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Passinwind

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Everything posted by Passinwind

  1. [quote name='stevie' timestamp='1436972126' post='2822470'] The interesting thing about this Beyma driver is that it offers the best of both worlds. It goes as low as the Kappalite LF (in this cabinet) with comparable excursion capability, but its response is well behaved up into the midrange and HF. Despite the fact that it has a much longer coil than the Kappalite HO, its response actually extends higher. I've scoured the spec sheets for a comparable chassis from other manufacturers and I can't find one, even at a higher price. The downside is that its thermal power handling is lower and it's 1.5kg heavier, but that's not much of a price to pay for the huge difference in price - at least on this side of the pond. [/quote] One of the biggest driver suppliers for DIY'ers in the US is already a Beyma dealer and they are typically quite responsive to requests for stocking things they don't currently carry. Assuming this design gains traction, I'm pretty sure they would take a good look at doing so in this case. How that pans out for pricing remains to be seen though, I might ask them just for the heck of it. The SM112 is listed at $170 on that site at the moment. For myself, I can probably get Eminence drivers at wholesale, but I'm already pretty well set with my current 112 cab in any case. I'm always happy to see more well thought out DIY designs floating around though.
  2. [quote name='Phil Starr' timestamp='1436947628' post='2822190'] They are quoted at £202 which is about $300US over here the Beyma is around £80 at the moment, a big saving. If we could have the Eminence at around £100 I think we'd have gone for that, the mid rise it shows would have given a more 'commercial cab' sound but with better bass handling than a lot of commercial cabs. [/quote] I imagine I'd like the 3012HO a lot in the right implementation. I've played through a couple of different cabs with OEM Eminence drivers that split the difference between the HO and LF models and they are both really nice. My Thunderchild cab is one of those, the Baer ML112 the other. Roger Baer's OEM driver is the closer one to the HO.
  3. [quote name='Phil Starr' timestamp='1436914138' post='2822101'] This design might work quite well with the Eminence 3012HO which is prohibitively expensive over here but which might be cheaper in the states. We did have plans to try one at one point. [/quote] Listed price online is ~$190 USD at the moment, so maybe $150 or so from the right dealer.
  4. [quote name='AttitudeCastle' timestamp='1433456766' post='2791331'] I'm really curious about these, as I really notice on EQ's with 20-30Hz controls when they are wound down, but they aren't designed to do exactly what the thumpinator does. [/quote] Not in the least. Here's a comparison of cutting about 8db at 20 hz with a fairly typical amp's tone control and using a high order HPF set at 32Hz:
  5. [quote name='stevie' timestamp='1436892396' post='2821809'] It's my own design - which means it's not necessarily helpful for comparison purposes. It's also a work in progress. The main component is a BMS 15N620 in 4 ohms (I believe Passinwind has a cab with something similar) It's all good, clean fun, but I hate doing the woodwork...... Phil has said he might build me a cab for this design in poplar ply - which could be interesting. [/quote] My cabs use the BMS15N630, they are 8 ohm drivers. I have used a lot of BMS compression drivers in various builds too, they are especially nice. When I started building cabs with dedicated mid drivers Audax came up a lot and I would still like to try them. I settled on readily available B&C 6MD38s as used in some EAW PA cabs, and still have a pair of those in my PA tops. I also don't really enjoy woodworking all that much. I have a luthier friend who has lots of cab building experience, and a well equipped shop quite near me that I could use for free, or maybe a six pack. I am stubborn and have always just built outdoors with rudimentary hand tools -- not so smart. The Beyma S212 is not readily available in the US through any of my usual channels, FWIW. If I were building this design I wouldn't let that stop me though, there's always a way.
