4 Strings Posted November 25, 2011 Share Posted November 25, 2011 I'm thinking of selling all my cabs (which have accumulated over the years and taking up way too much house space and are mostly unused) and buying a Barefaced Compact and a Midget for the three rig combination. But despite all the goodness I've read I'm still nervous enough to ask outright. I use a Hartke 2.5 - 2x10 virtually the whole time, its been fantastic. Deep, warm sound and I have pushed it to 3 guitar rock band levels at gigs and rehearsals for 2-3 years with no complaints from it at all. Will the Compact do the job? Its also been my mainstay for my Motown band and all sorts of other less noisy things, will the Midget do the job? For big gigs I've put my Monster (Hartke 1800 - 1x18) underneath the 2.5 which has been an enormous sound (quite an experience actually!). Will the combination do the job? My amp is a Hartke HA500, the one with 2x250W and a crossover. Experiences appreciated. I know Barefaced do a 'not entirely satisfied' type service for return but once my cabs have gone, they're gone. (I'm not particularly a fan of Hartke, but they make the stuff I use most and its been an absolute blast, especially the 2.5, thoroughly recommended, but I will be pleased to use something made in the UK.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moos3h Posted November 25, 2011 Share Posted November 25, 2011 I had the BF Compact that was on tour - I found it a good sounding cab but it NEEDS decent power - I was using a GK Backline 600 at the time (300w into 4 ohms) and whilst the sound was good, the amp struggled to give the cab what it needed and I struggled for volume with just the one. Possibly not an issue for you, but worth knowing? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aldude Posted November 25, 2011 Share Posted November 25, 2011 I have a Compact and a Super 12. Can't recommend them enough, though I would probably describe them as clean sounding rather than warm. The Super 12 is plenty loud enough on it's own (though I use it with the compact for a 2.67 ohm rig) not sure if a Compact on its own would be loud enough but as you are thinking of the Midget to go with it I'm sure that would be plenty! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pantherairsoft Posted November 25, 2011 Share Posted November 25, 2011 I'm running a Big Twin T. It's totally overkill for most 'regular' bass applications - Its damn loud! Need some serious power to get the best out of it. I have also had a play with a Super 12 - Which compared to top end 4x10 to my ears and a couple of compacts and a midget. I've always been shocked by the volume these things can chuck out for the size. The midget I tried was being run with a Mark Bass little mark and it was shaking the walls... I couldn't quite get my head around it. Alex knows his stuff and is very helpful when it comes to getting the right sound - plus, you have the 30 trial period to be sure you have the right cab for you! Shep Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris_b Posted November 25, 2011 Share Posted November 25, 2011 [size=4][font="Arial"][color="#222222"][color=#222222][font=Arial]A Compact will be every bit as loud and as full sounding as your 210. The sound will be different, so you have to understand and accept that, but the Compact will easily cover all that your Hartke can deliver. [/font][/color][/color][/font][/size][font="Arial"][size="2"][color="#222222"][color=#222222][font=Arial][size=1][/size][/font][/color][/color][/size][/font] [size=4][font="Arial"][color="#222222"][color=#222222][font=Arial] [/font][/color][/color][/font][/size][font="Arial"][size="2"][color="#222222"][color=#222222][font=Arial][size=1][/size][/font][/color][/color][/size][/font] [size=4][font="Arial"][color="#222222"][color=#222222][font=Arial]A 3 way rig can be reduced to 2 by getting 2 Compacts. That’s 4 ohms so your choice of amp upgrades is made easier and they are about the lightest 15" cab on the market so the schlep is as good as it’ll ever get. Personally I prefer the sound of a Compact to a Midget.[/font][/color][/color][/font][/size][font="Arial"][size="2"][color="#222222"][color=#222222][font=Arial][size=1][/size][/font][/color][/color][/size][/font] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BassBod Posted November 25, 2011 Share Posted November 25, 2011 I've been using a Midget for over a year now - has been fantastic (with EA Micro) for all my gigging. It isn't a ROCK! cab...but does cope with louder function type gigs on its own. With a DI into a decent PA it would be fine as a stage monitor. Tried an early Compact when it was sent around the country...from memory, it has a more traditional rounded sound (the Midget is a bit "barky" by comparison) but I can't think of a situation where it wouldn't work. For a lot of my work its too big...but I play in a lot of small places. Not tried the two together, but I suspect they would complement each other very well. My only concern would be the relative volume of each cab if being driven by one amp (so you can't balance them to taste), but I'm sure Alex has thought about that... