickups as to if I like them live or not.

But why the hate for talking to your band members about what you sound like? I know sometimes basschat comes across as a bunch of gear obsessed bass nerds but surely you're not like that in real life? If a band suggests one bass over the other it's worth talking about and maybe doing. That to my mind, is part of making music - if I talk to a guitarist and suggest they cut the low end on their amp, or suggest a different sound is needed, or point out to the drummer they're speeding up, I would expect to be listened to and have a conversation about it in a non stress way

[Conan]

Own both. Play both. Use whichever one works best in that particular scenario

I'm kind of the other way round. I have three jazzes and one P bass. My band mates even have preferences for [i][b]which[/b][/i] J sounds best in certain songs! For our overall sound, the P bass just sounds a bit too full most of the time, and needs taming with a bit of mid-cut.

I don't understand this "don't let others tell you what to do" stance. The OP wasn't saying that anyway. If you play in a band (particularly an originals band) and that band has (or tries to have) a certain sound - then why shouldn't your colleagues help you make a choice about which instrument or sound best suits? As long as it is done in a friendly and sensitive manner I have no problem with that at all. In fact, I would miss it if it wasn't there! Being in a band is being part of a team - or at least it should be...

Sorry - LukeFRC said pretty much what I was saying!

Edited November 14, 2016 by Conan

[BigRedX]

Once you've adjusted the controls on your bass and your amp to get the right sound to complement the rest of the instruments in the band it doesn't matter what bass you are using apart from how it looks.

[grandad]

My first bass was a Legend Jazz, my second was a Legend P, both were excellent and in beautiful SUNBURST.

The Jazz was a racehorse, the P was a carthorse.

I think that both in there own way set the benchmarks by which other makes/models are measured.

Now I tend to play a Squier Mustang, (sort of a small P bass), in beautiful SUNBURST.

[FinnDave]

[quote name='Conan' timestamp='1479110649' post='3173914']
Own both. Play both. Use whichever one works best in that particular scenario

[/quote]

I also own two of each, but haven't found a scenario in the last god knows how many years in which the Js work better than the Ps. Which is basically what prompted me to start this thread!

[Conan]

[quote name='FinnDave' timestamp='1479122262' post='3174036']
I also own two of each, but haven't found a scenario in the last god knows how many years in which the Js work better than the Ps. Which is basically what prompted me to start this thread!
[/quote]

Exactly. In my current band it is the Js that work, but I still would want to hang on to a P on a "just in case" basis!

[chris_b]

So Dave they are so bad that you've got several lying around?

I don't own any basses I don't like.

[FinnDave]

[quote name='chris_b' timestamp='1479122914' post='3174047']
So Dave they are so bad that you've got several lying around?

I don't own any basses I don't like.
[/quote]

Only two, not several! And they are both up for sale right here on Basschat.

And I don't dislike Jazz basses, wouldn't have bought them if I did, but I simply can't find a place to use them where my Precisions wouldn't be doing a better job.

Edited November 14, 2016 by FinnDave

[Grahambythesea]

If watching bands on the TV is anything to go by I think more use J's than P's. They can't all be wrong can they? However having played Ps for years I switched to a Jazz 20 years ago, loved the neck width but thought the sound was generally thinner. Having finally abandoned Leo's offspring completely I think there are a lot better instruments out there and bass players should show the way and not be sheep like our guitarist brothers and sisters sticking to Strats Teles and Les's!

[AdamWoodBass]

Can't remember where I read it but I read an article once from a seasoned session pro who basically said you should always have a P-Bass in your arsenal because you can do pretty much anything on them and they always sound good in any context. Personally I'd say the same about a jazz and I've played jazz basses pretty much since I started. I have turned up to studio sessions in the past where I've had a Yamaha TRB II on loan and also brought a Fender Jazz as a spare. Played a couple of takes and the engineer asked me if we could use the Jazz instead because it sounded so much better.

In the context of Jazz vs P I think I will always prefer the slap tone of a Jazz and the solo'ed rear pickup "jaco" tone is something you just can't get faithfully out of any other bass. Don't get me wrong I love P basses and that signature "P-Bass" sound but I don't think you can beat a Jazz for versatility.

[FinnDave]

I agree that Jazz basses are more versatile, but (and this is a serious question) when do you actually get to use the sounds it is capable of? I've never played slap in my life (been playing over 40 years) and I can't imagine a situation in a gigging pub & club band where the rear pickup 'Jaco' sound would be of any use.

I bought my Jazzes because of their versatility, but I really haven't found a situation in which it is of any use.