  6. [quote name='Chienmortbb' timestamp='1436883217' post='2821675'] You spotted the deliberate mistake.Actually I cannot find that value at the moment so I am going through my stash to find it. [/quote] That particular value was used because I have a stash of ultra low noise resistors found on eBay that happened to be 18.7K ohms. I bought 100, at something less than 5 cents apiece. There are many great deals out there on oddball values that get surplussed when a production run ends. I would leave that one in there and stick with the gain staging arrangement as-is in that spot. A pot would vary output impedance along with gain, which may or may not actually matter to you, probably more so if using an output transformer. On my newer build I didn't bother with an HPF bypass. I used that position for an active/passive switch instead, making the front end impedance switchable from 18.7K to 330K. Doing it that way keeps the 330K resistor out of the circuit when not in use, cutting thermal noise a little. Little things add up though, and it could be that the switch wiring will be noisier than that resistor. This is stuff that's pretty specific to your build though. The effects I use are mostly time domain ones, which a parallel config usually works a little better for IME. I also like to use the EFX return as a mixer, adding another bass preamp or even a vocal feed for quick and easy monitoring at rehearsals. Could be handy for piping in canned music as well. The way I have set the board up allows both series and parallel operation if you want maximum flexibility. Series loop normalling jacks are a notorious failure point though, FWIW.
  7. [quote name='Chienmortbb' timestamp='1436874748' post='2821527'] Ironically the omissions make for a more satisfying build. I am studying the circuit diagram/schematic more closely than I would if documentation were 100% and learning more as I go. The Pre amp board is now complete apart from the wiring. Some of the components are now mounted off board as the preamp was designed before the HPF/PEQ circuit and taking components off board allows us to configure the circuits to the best arrangement. Below is the picture of the completed board. It still needs to be wired but I will leave that until the front panel is complete. As you can imagine I am taking more time and care over the front panel as it will be on show more than the back panel. [/quote] Nice job. Are you using a pot for setting final stage gain where R24 would go? And I also agonize a lot more about front panels than the back ones.
  8. I can tell you're making real progress now by all the emails asking for clarification of my shockingly shoddy documentation. There are so many little details that I've just taken for granted, things I've changed eleven times then changed back, and so on. As you say, I have been using this design pretty happily for a couple of years now though, so hang in there. My latest tangent is an onboard preamp based on a simplified version of that board in your last post. Just bass, mid, and treble controls, with mid frequency switchable to three frequency centers. It was a challenge to make it small enough to fit in my target bass, but it is done and I should be auditioning it in the next day or two.
  9. [quote name='mrtcat' timestamp='1436209773' post='2816054'] Agree in terms of the tech but have they seen such a significant size reduction in cabs? Actually I guess all the skinny column speakers and 12inch subs would suggest that they are leading with that too. [/quote] That was my thinking, but things like powered 12s and 10s on sticks actually work pretty well for a lot of people these days too. Or to look at it another way, big old stacks for front of house may still be fairly big and heavy, but that are a lot more capable than they used to be, and the amp racks are a lot lighter. In any case, I can often do fine with a 33 lb. 1 X 12 on my gigs that used to require a 2 X15 rig, and I'm not complaining a bit!
  10. [i][b]Bass world surely leading the way?[/b][/i] IMO, hardly. Pro sound reinforcement pretty much drives the bus and we get crumbs eventually.
  11. [quote name='Dan Dare' timestamp='1435921751' post='2813615'] As stated above, BBE + Peavey into the 2x10 [b]makes the right noise, but not at any volume[/b]. [/quote] That's the exact same experience that many of us have had with most Fender all tube amps used for bass. An inherently scooped tone stack wants lots of power, and even then, the natural loudness curve that our ears work with are just not the greatest fit for that when we turn things up. So exactly which Fender sound are you looking for? My benchmark would maybe be Phil Lesh ca. 1970, how about yours? The preamp Chienmort mentioned was based on [url="http://sound.westhost.com/project27.htm"]ESP Project 27[/url], not all that different than the BBE Bmax or Bmax-T. In my experience the Alembic F2B or F1X models do cop the sound just a little better, especially the F2B. I owned an F2B for a little while but didn't really find it to offer much over my solid state one once I turned up though. I modded one channel of my F2B to actually be able to boost mids and the guy who bought it greatly preferred that channel by itself, even though my intent was to mix the two channels -- go figure. In any case, I'd start with an 8 X 10, not a 2-by. For me a really robust 2-15 would do better, and there are at least a few relatively lightweight modern production ones that have the right vibe. I'd leave that alone until you sort everything else. IMHO, lots of power is going to be key, and I'd set 500 watts as the lowest workable figure if given modern solid state power amp sections. Best of luck getting what you want and need.
