voxpop Posted April 16, 2009 Share Posted April 16, 2009 Well after a 3 week wait its finally here. Picked up my Hellborg Preamp and 250w mono from the nice guys at Guitar Works Reading today. Here's a pic to show the big grin on my face. I've only play on it for the last 45 mins and will try to put into words how amazing and fantastic the sound is. Every subtle sound is reproduced, every tiny stroke, every small change in dynamics...........Oh god I need a bottle of wine.!! [attachment=23920:DSCN0608.JPG] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Uncle Balsamic Posted April 16, 2009 Share Posted April 16, 2009 Wow! These things are fantastic; you're so lucky. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kiwi Posted April 16, 2009 Share Posted April 16, 2009 I think the hellborg stack is definitely a bass rig for hard core audiophiles. Any chance of a review when you've recovered from the hangover? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve-soar Posted April 16, 2009 Share Posted April 16, 2009 Hi Marc, I knew this was your quest, hope you have lots of good times with this rig. Now then, what cabs are you using? Is this the McIntosh, or Krell, or Mark Levinson, or Audio Research of bass amps? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
funkypenguin Posted April 16, 2009 Share Posted April 16, 2009 phwoar! congratulations on recieving such a stunning piece of gear! i loved the hellborg rig the dealer in manchester had in (i noodled the stereo 250 through the big-cab and hi-cab), though waaaay out of my price bracket (poor student etc.) are you planning on accquiring a set of the Hellborg Cabinets to go with it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yorick Posted April 17, 2009 Share Posted April 17, 2009 That's not a grin... that's an "oh my god, how much have i spent?" look of bewilderment!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rich Posted April 17, 2009 Share Posted April 17, 2009 Just how heavy is it?? Seriously though... congrats on your new baby and, yes, review please! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
voxpop Posted April 17, 2009 Author Share Posted April 17, 2009 [quote name='steve-soar' post='464544' date='Apr 16 2009, 11:11 PM']Hi Marc, I knew this was your quest, hope you have lots of good times with this rig. Now then, what cabs are you using? Is this the McIntosh, or Krell, or Mark Levinson, or Audio Research of bass amps?[/quote] Hi Guys, thanks for all your kind comments. To answer all of your questions I will post a complete review after I've gigged it next week. (Steve) The sound is very like a Krell, its has a very clean and big sound that is a little dry at first. This is a shock as you realize that most amp put a peak in the lower mid to give a 'full' sound. I dialed in a small amount of EQ at 110Hz and got a warmer sound. It is so transparent every small detail of sound can be heard. To sum it up in a sentence.......Its the most MUSICAL system ever......period. I'm using it with two 1x12 Warwick Neo cabs for a light weight sollution. Has anyone tried the Hellborg cabs?? The power amp is Ok for weight if you are just carrying it from the car to the gig when racked in a 2unit case, would not like to carry the stereo version far as it is TWO of the amps that I have in one large case. Will post the full reveiw soon. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
voxpop Posted April 17, 2009 Author Share Posted April 17, 2009 [quote name='yorick' post='464641' date='Apr 17 2009, 07:29 AM']That's not a grin... that's an "oh my god, how much have i spent?" look of bewilderment!!! [/quote] Very true....my bank account is on zero. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dood Posted April 17, 2009 Share Posted April 17, 2009 Ahhh!! Very Nice!!! I really like the Hellborg gear and was impressed at the sounds coming out of the cabs! I've had the pleasure of getting a personal gear demo from Jonas .. Who better to show you round the abilities of this gear than the man himself. I think we may have gotten in trouble for cranking it up some ;o) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alexclaber Posted April 17, 2009 Share Posted April 17, 2009 Very nice! I suspect the Hellborg pre sounds rather like my Avalon U5, though with a lot more EQ options available. Be interesting to compare the two at some point. I'd like to know more about the power amp and what sets it apart from other high quality PA style power amps - I know it uses an output transformer like a valve amp (don't run it without a load!) and am curious as to what differences that causes. Alex Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bassace Posted April 17, 2009 Share Posted April 17, 2009 I wonder how it works for double bass. Hmm. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Merton Posted April 17, 2009 Share Posted April 17, 2009 Lovely lovely lovely. I suspect it would show off far too much of my bad technique but I'd love to give one a go sometime. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