[spectoremg]

[quote name='Grahambythesea' timestamp='1479129195' post='3174112']
If watching bands on the TV is anything to go by I think more use J's than P's. They can't all be wrong can they? However having played Ps for years I switched to a Jazz 20 years ago, loved the neck width but thought the sound was generally thinner. Having finally abandoned Leo's offspring completely I think there are a lot better instruments out there and bass players should show the way and not be sheep like our guitarist brothers and sisters sticking to Strats Teles and Les's!
[/quote]If you showed a guitarist a single pickup guitar and told him it was the dogs wotsits he'd split his sides.

Edited November 14, 2016 by spectoremg

[paul_c2]

[quote name='FinnDave' timestamp='1479150694' post='3174376']
I agree that Jazz basses are more versatile, but (and this is a serious question) when do you actually get to use the sounds it is capable of? I've never played slap in my life (been playing over 40 years) and I can't imagine a situation in a gigging pub & club band where the rear pickup 'Jaco' sound would be of any use.

I bought my Jazzes because of their versatility, but I really haven't found a situation in which it is of any use.
[/quote]

I guess your band has 2 guitarists? If it had one guitarist, and he does a solo, the sound of a Jazz bass can really fill out the "gap" left by the guitarist not playing rhythm bits any more.

[FinnDave]

Nope, both bands have one guitarist each. I find my P bass does a good job of replacing the lack of rhythm guitar when they go off one their lead breaks (though in one band the guitarist manages to play lead and rhythm simultaneously, and even both at the same time! ). Played with a pick (which is all I can do now) the P has a surprising amount of upper mids in the sound with the tone control on full bypass.

This makes it sound like I'm anti Jazz bass, which I'm not, I just struggle to find a use for mine.

[thegummy]

[quote name='spectoremg' timestamp='1479153193' post='3174401']
If you showed a guitarist a single pickup guitar and told him it was the dogs wotsits he'd split his sides.
[/quote]

Even if it was a Fender Custom Shop Esquire?

[Twigman]

[quote name='titchfieldrelic' timestamp='1478991914' post='3173242']
Hello FinnDave,

I've got short fingers, so my Fender Custom Shop Jazz is easier (than a Precision) to play 'cos it has a thinner (1.5 inches at the nut) neck. I've also got a MusicMan Sterling (same size) for the same reason. I've found that if I keep the nails of my right hand (I'm right handed) very short, especially the index finger, so that the nails do not make contact with the strings (just the skin of my fingers) the sound is transformed. I also use compression. There's always the option to use flats rather than round wounds too. So, in my case, I play a Jazz, or Sterling for practical reasons. I also believe that the sound of a Jazz can be customised to what you want.

Frankly, If anyone in my band even hinted that I should be playing a Precision, I'd tell them to f..k o.f.
[/quote]

I stick Jazz necks on Ps because of Trump hands....

[thegummy]

[quote name='Grahambythesea' timestamp='1479129195' post='3174112']
If watching bands on the TV is anything to go by I think more use J's than P's.
[/quote]

I've read a lot of things online about people saying P is the only bass that fits in the mix, that producers always tell them to use P's etc. but I see countless good/famous bands using J basses. Probably about equal with P's really and that's across all the genres I listen to.

As an example, was just watching an episode of Jools Holland and the Killers were using a J.

[FinnDave]

I wouldn't take what you see on TV as evidence of what people actually play, mostly mimed anyway. Personally, I take nothing I see on TV at face value, as a result of spending half my working life in that 'industry'.

[thegummy]

[quote name='FinnDave' timestamp='1479162484' post='3174497']
I wouldn't take what you see on TV as evidence of what people actually play, mostly mimed anyway. Personally, I take nothing I see on TV at face value, as a result of spending half my working life in that 'industry'.
[/quote]

I doubt they mime on Jools Holland.

Do you really think some bassists are pretending to use a J on TV then secretly using a P? What would be the point?

[FinnDave]

[quote name='thegummy' timestamp='1479162933' post='3174504']
I doubt they mime on Jools Holland.

Do you really think some bassists are pretending to use a J on TV then secretly using a P? What would be the point?
[/quote]

I really have no idea if they do or not, or why they'd want to, it's just that I automatically distrust anything I see on TV.

[LukeFRC]

[quote name='thegummy' timestamp='1479160641' post='3174476']


I've read a lot of things online about people saying P is the only bass that fits in the mix, that producers always tell them to use P's etc. but I see countless good/famous bands using J basses. Probably about equal with P's really and that's across all the genres I listen to.

As an example, was just watching an episode of Jools Holland and the Killers were using a J.
[/quote] killers first album, within 20 seconds of the first song you can tell they are a jazz bass using band .... if you want to play Motown use a p, if you want to play 70s funk use a jazz ... just use what sounds right to your ears for the music you're playing.

[Danuman]

Funny, I've been thinking about building a single pickup guitar for quite some time. I'd try to get it just right. I reckon I t would be one less thing to worry about.

I'm definitely a jazz bass player, though, and I love its versatility, but I always end up cranking both pickups.