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happy Jack Posted November 25, 2011 Share Posted November 25, 2011 (edited) Both cabs sound fine on their own, and are extraordinarily loud when you consider how light they are, but you really reap the benefit when you use them together - not just volume but also tone. The two cabs are intentionally complementary, and together they generate a noticeably richer sound. Your Motown band may require less out & out volume, but I'd still use both cabs ... just turn the amp down a bit! If you're determined to use only one with each of your bands, then I'd suggest swopping them around. The Midget on its own generates an excellent rock sound and cuts through very effectively; the Compact on its own is more likely to be able to provide an Ampeg B-15 sort of tone for your Jamerson fantasies. ps: I posted this just as BassBod was posting that the Midget is NOT a rock cab! I guess you'll just have to make your own mind up ... Edited November 25, 2011 by Happy Jack Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raggy Posted November 25, 2011 Share Posted November 25, 2011 I'm running a Dubster and I could not be happier, it's scary loud and scary light and properly braced inside. The trial period Alex runs is a great idea as you are encouraged to use the cab/cabs in a live situation and as we know, this is the best way to decide if its right for you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BassBod Posted November 25, 2011 Share Posted November 25, 2011 Sorry HJ...I should be clearer. The Midget can indeed rock...just not ROCK!. Nothing wrong with the sound, it give you what you send it, but for me it just barks too much when you really push it. And of course it looks a bit silly sitting on a big stage. Looks like you forgot something. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4 Strings Posted November 25, 2011 Author Share Posted November 25, 2011 Thanks all, keep it coming. The Hartke amp is 2 separate 250W amps in one so its 250W into each speaker (4 Ohm) and with a controllable crossover so I can filter frequencies and also balance volume between the two amps (each has two outputs too!) so I can solve the relative volume thing. However the max into one 8 Ohm speaker will be 170W which worries me a little as I don't understand the comments that these cabs need plenty of power but are 'louder' (ie more efficient) than other cabs. I'm also worried about 'barky' type comments. Is this easily rectified by a tweak on the eq or can little depth be found? I'm hoping for some depth to the sound to be possible. Although I'm not in the 'ROCK!' band anymore (my strap isn't long enough and I'm getting on a bit now!) I'd still like the combination to manage as its all I'll have. Yes I do have Jamerson fantasies, if I was really rich they'd extend to said Ampeg (can't be doing naugahyde!). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moos3h Posted November 25, 2011 Share Posted November 25, 2011 170w will not be enough,in my experience, into one compact to gig with, with an enthusiastic drummer (or worse, keyboards). Only my experience and not really the cabs fault. Get two of those bad boys and it'll cook, however! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sk8 Posted November 25, 2011 Share Posted November 25, 2011 170 watts will not be enough to drive the barefaced. They are power hungry cabs to get the volume in my experience Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
51m0n Posted November 25, 2011 Share Posted November 25, 2011 These cabs are using drivers designed to be able to cope with far more power than other drivers before they fart out. They have very large Xmax capability. In order to get as loud as they can you supply more power to the driver than for a 'normal' cab with similar drivers, so the drivers are slightly less sensitive (less loud for the same amount of power) but happily handle a great deal more power than a normal cab. The upshot is a very very loud cab that needs plenty of power to get there, but will absolutely out perform a 'normal' cab. The one cab that is mentioned here that belies that a bit more is the Super Twelve T, that is just staggering, it is more sensitive IME than the Compact or Midget alone, and can cope with massive amounts of clean power. The thing is that amp is going to make life difficult for you running 8Ohm cabs, you would be developing as you say a max of 170w a side into each 8ohm cab, and IME 340w is going to cut it, but only just. I've never really got on with Hartke gear from that era, IMO you would do better to trade it in and get an LH500, because with either a Compact/Midget stack or a SUperTwelveT it will knock down walls. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
51m0n Posted November 25, 2011 Share Posted November 25, 2011 Of course if your figure out a way to bridge those two amp outputs into an 8Ohm load you would be delivering 340w into a siongle Compact or Midget at 8Ohms and that would go a lot further.... Still not a patch on the LH500 though.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4 Strings Posted November 25, 2011 Author Share Posted November 25, 2011 Sounds like this could be an issue. Alex says, "...this 8 ohm cab is sufficiently sensitive that it'll play loud with only a handful of watts." and this seems to be a theme on the website. I know there is a three way compromise for all speakers (depth vs sensitivity vs size) but I thought it was this which made Bearefaced cabs what they are. This is going to set me back best part of a grand and I lose all my cabs (probably to pay for just the Compact) hence the reassurance! I can solve the power issue eventually, but how about depth of sound? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aldude Posted November 25, 2011 Share Posted November 25, 2011 (edited) [quote name='4 Strings' timestamp='1322219737' post='1448041'] I can solve the power issue eventually, but how about depth of sound? [/quote] I'd suggest one of the larger cabs. You're thinking about the Compact so you should have that covered. Edit: I'm also struggling to see why some people think 340W into two Barefaced cabs won't be enough! Sounds like it will shake down buildings! Of course the OP could always get more than two cabs Edited November 25, 2011 by aldude Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4 Strings Posted November 25, 2011 Author Share Posted November 25, 2011 The OP is stretching his budget and pushing his luck with household finances as it is! I think the consensus is that the two cabs will be fine but 170W into a Compact will be a bit lean. (I rarely go anything above half way into the 2.5 even for the ROCK! but that's 4 Ohms.) Not too worried by this now, a different amp down the line would solve it, taking two cabs to more events than intended in the meantime is not a deal breaker. I'm more interested in the depth of sound. