andruca

Oh, man, I wish I could do something as complete (and compelling) as Muse does. In this particular case I hadn't thought of Muse, probably because my riff cycle is half as long as Hysteria's, so the analogy didn't click. But the "pedalling" open drop-D thing definitely carries the mood there, for sure. Consciously, I was definitely influenced by this song (I sub for their bass guy often), my style is just softer.

My "process" (or lack thereof) consists of: #1 - INSPIRATION I'm also the singer in what I call MY band, so many times music isn't what comes first in my mind. I have this text document in my mobile phone where I have all sorts of lyrical pieces, from mere hooks to whole verses/choruses. I usually know how they'll end up being, at least rhythmically, but most times I have the whole melody too. Only some times things start from a riff or chord progression I usually find while playing/trying stuff on my own. I sometimes record stuff I'm not sure I'll remember later with a simple dictaphone app in my phone, but that's really occasional, mostly with bass/guitar riffs/parts, as vocal melodies get "engraved" in my memory as soon as I write (and like) a certain set of words. #2 - DEMO Once I have sufficient material for building up a song I sorta' sketch a basic drum structure, directly in my DAW (Reaper + Steven Slate Drums plugin). I program drums carefully enough so that you can play along with a decent feeling. Bass part is usually the last thing I figure out. I record guitar first, then bass. Usually thru' Zoom boxes for a mostly baked in tone (one that's record friendly, so I don't have to tweak too much afterwards) and into a Zoom R24 I use as my audio interface (great preamps). Last thing I do is record my vocals, usually a lead vocal and 2 harmonies panned open. I usually record it all in one 3-4hr "session" at home, whatever isn't complete or missing I invent on the fly (very occasionally out of thin air, mostly rounding of previous ideas). #3 - MIX & SORTA' MASTER For about a week after I do the recording I intensively listen to it in every medium available to correct both the overall mix/sound but also musical details (mostly vocals) until I have something I really like. As soon as I do have it I register it online in SGAE (composers' union here in Spain, I don't get any money at all from my small time band, just do it for intellectual property reasons) and after that I can show anybody. I make sure the volume and overall "fullness" is there, so it isn't sounding too anemic A/Bed with comercial music (the most depressing aspect of most demos people share). This is my last demo (from some 4 month's ago). Guitar is a CHEAP Tele copy, bass is a 90€ parts Jazz I built a couple years ago, and both emanate from a Zoom G1Xon pedal (hacked with added bass FX). It goes thru' the aforementioned Zoom R24 as my interface and into a Windows10 + Reaper PC. Vocal mic is an old cheap AKG dynamic one (D65 model IIRC, probably have had it for 30 years) which I recently refurbished, capsule thoroughly covered with acoustic foam as its antipop filter, also thru' the R24. This song, along with 5 others, is yet to be recorded with my power trio soon. We have previously released a whole LP and an EP. This will be a new EP. Unlike in previous occasions, where my part would consist mostly of composing the vocals on top of music by our guitarist/s, this is all my compositions, all "pre-produced" with this "process". Despite who the author is, this is the level of detail we're used to. No time to lose in the studio, we need to get there with everything down, I like detailed demoing, even now that we're recording at our own studio. I also like to go in the studio with material not only learned but, moreso on vocals, it sounding like me, like it's mine. I hate singers (and all musicians, but singers are the most evident case) that don't put the previous work and end up looking like they're recording covers they don't quite know in the studio.

IDK where you're located, but I'm sure there's some cheap P-bass around you used in the 100-150$/€/£ range (Squier, Harley Benton, SX). Might be a better solution. I, as you, am more of a Jazz fan (prefer the sound of the Jazz neck pickup to the P indeed), still have a HB P-bass for when the situation calls for one (paid 80€ for it used, like new, with a gig bag, +1 regular digital tuner, +1 clip tuner, +some cables). Plays nice, sets up fine, sounds like a P-bass should.

Exactly my experience. Own a B3, MS-60B, MS-50G, G1xon (previous gen, all but the B3 "hacked" with a combination of guitar and bass model FX) and a B1Xfour (new gen). The four sounds THIN and BOXY, and more noisy in comparison. It also messes with/buries the timbre/character of my instruments, makes them all sound generic. Also it annoys me the BASS-PEQ is single band now, so with the constant need for EQ correction and ZNR you end up wasting slots you wouldn't waste in the previous gen (still, probably you can somehow inject the A1four/Xfour's PEQ, which is 2-band, to mitigate the loss). I've gone so paranoid as to get a second B1Xfour (just in case I'd had a lemon with the first one I got -long gone-). Don't get me wrong, it does the job competently enough with enough tweaking. And I'll keep the four this time. But it still sucks every time I A/B it with any of my previous gen gadgets (I've spent over 20 hours doing so).

Just don't hang me for heresy, but I happen to like the RAT emulation inside Zoom multiFX pedals. It's blendable, which is one of the requisites. This is my standard "ratted" pick tone both for playing thru' amps and for recording metal/HC/punk. It's the RAT emulation (BA Squeak) plus SansAmp emulation + compression. Not a P bass, but a J, first both pickups, then just the neck (closer to a P). Recorded with a G1Xon that cost me 35€ (firmware tuned with added bass FX).