  12. [quote name='Phil Starr' timestamp='1435832015' post='2812787'] Oh, someone asked the weight of the cab. It is 14.2 kg. [/quote] Nice. My Thunderchild 112AF is 15 kg (w/ two tweeters no less), makes for an easy one hand grab.
  13. Passinwind

    DIY Porn!

    And the beginnings for a few different onboard preamps: 3-band board, based on the half-rack preamp in the last few pictures above: 3-band, kind of a hybrid of Music Man and Bartolini NTMB circuits, done both through-hole then with many surface mount part subs: Should be building up the first one in about a week's time or so. Edit: and here it is:
  14. [quote name='Chienmortbb' timestamp='1435690807' post='2811548'] Two more questions then. Is there such a think as void free ply. I mean can you order bios free or do you just have to purchase and hope. Secondly what is a void? I can only imagine knit holes or possibly where two sheets of veneer have not been lined up properly before the adhesive sets. [/quote] I should really know a lot more about this subject than I do, given that plywood production was the #1 industry in my little hometown until very recently. The company that makes the [url="http://www.columbiaforestproducts.com/product/europly-plus/#"]sheets I used in my last few builds[/url] have a pretty comprehensive online guide to grading: http://mydigitalpublication.com/publication?m=29753&l=1 The Europly that I used was a little different than the newer spec, with alternating layers of alder and birch. Pretty heavy, but a total joy to machine and quite attractive for natural finishing. Expensive as all get out too.
  15. [quote name='alexclaber' timestamp='1435674910' post='2811291'] I bet it's that same thing I referred to earlier, about many lightweight amps not being able to deliver full power for long enough. So you get the attack of the note at full loudness but you don't get the WEIGHT of the note because the amp has run out of power by the time that comes through. [/quote] Much as with speaker cabs, amp designers walk a tightrope of compromises to meet particular market slots. The commonly used ICE 250ASX2 can make full rated power of 500 watts bridged (8 ohms) for about 50 seconds at room temperature, yet it can only make 180 watts continuously without eventually shutting down. That's with a sine wave though, and that's not our game here. Duty cycle of the bass signal and cooling management are key factors in real world performance, and those modules were just never made with bass instrument amplification in mind. Yet many people love these amps, partly because not all of us need or crave a lot of low end energy in the lowest audible octave or two. The newer ICE modules don't need a fan at all and are predicated on a much more reasonable 3:1 duty cycle rather than the 8:1 figure that is pretty standard in home hi-fi and general purpose sound reinforcement apps (ie non-subwoofer duty). Many of us who do crave more beef down low have resorted to using multiple kilowatt pro sound amps regardless of class of operation or topology of power supply, and that can still be a mixed bag IME. And then again, as with speakers, transient response matters a great deal, so much so that the front side of the note may be more important to many than the sustain/backside aspect. IOW, there's more than one way to run an amp out of gas. Looking forward to seeing what you come up with Alex.
  16. [quote name='wateroftyne' timestamp='1435472945' post='2809009'] . The TC was - IMO - dreadful (and I'm sure that uses a B&O derivative?).[/quote] Derivative, yes, but AFAIK not an actual ICE module. Unfortunately a lot of the online tech info on those amps disappeared after the power management/ratings debacle. Not my cuppa at all in any case.
  17. [quote name='wateroftyne' timestamp='1435470758' post='2808998'] I was under the impression most of the amps we're discussing here use a similar variant of the B&O module. [/quote] Not really, at least in the case of Markbass, Acoustic Image, Ampeg, Carvin, Peavey, T.C., Ibanez, Vivid, Hevos, Jule Amps (non-Demeter versions), Bergantino, and the earlier Euphonic Audio, Aguilar, and Tec Amp Class D amps. But in any case, perhaps you'll get on better with the newer ICE modules that were designed more specifically for bass instrument applications -- I know I do. I also like the older ICE ASP series modules as used in the Bergantino IP powered cabs a lot, but AFAIK nobody was using those in commercial bass heads until very recently.
