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Musicman20

Mini Helix - HX Stomp...

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I used to velcro a trs>xlr cable onto my pedal board permanently.

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Maybe it is down to the syle of gigging you do. I have a DI on the B3 which is virginal and untouched. I can't think of a situation where I would use it, and frankly of all the local groups I have seen with one (and there are a few) I have never seen anyone use one.

I suppose if you are the type who does use it it would seem a bit of an odd omission, but I would suspect that well over 90% of the owners of DI-Outputed effects pedals are never used, so it really wouldn't seem an odd thing to lose.

Maybe it is different with the helix stomp because people are going straight to the PA, but I would think that if you were going straight to the PA you would be more likely to be a full helix kind of group, or maybe it is because you londoners gig in a different way to us provincial chaps. I have only gigged in a place with its own PA a handful of times, and even then I went from the DI on my amp.

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2 hours ago, Woodinblack said:

I have a DI on the B3 which is virginal and untouched.

Comment of the day, surely?

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11 hours ago, Al Krow said:

How much is your Fishman DI box?

There is NO WAY any manufacturer is going to include something of that quality in their pedals. 

Doesn't it make more sense for you to take your Fishman with you to all gigs? You're not, it seems (and fair enough), anyway going to be happy with a cheap alternative costing a few ££ built into a pedal  which isn't focusing on being an excellent DI? 

I take PA, mixer, monitor, lighting, bass, bass amp & cab to gigs plus leads and cables for the above.  (OK - I've just worked out why my bands haven't sacked me yet  😄)

A small DI pedal on top, in one of the bags, is a Stomp in a tea cup for me. 

The Fishman was £230+ at the time of purchase, I think they are under £200 now. I don't think a great whack of that went into the DI portion though as it's a fully featured preamp box which just happens to have a nice DI on it, better than the MXR M80 DI and definitely better than a cheapo DI box. It isn't "focusing on being an excellent DI" in any way shape or form - it's a tuner, compressor, eq with semi parametric mids, notch filter, switchable signal booster, HPF, brilliance control, impedance switch....... it doesn't really focus on anything. Have a look at it:

https://www.fishman.com/products/series/platinum/platinum-pro-eq-analog-preamp/

I'm not sure what you mean when you say the Helix won't have a decent DI signal, it would be exactly the same as the 1/4" output (which is a DI) only with the wires soldered to a different type of connector (the industry standard one that everybody uses). If that signal wouldn't be good enough there would be no point using the Helix at all, which we know to be false.

 

My bass setup comprises of a Gator bass gigbag with all my kit in and an FRFR cab, literally I go bass>Fishman>FRFR which is why I don't want to be adding equipment or carrying dongles. I don't carry anything else and I can get set up ready to play in a couple of minutes, pretty much exactly the same as our dep guitarist who just takes a guitar gigbag and his Helix floor unit to gigs.

 

There seems to be a bit of confusion here, I'm not saying it's the end of the world - just a silly omission. Like I said form over function, unfortunately sacrificing connectivity and buying dongles in order to make products smaller seems to be a trend people put up with nowadays, personally I don't like it but each to their own. Your equipment and preferences might be different to mine, I need an XLR DI out full stop so the lack of this puts me right off this particular unit. That's all I was trying to say, I have no idea why posters are so keen to convince me otherwise! 

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7 hours ago, Woodinblack said:

Maybe it is different with the helix stomp because people are going straight to the PA, but I would think that if you were going straight to the PA you would be more likely to be a full helix kind of group, or maybe it is because you londoners gig in a different way to us provincial chaps. I have only gigged in a place with its own PA a handful of times, and even then I went from the DI on my amp.

🤣 I'm in Lancashire, hardly London! We own our own PA, I currently DI off my Fishman pedal and am only looking at Helix units because of the preamp models available (and the ease/cost of adding any required effects for future song picks) and the fact I could replicate the feature set of my current preamp pedal while keeping it to a single piece of equipment. I never DI out from amps (the FRFR I use actually has a very nice DI out though, XLR would you believe!) as if the amp fails you have nothing going to FoH which would spell disaster at someone's wedding or whatever. I could count the amount of times I have used an amp's DI on one hand.