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Foxen Posted November 25, 2011 Share Posted November 25, 2011 The single driver cabs use the sensitive driver, the mi loaded cabs use the low driver. The Kappalite 3015 is more sensitive than most 15s, the 3015LF loaded ones are power hungry. 150w amp into the 2x15 does me for my stupid loud with no PA support stuff. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LawrenceH Posted November 25, 2011 Share Posted November 25, 2011 [quote name='51m0n' timestamp='1322217653' post='1448003'] In order to get as loud as they can you supply more power to the driver than for a 'normal' cab with similar drivers, so the drivers are slightly less sensitive (less loud for the same amount of power) but happily handle a great deal more power than a normal cab. [/quote] Hmm. I can't think of many drivers whose sensitivity is better than the nominal 100dB of these speakers. Even a pair of 10" drivers running at, say, 98dB sensitivity each (high for a 10") will only couple effectively up to a few hundred Hz so it ought to be at least as loud as the Hartke. The one issue I can think of is that I expect the BF use lower tunings than a lot of other cabs so you might lose a couple of dBs on the mid-bass 'hump', but I'd still expect the real-world difference to be marginal and would argue that's more of a voicing than a volume issue. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happy Jack Posted November 25, 2011 Share Posted November 25, 2011 [quote name='51m0n' timestamp='1322217653' post='1448003'] They have very large Xmax capability. [/quote] And especially at this time of year, you need a Happy Xmax. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moos3h Posted November 25, 2011 Share Posted November 25, 2011 Also, and I'm not doing them down for a second, I'm genuinely impressed by them, but you SHOULD hear one first - the do have 'a sound' of their own. I moved from two Ashdown Mag cabinets (2x10 and 1x15) and using the same amp, I preferred the sound of that setup to a single compact. ENTIRELY unfair test, but just saying that there is a particular sound to the compact, like any speaker cab that you may or may not like. Reading this back through, this seems such a daft thing to say but it's a decent wedge of cash, I'd get out and gig one first - in fact, Alex pretty much encourages this with the trial setup! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markstuk Posted November 25, 2011 Share Posted November 25, 2011 (edited) I've replaced two EBS Proline 410's with one Super 12 T.. The S12 has marginally less presence and punch than the two 410's, and I mean a microscopically small amount.. I'm running a 236 watt RH450 into it :-) And it's damn loud...I've never had it above halfway on the master gigging, and it goes a lot louder... The combination of a midget and compact should be slightly better in this respect... Edited November 25, 2011 by markstuk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lozz196 Posted November 25, 2011 Share Posted November 25, 2011 I`ve got a Compact/Midget set-up, and using a 500 watt Class D amp, have never needed it on more then 4 on volume. Now I know volume controls can be misleading, and peak early, but the performance is very good from these cabs. If my amp goes on 5 it is far too loud, with some very hard-hitting drummers. I`m in 2 bands, a punk covers band - Pistols/Clash/SLF etc - so the bass needs to be present, holding a solid bottom end in this. In my other band, we have drums, 2 basses, 3 gtrs, keys, and 2 vocs. I play the "thud" bass, locking with the bass drum, so need depth to the sound. If these cabs weren`t up to the job for either band, I`d have sold them already, as I quite like buying/selling gear. From a performance point of view, they are very good, and from a practical point, they have made my life so much easier. The only things I would say is, firstly, if you get both cabs, always use the pair together. They`re not heavy, so this isn`t a problem, and they pair together brilliantly. Secondly, it`s worth splashing out on the Midget T with the tweeter, for the "just in case I want it" scenario. I didn`t, as I never use tweeters - but you don`t always know what`s round the corner. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
51m0n Posted November 25, 2011 Share Posted November 25, 2011 [quote name='aldude' timestamp='1322221156' post='1448080'] I'd suggest one of the larger cabs. You're thinking about the Compact so you should have that covered. Edit: I'm also struggling to see why some people think 340W into two Barefaced cabs won't be enough! Sounds like it will shake down buildings! Of course the OP could always get more than two cabs [/quote] I didnt say 340w into two BF cabs wouldnt be enough, I said it would be enough just about. Assuming that Hartke actually delivers 340s at *ohm (big assumption IMO). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Merton Posted November 25, 2011 Share Posted November 25, 2011 I destroyed my band the other night with my MB200 thru my newly acquired Super 12. Amazing cab, just like 51m0n says. [size=1]Hey, Simon says buy Barefaced... [/size] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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