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Class D Active Full-Range PA Speaker for Bass

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[quote name='discreet' timestamp='1359754976' post='1960036']
So what you really need is a thick-walled, non-plastic cab voiced for bass... now where would I get one of those...
[/quote]

[url="http://www.thomann.de/gb/gallien_krueger_410_mbp.htm"]http://www.thomann.d...ger_410_mbp.htm[/url]

The only one in the MBP range i could find. They did do a 2x12 and 1x15 as well, but they may require more searching.

Liam

Edited by LiamPodmore

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I've got some real world experience with this very setup, well, a slight variation. My brother was playing a gig with a Marshall 4x10 combo thing, didn't have enough juice (only a 3 piece, so bass needed to be authoritative), I suggested he DI'd into two of those Behringer cabs you linked to. Plenty of volume, but very undefined (may have been the amp rather than the cabs), so maybe with the right preamp, and a pair of them, it might be ok, although you won't have any serious bottom end. You'll need a sub for that business. Or a 4x10.

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You can definitely do this but you wouldn't expect authoritative bass from any old bass speakers and you shouldn't from any old PA speakers, you have to use something to do the job and choose just as carefully.

Generally cheap speakers have smaller magnets which means sensitivity (how loud) and bass handling have to be compromised. you can have loud bass which runs out of steam at really low power or you have a speaker which handles bass but isn't as loud as a fully specced speaker. The amp in this isn't usually the issue, amp watts are cheap.

the other issue is sound, some people like the clean sound of bass through the PA and others use a tone where the natural distortion of their dedicated bass speakers is an integral part of what they try to achieve. What's your taste?

Decent stage monitors/PA speakers can surely give you a good sound and plenty of volume but I doubt those Behringers will. My 15" Yamaha monitors sound great but they aren't cheaper than a proper bass speaker, just different.

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I think it all boils down to the same old problem. If you need decent bass from a smallish light cab - bass or PA - you need a decent speaker in it that can displace large volumes of air. That then means decent amounts of power to drive that long-throw speaker. Also the cab will need to be well constructed if it is to be light but not waste lots of energy by flexing unnecessarily. I think all this points to.... fairly expensive. :(

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[quote name='ShergoldSnickers' timestamp='1360062285' post='1964110']
...the cab will need to be well constructed if it is to be light but not waste lots of energy by flexing unnecessarily. I think all this points to... fairly expensive. :(
[/quote]

Or buying some plans from Bill Fitzmaurice. :)

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The Bag End powered cabs sound amazing. I've tried the 1x15 and the 2x12.

1000w class D amp on board and a can specifically designed for bass.

They run pretty heavy though - however, that's all part of the trade off for a serious speaker with a chunky ceramic magnet and a really heavy duty gigging cab.

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Resurrecting an old thread here, so apologies if there's been anything since.

I've just bought an electro-acoustic fretless from Haimsey on here, & already own a B115D as a monitor. I don't need deep bottom end, but clarity. Should I need to raise the volume a little (not in a full on band setting, but with couple of acoustic guitars & vocals), a passive DI box in between the two should be job done shouldn't it?

Cheers,

Wilco

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[quote name='Wilco' timestamp='1431370133' post='2770643']
Resurrecting an old thread here, so apologies if there's been anything since.

I've just bought an electro-acoustic fretless from Haimsey on here, & already own a B115D as a monitor. I don't need deep bottom end, but clarity. Should I need to raise the volume a little (not in a full on band setting, but with couple of acoustic guitars & vocals), a passive DI box in between the two should be job done shouldn't it?
[/quote]

Pretty much every active cab I've encountered already has a line level output jack for daisy chaining multiple cabs.

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Don't think I've explained myself clearly enough! I use the B115d as a monitor in a full band set up. I'm thinking of using it just as an amp for the acoustic bass, but would it not need a passive DI box between the instrument & the B115d? Also, how well would that set up work at modest levels?