 

That's how I gig and I don't think it's as uncommon as you think, I always kind of assumed most working bands gigged like this. Most of the ones I know who regularly play functions etc do.

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4 hours ago, lemmywinks said:

That's how I gig and I don't think it's as uncommon as you think, I always kind of assumed most working bands gigged like this. Most of the ones I know who regularly play functions etc do.

Well, there we go. I don't know anyone that plays like that, you don't know many people that dont, maybe it is a regional divide or a different type of group playing, so I guess that the truth is somewhere between that. One thing I suspect is that line 6 have done some research into it and decided it wasn't worth their while doing it, and also zoom, as the original b3 (that I have) had a DI, and the new one doesn't. I am guessing the impact on their sales will be fairly minor.

If I was a guitarist I would use a full fat helix anyway, so wouldn't have an issue.

Not that it would matter to me so much, if the amp failed I could go from the low impedance output of any amplified effects unit into a mixer with a jack lead (the mixer takes either), so there would be no issue, but I am not sure why the amp would fail, or why that would be any more likely than the PA failing. Luckily I haven't had either (although the guitarist seems to a lot).

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Not really, it's nothing to with regions or anything, just the type of gigs you're doing. If you're playing pubs and using your backline as FoH then you're not going to be using a DI in any form. If you have decent PA (either owned, provided or hired) then you will 100%, if it's a venue PA with an engineer then they will usually hand you a DI box as they'll probably have a varied experience of amp DIs and want something they know will work as expected. If you're going through a decent PA on every gig however then you're more likely to buy something like a Helix. I think Line 6 omit the XLR because they know can get away with it, because people will work around it same as they work around the lack of the headphone port on Apple phones and see it as an acceptable compromise. Again - form over function. Not for me, YMMV and you can spend your money how you like, as can I.

Regarding the amp failing thing (wildly off topic but a quick point) - if it failed mid song then you would definitely have an issue. That's why it's generally a better idea to take the signal before your amp/monitor, so you don't look like a prat playing a silent bass while everybody else on stage stares at you! The engineer can put your bass through the monitors and nobody has to pause between songs to plug jacks into a mixing desk, the audience would never notice. Again if you're playing for beer at the Dog and Duck then it's less of an issue than if it's at someone's wedding and they're paying you a decent wedge for it.

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1 hour ago, lemmywinks said:

Not really, it's nothing to with regions or anything, just the type of gigs you're doing. If you're playing pubs and using your backline as FoH then you're not going to be using a DI in any form.

Well, yes, I play pubs and the bass is normally not out of the PA, although I use DI all the time as it goes to the mixer for IEM and sometimes recording.

From the amp though, as the amp is part of my sound. Maybe if I had a helix, I wouldn't need the amp to be part of my sound, but I don't. But if I did and I had a helix stomp instead of a full helix (which seems unlikely), I would just use a different cable. As it is I use a X18 (rather than an XR18) mixer, so I have quite a few TRS to XLR leads, as that is what they did on the X18.

Everytime i have plugged into someone elses pa, which has mostly been on the back of a truck or on those occasions with a house PA, I have gone from my amp.

1 hour ago, lemmywinks said:

Regarding the amp failing thing (wildly off topic but a quick point) - if it failed mid song then you would definitely have an issue

Indeed you would. As you would if your bass failed, or your cable failed, or your helix failed, or one of the wires on your pedalboard failed, or your DI box failed, or the mixer or pa failed, or the speakers failed. ie: with the tens of things that could fail between your fingers and the speaker, why specifically is the amp failing a major concern? I have never had an amp fail mid gig, so I wondered why this one case was a reason to not use an amp?

1 hour ago, lemmywinks said:

That's why it's generally a better idea to take the signal before your amp/monitor, so you don't look like a prat playing a silent bass while everybody else on stage stares at you! The engineer can put your bass through the monitors and nobody has to pause between songs to plug jacks into a mixing desk, the audience would never notice. Again if you're playing for beer at the Dog and Duck then it's less of an issue than if it's at someone's wedding and they're paying you a decent wedge for it.

Well, I have done quite a few weddings and I guess I have been one of those rare souls whos amp never failed :D

 

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