voxpop Posted April 17, 2009 Author Share Posted April 17, 2009 [quote name='alexclaber' post='464720' date='Apr 17 2009, 09:47 AM']Very nice! I suspect the Hellborg pre sounds rather like my Avalon U5, though with a lot more EQ options available. Be interesting to compare the two at some point. I'd like to know more about the power amp and what sets it apart from other high quality PA style power amps - I know it uses an output transformer like a valve amp (don't run it without a load!) and am curious as to what differences that causes. Alex[/quote] Hi Alex, I think you are right its an Avalon type with better EQ options. The power amp sounds like my 1980's BGW studio power amp. Lots of current, grip and power BUT with a better upper mid and top sound. Much sweeter than the BGW. I will experiment with the speaker loading over the weekend and see if it changes the sound. Any thoughts on this??? How will it effect the sound ?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peted Posted April 17, 2009 Share Posted April 17, 2009 Crikey, congratulations on the purchase! I'm sure you've made 99.9% of bassists very jealous I'm sure that's on most peoples "When I've paid off the mortgage/won the lottery I'm going to buy..." lists. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alexclaber Posted April 17, 2009 Share Posted April 17, 2009 [quote name='voxpop' post='464984' date='Apr 17 2009, 01:30 PM']Hi Alex, I think you are right its an Avalon type with better EQ options.[/quote] It's certainly a very appealing preamp! Unfortunately adding all that EQ whilst maintaining signal integrity is very expensive, hence the vast price difference between it and the U5 (and similarly between the U5 and Avalon's other preamps). [quote name='voxpop' post='464984' date='Apr 17 2009, 01:30 PM']The power amp sounds like my 1980's BGW studio power amp. Lots of current, grip and power BUT with a better upper mid and top sound. Much sweeter than the BGW. I will experiment with the speaker loading over the weekend and see if it changes the sound. Any thoughts on this??? How will it effect the sound ??[/quote] I'm unfamiliar with the effects of output transformers on tone - I'm just aware that if they're not large enough they can form a bottleneck due to the magnetic fields from the two coils failing to couple fully at high power - and that with the high output impedance of a valve amp you have to have an output transformer to shift over to the low voltage high current drive that a speaker needs. But when you have a solidstate power stage you already have the right output impedance so Jonas must prefer what an output transformer does to the tone. I notice the amps are relatively low power (compared to other standalone power amps, they're not much different to typical bass heads) and thus wonder if he likes the sound of a transformer coupled solidstate power amp running beyond its linear zone? Alex Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevie Posted April 17, 2009 Share Posted April 17, 2009 [quote name='steve-soar' post='464544' date='Apr 16 2009, 11:11 PM']Is this the McIntosh, or Krell, or Mark Levinson, or Audio Research of bass amps?[/quote] You mean overpriced, overhyped and over here? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
51m0n Posted April 17, 2009 Share Posted April 17, 2009 [quote name='alexclaber' post='465152' date='Apr 17 2009, 03:43 PM']It's certainly a very appealing preamp! Unfortunately adding all that EQ whilst maintaining signal integrity is very expensive, hence the vast price difference between it and the U5 (and similarly between the U5 and Avalon's other preamps). I'm unfamiliar with the effects of output transformers on tone - I'm just aware that if they're not large enough they can form a bottleneck due to the magnetic fields from the two coils failing to couple fully at high power - and that with the high output impedance of a valve amp you have to have an output transformer to shift over to the low voltage high current drive that a speaker needs. But when you have a solidstate power stage you already have the right output impedance so Jonas must prefer what an output transformer does to the tone. I notice the amps are relatively low power (compared to other standalone power amps, they're not much different to typical bass heads) and thus wonder if he likes the sound of a transformer coupled solidstate power amp running beyond its linear zone? Alex[/quote] What I heard was that he believes that the output transformer does more to get 'that' tube sound than the tubes themselves in a power stage. Lots of arguments follow as to the validity of this idea, and being something of a tubeophobe its not a quest I've ever really been on.... Having said that I certainly wouldn't turn my nose up at a rig like that! Its really beautiful, who put that grinning buffoon in the picture though? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
