Bugera "2000W" with 3x12AX7 valve pre (this should peak your interest)

[Al Krow 2,764]

The Bugera Veyron BV1001T 2000W Bass Amp Head features

• 3 x 12AX7 tubes (that's two more than in my Mesa M6)
• Class-D power amp deliveing 2000 watts (more than double what my DG M900 puts out!) [CORRECTION - SEE THREAD BELOW. CONSENSUS IS THAT IT'S A 500W TO 800W RMS AMP, 2000W IS "PEAK"]
• built in compressor (none of my current amps offer this)
• sweepable mids (only available on my DG M900)**
• headphone out & aux in (only my Markbass LM3 offers this)
• FX loop
• DI out

All this for around £250!!! What's the catch?

Assuming this doesn't blow the first time you use it, it would make for a no-brainer of a spare amp. And on paper actually a very good main amp!

**all the comparisons are to my existing amps - obviously there'll be a load of other amps who have the particular features highlighted!

Edited November 14, 2018 by Al Krow

[Bridgehouse 1,462]

“2000w” - that’s the catch.

[danbowskill 113]

I read somewhere that they are about 800(real) watts? Where are they £250?

Quite interesting tbh

[Al Krow 2,764]

41 minutes ago, danbowskill said:

I read somewhere that they are about 800(real) watts? Where are they £250?

Quite interesting tbh

Heck, if it's delivering 800 real watts that's actually going to be plenty for me (although not quite on a par with my DG M900 which is probably > 900W advertised, so word on the street has it).

Here you go:

https://www.gear4music.com/Guitar-and-Bass/Bugera-Veyron-BV1001T-2000W-Bass-Amp-Head/1WNW

 

[Al Krow 2,764]

I'm thinking I could even get it as a headphone amp (which could seriously mean the days of my Zoom B3n are numbered)...to combine with being a back up amp.

Be a great one to sling into a gear bag and take to rehearsals too (to use alongside the crappy studio cabs! 😂)

[BreadBin 1,960]

An 800w headphone amp? Now that's excessive! 

[The59Sound 260]

If Behringer own TC and Bugera then this is probably a TC in disguise, right? 

Edited October 21, 2018 by The59Sound

[Bridgehouse 1,462]

11 minutes ago, BreadBin said:

An 800w headphone amp? Now that's excessive! 

[yorks5stringer 859]

8 minutes ago, The59Sound said:

If Behringer own TC and Bugera then this is probably a TC in disguise, right? 

These have been out for a few years and I think predate the Music Group takeover of TC.

[Hellzero 1,657]

And you'll have to wait until mid January 2019 to get one. Reading helps a lot.

[Chienmortbb 257]

I think you will find they are discontinued.

[Al Krow 2,764]

19 minutes ago, Chienmortbb said:

I think you will find they are discontinued.

Interesting - what's your source? Gear4Music are still advertising them as being available (with delivery in Jan).

[Al Krow 2,764]

One of the key issues with this particular model for me is whether it's going to be reliable. I'm not usually someone who pays for extended warranties, not least as this comes with a 2 year warranty as standard. However Gear4Music are offering a SIX year warranty and a 180 day money back guarantee (rather than the usual 30 day return period) for just £13.

So an 800W (real watts) power amp with a valve preamp, sweepable mids, headphone out and aux in with a six year warranty for £266 all in.

Hmmm...I tend to be a believer that if you pay peanuts you get rubbish, but I'm a little gobsmacked at the seeming value for money here.

 

[yorks5stringer 859]

You know that expression 'If it sounds too good to be true...'?😉

[naxos10 168]

The also do a mosfet one for around £208.

If you do a Google search you will see a number of good reviews/posts come up.

I think there has been a recent thread on here regarding Bugera equipment.

[Al Krow 2,764]

33 minutes ago, naxos10 said:

The also do a mosfet one for around £208.

If you do a Google search you will see a number of good reviews/posts come up.

I think there has been a recent thread on here regarding Bugera equipment.

Ah yes - thanks and I've just seen that @Chienmortbb and @stewblack have both got themselves the MOSFET preamp version , although I'm not sure that Chien...'s statement that it's been discontinued on his NAD thread and also this thread is correct?

The £50 cheaper Veyron M (= MOSFET) would seem to have less scope for things going wrong not having the the valves of the T (= tubes) version.

The T has gain, volume and master, whereas the M dispenses with the volume (and have to admit not sure what the extra volume dial on the T is actually there for?!) and the M also seems to have a more capable EQ section than the T.

Having said all that, I'm still drawn to a 12AX7 preamp in the T, knowing just how great the 12AX7 valve preamp in my Mesa M6 sounds. But if I'm not already unfairly building this thing up for a fall comparing it to my M6, I'm not sure what is! 😂

[Phil Starr 419]

Behringer are routinely quoting 4x the actual power across the range of their amps, so this is a 500W into 4ohms and probably around 300W into 8ohms amp. Behringer, or Music Group have fairly recently acquired TC along with Tannoy, Midas and a couple of other well known brands. It's too early for them to have incorporated TC's technology into this older design. They've owned Bugera for a while and increasingly seem to be using Bugera for the badging of their instrument amps.