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[quote name='Wilco' timestamp='1431372012' post='2770675']
Don't think I've explained myself clearly enough! I use the B115d as a monitor in a full band set up. I'm thinking of using it just as an amp for the acoustic bass, but would it not need a passive DI box between the instrument & the B115d? Also, how well would that set up work at modest levels?
[/quote]

A passive DI box reduces level quite substantially; what you want is a preamp, which you may or may not already have in your bass? Many outboard preamps already have a DI function as well, should you want to also send a feed to the front of house mix. I have no experience with the B115D, but various QSC and Mackie powered speakers have often worked really well for my electric upright, although always better with a little more drive than my onboard preamp can readily provide.

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Don't know about the active part of it, but I have often played bass through my Shermann full rage cabs (15" + 6" + Tweeter), and it sounds brilliant.

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i assume you already know about this, a little pricy but it is properly full range, lightweight and built for proper bottom end unlike most active pa cabs
http://barefacedbass.com/product-range/FR800.htm

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[quote name='stevie' timestamp='1359754895' post='1960034']
Thin-wall cabinets ring like crazy. Plastic cabs are useless for bass. Plus a good PA cab is voiced a lot flatter than a bass cab. This is not a good idea.
[/quote]you are correct in that most of those plastic PA cabs very poor at low frequencies due to the thickness of the composite used. However my Ramsa PA cabs and Subs have 15mm thick walls and external ribing and are superb, they are small but not tiny and light but not ultra light.

I believe that some of Duke Le Juene's ( or could have been a Greenboy) designs were available in a composite version and they too had a good reputation.

The material is fine it is the implementation that matters.

Edited by Chienmortbb

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Agreed - but you probably have the only properly built plastic bass cabs ever made. :) I have an old JBL Monitor 12, which is a lot more solid that what they make nowadays, but it still vibrates too much to be any good with bass guitar.

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Thanks for the above posts guys. I've got a Samson S-Direct active DI box which has switchable input levels, & that seems to be working ok with the B115d. I'll see how that goes for a while!

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Guest bassman7755

Being something of a barefaced fanboy if I was going to the active speaker route then theres only one game in town ...

[url="http://barefacedbass.com/product-range/FR800.htm"]http://barefacedbass...range/FR800.htm[/url]

Edited by bassman7755

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Guest bassman7755

[quote name='stevie' timestamp='1431807931' post='2775263']
But the Behringer is much louder.
[/quote]

Which one are you referring to ?.

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Guest bassman7755

Well it looks like a nice bit of kit for the money, however buried in the spec sheet is the statement "Power consumption max 110 W" which doesnt fill me with confidence, my shuttle 6 for example lists its input power as 240 W max. Its probably decently loud with a mixed content signal source courtesy of various dsp trickery but cant see it being a serious contender as a dedicated bass combo.

I own 3 BF cabs and have no reason to believe that 1) the cab sound is somehow compromised by the amp integration or 2) that the stated continuous 600 W rms power cannot be taken at face value.

Edited by bassman7755

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[quote name='stevie' timestamp='1431807931' post='2775263'] But the Behringer is much louder. [/quote]

Do these sound good with bass guitar?

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[quote name='bassman7755' timestamp='1431807392' post='2775256'] Being something of a barefaced fanboy if I was going to the active speaker route then theres only one game in town ... [url="http://barefacedbass.com/product-range/FR800.htm"]http://barefacedbass...range/FR800.htm[/url] [/quote]
does anyone know if this BF uses a separate amp for the woofer and tweeter? It's not mentioned on their website. Does the DSP negate the need?

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Guest bassman7755

[quote name='MoonBassAlpha' timestamp='1432035710' post='2777401']
does anyone know if this BF uses a separate amp for the woofer and tweeter? It's not mentioned on their website. Does the DSP negate the need?
[/quote]

I'm assuming not, based on the info on the website. Bi-amping isn't a necessity, its just a bit more efficient and saves a few quid on high power crossover components.

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[quote name='bassman7755' timestamp='1431865164' post='2775656']
Well it looks like a nice bit of kit for the money, however buried in the spec sheet is the statement "Power consumption max 110 W" which doesnt fill me with confidence,
[/quote]

Slightly off topic, but the Roland Bass cube 100 is like this - a "100 watt" combo that only draws 60VA from the mains. Seems the worlds energy crisis is solved!

Edited by Count Bassy

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