voxpop Posted April 17, 2009 Author Share Posted April 17, 2009 [quote name='stevie' post='465159' date='Apr 17 2009, 03:52 PM']You mean overpriced, overhyped and over here? [/quote] Quite right....... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
funkypenguin Posted April 17, 2009 Share Posted April 17, 2009 [quote name='voxpop' post='464673' date='Apr 17 2009, 08:48 AM']Hi Guys, thanks for all your kind comments. To answer all of your questions I will post a complete review after I've gigged it next week. (Steve) The sound is very like a Krell, its has a very clean and big sound that is a little dry at first. This is a shock as you realize that most amp put a peak in the lower mid to give a 'full' sound. I dialed in a small amount of EQ at 110Hz and got a warmer sound. It is so transparent every small detail of sound can be heard. To sum it up in a sentence.......Its the most MUSICAL system ever......period. I'm using it with two 1x12 Warwick Neo cabs for a light weight sollution. Has anyone tried the Hellborg cabs?? The power amp is Ok for weight if you are just carrying it from the car to the gig when racked in a 2unit case, would not like to carry the stereo version far as it is TWO of the amps that I have in one large case. Will post the full reveiw soon.[/quote] I played through the big-cab (2x15) and the hi-cab (2x12), and as a rig, for clean sounds, its the best ive ever played through. the response was incrediby linear, throughout the range of the instrument, with no weakness in the high register and no distortion or 'cracking' in the lows when taken up to gig volume (ish). ive heard nothing but good things about all the cab configurations so perhaps see if anywhere near you can (is willing to!) get a set in for you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
voxpop Posted April 17, 2009 Author Share Posted April 17, 2009 [quote name='51m0n' post='465162' date='Apr 17 2009, 03:54 PM']What I heard was that he believes that the output transformer does more to get 'that' tube sound than the tubes themselves in a power stage. Lots of arguments follow as to the validity of this idea, and being something of a tubeophobe its not a quest I've ever really been on.... Having said that I certainly wouldn't turn my nose up at a rig like that! Its really beautiful, who put that grinning buffoon in the picture though? [/quote] [b]grinning buffoon [/b]...................thats me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
voxpop Posted April 17, 2009 Author Share Posted April 17, 2009 [quote name='peted' post='465115' date='Apr 17 2009, 03:17 PM']Crikey, congratulations on the purchase! I'm sure you've made 99.9% of bassists very jealous I'm sure that's on most peoples "When I've paid off the mortgage/won the lottery I'm going to buy..." lists.[/quote] I thought..... 'if I dont do it now I'll never will'...............I scraped every penny of spare cash, sold a few basses, used a little credit to get my dream rig......and god its worth the hard work. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
escholl Posted April 17, 2009 Share Posted April 17, 2009 [quote name='alexclaber' post='465152' date='Apr 17 2009, 03:43 PM']I'm unfamiliar with the effects of output transformers on tone - I'm just aware that if they're not large enough they can form a bottleneck due to the magnetic fields from the two coils failing to couple fully at high power - and that with the high output impedance of a valve amp you have to have an output transformer to shift over to the low voltage high current drive that a speaker needs. But when you have a solidstate power stage you already have the right output impedance so Jonas must prefer what an output transformer does to the tone. I notice the amps are relatively low power (compared to other standalone power amps, they're not much different to typical bass heads) and thus wonder if he likes the sound of a transformer coupled solidstate power amp running beyond its linear zone? Alex[/quote] to be honest, i think the whole transformer thing is ridiculous. the best output xformers will have little or no effect on the tone -- the "tube" sound comes from the way they tend to have harmonic distortion at different harmonics to transistors (you know this already though). tube amps have output transformers because the have to -- it just goes to show what happens when someone who hasn't studied engineering designs something. having said that, i'm sure it's a lovely amp! if it works, it works. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
voxpop Posted April 17, 2009 Author Share Posted April 17, 2009 [quote name='Rich' post='464657' date='Apr 17 2009, 08:01 AM']Just how heavy is it?? Seriously though... congrats on your new baby and, yes, review please! [/quote] Its 15KG without the rack case...............not to bad. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alexclaber Posted April 17, 2009 Share Posted April 17, 2009 What are these strange KG that you speak of? Alex Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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