They seem to market everything on the three is better than one and 2000 is better than 500 principle and a lot of their stuff has a lot of features for the price.

The other issue with Behringr is their quality, which has been improving and their after sales which is still poor in the UK. Parts and support for anything out of guarantee is almost non existent.

Having said that a 500/300 amp at that price is a remarkable bargain. Reliability is better and with an extended guarantee it has to be tempting as a backup. 

[skidder652003 426]

Ahhh the tempting soft warm glow of pre amp tubes at the front.... quality! 

[Chienmortbb 257]

3 hours ago, Al Krow said:

Ah yes - thanks and I've just seen that @Chienmortbb and @stewblack have both got themselves the MOSFET preamp version , although I'm not sure that Chien...'s statement that it's been discontinued on his NAD thread and also this thread is correct?

The £50 cheaper Veyron M (= MOSFET) would seem to have less scope for things going wrong not having the the valves of the T (= tubes) version.

The T has gain, volume and master, whereas the M dispenses with the volume (and have to admit not sure what the extra volume dial on the T is actually there for?!) and the M also seems to have a more capable EQ section than the T.

Having said all that, I'm still drawn to a 12AX7 preamp in the T, knowing just how great the 12AX7 valve preamp in my Mesa M6 sounds. But if I'm not already unfairly building this thing up for a fall comparing it to my M6, I'm not sure what is! 😂

I was surmising that once prices fall. stock is low and the expected date does out to months rather than weeks, a product has ceased manufacture. However I have no proof.

[Al Krow 2,764]

20 minutes ago, Chienmortbb said:

I was surmising that once prices fall. stock is low and the expected date does out to months rather than weeks, a product has ceased manufacture. However I have no proof.

Well that's not an unreasonable reading of the runes.

They've both been out since 2015, so 3 years is quite a short production run by gear standards, unless they've just not been selling and had the plug pulled on then.

This review provides quite a nice comparison overview of the two models; your M and the alternate T.

Out of interest why did you decide on the M rather than the T? Is it based on your earlier point that tubes should be in the power amp and that they're a bit of a waste of time in a pre-amp? Which, for me, doesn't quite stack with why both Aguilar DB751 and Mesa M6 are such great amps with gorgeous tones and both have a valve pre.

 

[Chienmortbb 257]

3 hours ago, Phil Starr said:

Behringer are routinely quoting 4x the actual power across the range of their amps, so this is a 500W into 4ohms and probably around 300W into 8ohms amp. Behringer, or Music Group have fairly recently acquired TC along with Tannoy, Midas and a couple of other well known brands. It's too early for them to have incorporated TC's technology into this older design. They've owned Bugera for a while and increasingly seem to be using Bugera for the badging of their instrument amps.

They seem to market everything on the three is better than one and 2000 is better than 500 principle and a lot of their stuff has a lot of features for the price.

The other issue with Behringr is their quality, which has been improving and their after sales which is still poor in the UK. Parts and support for anything out of guarantee is almost non existent.

Having said that a 500/300 amp at that price is a remarkable bargain. Reliability is better and with an extended guarantee it has to be tempting as a backup. 

Phil, I have bought spares for Behringer quickly and at a reasonable price form  Electronic Music Services https://www.electronicmusicservices.co.uk/

[Bridgehouse 1,462]

Behringer themselves have confirmed that the 2000w is peak output - and in tests it peaks at around 1800w so it's close. 

However, they also do confirm if you ask them that RMS Constant output is in the 400-500w region as stated above. 

The thing is, the headline peak figure is also a bit misleading, as in normal circumstances and playing, it's extremely unlikely anyone would ever exceed 900w peak. 

 

But, as has also been stated, it's still remarkably cheap for a valve-pre 500w @ 4 ohms. 

[Al Krow 2,764]

4 minutes ago, Bridgehouse said:

But, as has also been stated, it's still remarkably cheap for a valve-pre 500w @ 4 ohms. 

Is a valve pre worth having or is it just a sales gimmick? 

[Bridgehouse 1,462]

Just now, Al Krow said:

Is a valve pre worth having or is it just a sales gimmick? 

Sort of difficult to answer that, as it depends on the pre, how the valve/s is/are used and what you are hoping to get out of it. 

If executed well it can really add to the tone - I have a Dave Hall preamp pedal with a 12AX7 in and it fattens and warms the tone a surprising amount. It also gives a very natural and valve-y drive tone compared to an all-solid state preamp, but there is a bit more noise. 

[Muzz 876]

That Peak Power thing is a bit like Daewoo saying their Matiz will do 122mph, because that's the terminal velocity in air of an object falling off a 1500ft cliff...