  18. [quote name='Chienmortbb' timestamp='1435392793' post='2808298'] Phil, you have no need to apologise. Life gets in the way sometimes and you are offering your collective expertise free to the community, Having started on an amp build I have had the same problems and it always takes longer than you think to get it right. However it is no cheaper to build your own amp but it is possible to get a self build speaker at close to half the price of a commercial offering. Arguably time better spent than my amp build. [/quote] I've only built amps with unique feature sets not found in commercial offerings, so what it cost was sort of moot. But even with cabs, if you mentally pay yourself a reasonable labor wage DIY building is pretty much always a losing proposition monetarily, in my experience. Since I don't enjoy woodworking particularly, using a proven design such as the one in this thread will eventually be is a pretty nice hedge against huge budget bloat, and the design efforts are much appreciated.
  19. [quote name='wateroftyne' timestamp='1435400215' post='2808398'] I don't think the Crown or D&B stuff uses the same ICEPower module as the lightweight heads being discussed here. Until that changes, I think there's a lot of truth being spoken here. [/quote] Not all bass amp makers doing uber-lightweight small heads use the same ICE modules either though (although many do), and even among the ones who do, IME they don't all sound the same. So my take is that implementation is everything, same as it ever was. I didn't really like very many old school amps back when they were contemporary, don't really like too many new ones either. Yet I sound just like me through just about anything. Doesn't keep me from still trying to improve the sound reinforcement aspect though -- maybe I'll get it right in the next forty years!
  20. [quote name='Bottle' timestamp='1433608550' post='2792510'] Coming together nicely [/quote] Indeed.
  21. Passinwind

    DIY Porn!

    A few recent DIY builds: Music Man Stingray 2-band preamp with many component mods and my own layout: DIY 500 watt bass amp: Tube bass preamp: 1/2 rack width bass preamp and matching 700 watt power amp module: These are all hobby builds, nothing to sell here. Maybe someday though.
  22. [quote name='EBS_freak' timestamp='1431727496' post='2774506'] I know there are loads of channel strips and the like about... but this relatively cheap effort from Rolls, seems to be incredibly flexible on the tone shaping front. Anybody ever used one with their bass? [/quote] Not the Rolls unit, but I've used similar analog parametric EQs from Ashly, Symetrix, Rane, DBX, and Orban, for starters. In most cases they've tended to work best with a dedicated preamp in front of them. I also have used my Rane RPM26z, which is digital and IIRC can do up to 150 bands of fully parametric EQ.
  23. [quote name='Wilco' timestamp='1431372012' post='2770675'] Don't think I've explained myself clearly enough! I use the B115d as a monitor in a full band set up. I'm thinking of using it just as an amp for the acoustic bass, but would it not need a passive DI box between the instrument & the B115d? Also, how well would that set up work at modest levels? [/quote] A passive DI box reduces level quite substantially; what you want is a preamp, which you may or may not already have in your bass? Many outboard preamps already have a DI function as well, should you want to also send a feed to the front of house mix. I have no experience with the B115D, but various QSC and Mackie powered speakers have often worked really well for my electric upright, although always better with a little more drive than my onboard preamp can readily provide.
  24. [quote name='Wilco' timestamp='1431370133' post='2770643'] Resurrecting an old thread here, so apologies if there's been anything since. I've just bought an electro-acoustic fretless from Haimsey on here, & already own a B115D as a monitor. I don't need deep bottom end, but clarity. Should I need to raise the volume a little (not in a full on band setting, but with couple of acoustic guitars & vocals), a passive DI box in between the two should be job done shouldn't it? [/quote] Pretty much every active cab I've encountered already has a line level output jack for daisy chaining multiple cabs.
  25. Which model did he clone? AFAIK Francis has still never released the V3 schematic?
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