My 2003 blue Stingray5...

I was going thru' some stuff in my Zoom R24 recorder and found the chance to do a fair A/B between my (long gone) B1XFour and my MS-60B, thus this "threadsurrection". I had the B1XFour sample in this video so I recorded the same phrase with my MS-60B, also in the Zoom R24, then made a video out of it in Reaper. The patch in the Four was my attempt at getting as close as possible to the patch in my MS-60B (my regular crunchy patch -my "clean" is just a bit cleaner than this, yet not clean really-). In the MS-60B it's just BassDrive+160Comp+ZNR, while in the B1XFour it's BassDrive+2x instances of BassPEQ+160Comp+ZNR. Same bass, 2003 (ceramic) Stingray5. Despite all the EQing the Four still sounds boxy, as if having a narrower response. It also screws up the bass' timbre more, you can see it sort'a muffles its character. I also remember being frustrated by the Four's SansAm emulation getting more fart instead of more grit when increasing the gain. You can appreciate that here too, it's punchy, but mostly farts, in a boxy way, while the MS-60B grits and booms. More (useless) food for thought/speculation in the video description if anyone happens to be interested. EDIT: "clean" sample comparison (be aware my clean is not so clean)...

Definitely a better option (as per video samples) than the Fishman Fission which, I've tried twice, and tracks like crap, glitches a lot, definitely worse than the Zooms' bass pitch. Also the distortion in the Fission sucks, the Unibass' distortion sounds a lot better. Still nowhere near what you can achieve with a POG/PitchFork and independent treatment of the "guitar" signal.

Yep, cheapest I could go was 2 Zoom devices. Unfortunately no parallel processing on Zoom devices as of today (even on their latest G6/B6 generation). Still, you can get a B1on/G1on for 35€ used here in Spain (so 2 for 70-80€, previous gen, but sounds better than the B1Xfour -current gen- I've owned, and ditched). Add 15€ for an ABY pedal. And I made the Y/balance box I use when going thru' only 1 amp (box+3 mono jacks+pot) for another 20€. So in the vicinity of some 120€ (100£?) you'd have the cheapest rig for it. The only poor link in the chain is the pitch shifter, all other things can be set to sound real competent. Even tho' the Zooms' bass pitch (this is the one to use, not the guitar version) is certainly no POG or PitchFork, it can even sorta' get some chords that sound passable with a noisy enough tone. Not done with 1 multiFX but with 2 VERY CHEAP ones, probably half or less than any other alternative. Here's the exact post where I describe the whole ghetto thing. On a side note, you shoudn't even worry if the models you get are for guitar or bass if it's any of: B1on/Xon, G1on/Xon, MS-60B/50G/70CDR, G3n/B3n, G1foud/Xfour, B1four/Xfour (2 latest generations). Effects in them can be tweaked with either the Zoom Firmware Editor or Zoom Effect Manager (both unofficial, just Google them, I suggest Zoom Effect Manager 1.1.1, easier and no firmware "deconstruction" needed on the part of the user). You can put any effect from any model into another unit of the same gen. I've got a page where I compile all my Zoom firmware/FX tweaking resources and info and speak about both tools (downloadable there too).

Hi y'all! I've successfully hacked an MS-50G I got. Didn't use the firmware editor this time (had trouble related to the absence of a FLST_SEQ.ZDT file) so I went with the (also unofficial) Zoom Effect Manager, making a list from scratch with effects from any model really. I basically added almost everything from the DYN/FLT/DRV/AMPSIM/BASS DRV/BASS AMPSIM groups, plenty from MOD/SFX, 6 DELAYs and 7 REVERBs. Perfectly fit as a 6 slot MS-60B while still guitar capable. Here's a little clip of a couple 3 slot patches (my "clean" and a dirtier tone) played thru' the 4 bass enabled Zoom multiFX I own nowadays (also own a G3 which can't be hacked, same thing with the B3, that's why I own both). As expected hey sound exactly the same (using the master level at 100 in the B3 and G1Xon produces roughly the same output as the MultiStomps -no master level on them-, G1Xon might be just a tad quiet). Also, was successful in making several patches with 5 bass FX plus ZNR, such as my B3K inspired "DarkRAT" patch, which goes Ba Squeak > BassDrive > BassPEQ > BassPEQ > 160Comp > ZNR. Works like a charm. No DSP overloads with the kind of FX I use. I've read that delays/reverbs are the most DSP demanding FX, don't know any science behind it, but still wonder why Zoom never expanded the slot capability of the MS-60B. Why not let me stack any number of FX up to the DSP limit? It appears to be safe for the device, which will definitely let you know when you're exceeding capacity and will simply omit the offending effect (and any of the models I own will do it even with the slot limit if you put enough reverbs/delays/"twin" effects, not even the 3 slot B3 gets away with some outrageous combinations). Would be much more functional, it's even unfair for us who mostly use undemanding FX and would like to add the additional EQ/exciter/noise reduction and just can't, not because of lack of CPU but because of the silly slot limit. Might stick with Zoom Effect Manager 1.1.1, hadn't used it before, nice app. Sharing an export of the FX selection now installed in my MS-50G for anyone interested (also human readable if you're curious). Will probably install the same selection into my MS-60B, which I'll probably keep as a backup.

100% right. It doesn't NOWADAYS. The firmware editor just didn't exist back when I got it as a gift in 2015. 😉 Looking forward to swap it for a MS-50G soon indeed (no need for stereo input, also the CDR is more expensive even used 'round here, just need the extra slots).

Exactly my impression. If it had a DI out and could be used as an audio interface (such as the G3) it'd be perfect for me, I'd probably have both a B1Xon and a G1Xon (I only own a G1Xon) and get rid of anything else. I've also been to the newer generation (extensively tested the G3n and even owned a B1Xfour for some months) and they simply don't sound as good (notoriously boxy and noisy in comparison). I got the Four mostly because of the Darkglass models, but the bad tone defeated the purpose (even the SansAmp emulation I base most of my patches on is damm poor in comparison to any previous gen I own -MS-60B, B3, G1Xon-). The other thing people appreciate in the newer generation is the hi pass filter. Both of these matters have a workaround on the older gen. For one there's the ACBS Pre (modelled after a Fishman pre) that has a "depth" parameter, which is indeed a hi-pass filter (even I, a Zoom freak, learned about this just a couple years ago). Also, the Darkglass tone can be faked real close once you take the time to go thru' the various ODs available to find the right kind of grit/grain (in my case thru' the BA Squeak, a blendable RAT emulation). I built this patch with a GUMA-Drive (B3K clone) I built side by side with my G1Xon (on customized firmware with all bass relavant stuff from the B1Xon). I'm using all 5 pedal slots, but the basics of the tone are there even when getting rid of the ZNR (when using my MS-60B, 4 slots max) or also the PEQ (when using my B3, just 3 slots). Still, as always, waiting for Zoom's next gen, of course. Just have experienced the latest (B3n, B1four/Xfour) generation to be a step back in tone (same thing happened many years back, I got a B2.1u and after much trying I kept using my 708II, sounded better).

Sincelerely, for that kinda' money, you can have a bass with more personality tonewise. I find Gravities pretty generic sounding. Had them for MANY years, and liked them, but my tastes shifted with time.

I first owned a Korean Gravity Deluxe 5, then added a Chinese Gravity Deluxe 5 (circa 2005 IIRC). Both were bolt-on (this was some years before they issued the neckthru' version. I preferred the Korean one. Looked and felt better. And also the neck pickup position in the Chinese one was a little recessed (pickups were closer) and I don't liked the tone much. Still a solid bass. Wouldn't pay more than 200$ for one of those used these days. Can't speak about the further (and current?) neck-thru' version, haven't even seen any of those 'round here (Spain).

COOL! What Zoom model does that Z-Bottom come from?

FYI, I have a 5 string Star Bass that already came with a nicely fitting gig bag. But it accidentally ended up in one of my thomann gig bags, to my surprise. A Star Bass fits perfectly inside one of these. I've played some Jack Casadys but can't determine from memory if the body was any bulkier than my Star Bass'. https://www.thomann.de/gb/thomann_gigbag1_ebass.htm

Yep, it did freak me out the first time I set my Jake 5a up. Found this setup video by Adrian himself with a warning about that (8:20 on). Made very sure to let the new owner know when I sold her.

You probably can customize the firmware in your A1 Four to have FX from either the B1 Four and G1 Four (bass and electric guitar models). Start here... https://github.com/Barsik-Barbosik/Zoom-Firmware-Editor The A1 Four is not mentioned, but being that the hardware is exactly the same as the B1/G1 Four it should work (just probably wasn't out at the moment the guy developed this app).

Do you have a sample of the octave up/poly mode with bass chords? Not specifically covered in bass demos of the pedal around. Thanx!

Just a couple toys...

I've owned a B1XFour (while owning other previous generation gear). B1on/Xon is better, sounds better/fuller (B1Four sounds boxy in comparison) and less noisy. Equally functional, same 5 simultaneous FX, drums, looper. Widely available used for dirty cheap.

I converted a 4 string cheap kit P into a 5 string PJ (then a fretless). The P pickup was no problem, sounds balanced in all strings. Now the J, well, you couldn't notice with both pickups on, but definitely could when soloing the J. I swapped it for a narrow 5 string J (cheap, from AliExpress) and it works way better.

Me halaga, muchas gracias!

Just this past weekend I scored an immaculate barely played PB-20 with a gig bag, 2 cables, a strap and 2 tuners (one regular Ibanez, one thoman clip-on) for 80€. After some setup (lowering the nut and action, intonation) it plays great and sounds as nice thick P goodness should. Also plays and sounds better than any Squier Affinity I've played, at less than half the price either new or used. Unbeatable P for the price.

I've had this happen with a 500mA power supply from Thomann. It seems to work OK when going pedal to amp, but when I use the output with headphones (i.e. on my G1Xon) it gets noisy. The noise goes away as soon as I switch to a Zoom branded power adapter from another pedal. Don't know if it's some design flaw or it's just plain poor quality of the Thomann 9V adapter.