The Frontman. Tips and tricks.

[TimR]

I'm after a bit of advice. Our singer is not the greatest of frontmen. That's putting it politely. We have video and think he's really letting the band down.

His singing is patchy in places, and he is quite reliant on having the words in front of him but I think we can get away with that for now. It's his interraction with the crowd and general lack of frontmanness that's the problem.

So I'm considering relieving him of the interraction bit and doing that myself. I recently saw a band where the sax player did all the talking and think it worked really well.

Any suggestions of either things to do and say (I'm happy to just be myself), would you script little sections?

Or maybe we could script the current singer and give him some direction. The problem is he's "been doing it for years and doesn't need to be told how to do it." So approaching it is difficult at best.

The ulutimate option is to get rid, unfortunately the level of person we're looking for is likely to expect a lot of work and rehearsing a new singer isn't high on my list of priorities.

.

Edited March 26, 2016 by TimR

[Number6]

I am a bassist / singer (definitely both with a lower case b and s ) but i manage to usually get a good rapport with the crowd (!?). I try to keep a little (is more) amount of light banter going with the audience. Things like "can you hear us at the back" usually with the response of "no" and say things like "good we'll begin then" or "are you sure you want to hear another song" things like "Thank you for supporting live music and taking the time to be here tonight" along those lines i find helps warm audiences up a bit.

Edited March 26, 2016 by Number6

[Truckstop]

Take him with you to see a band with an electric frontman and get him to take notes.

[PaulWarning]

the best frontmen need to be narcissists, like it or not they are the focal point for the band, it's their job to interact with the crowd as well as sing, other wise you may as well listen to a CD

[RhysP]

Nothing wrong with scripting it.
Even the best frontmen, who appear to be saying everything off the cuff, usually have a good idea of what they are going to say.
Seeing a famous band a couple of nights on the same tour in different cities will prove this.

There's nothing worse & more amateur-sounding than some idiot winging it between songs because they are under the mistaken impression that they have the gift of the gab.

[Japhet]

Has he seen the video?

[blue]

[quote name='TimR' timestamp='1458991912' post='3012636']
I'm after a bit of advice. Our singer is not the greatest of frontmen. That's putting it politely. We have video and think he's really letting the band down.

His singing is patchy in places, and he is quite reliant on having the words in front of him but I think we can get away with that for now. It's his interraction with the crowd and general lack of frontmanness that's the problem.

So I'm considering relieving him of the interraction bit and doing that myself. I recently saw a band where the sax player did all the talking and think it worked really well.

Any suggestions of either things to do and say (I'm happy to just be myself), would you script little sections?

Or maybe we could script the current singer and give him some direction. The problem is he's "been doing it for years and doesn't need to be told how to do it." So approaching it is difficult at best.

The ulutimate option is to get rid, unfortunately the level of person we're looking for is likely to expect a lot of work and rehearsing a new singer isn't high on my list of priorities.

.
[/quote]

I think that's realistic. I always find it a little weird when I see bands advertising for a bass player. They have a laundry list of requirements and no gigs.

Blue

[Mykesbass]

[quote name='PaulWarning' timestamp='1458992882' post='3012649']
the best frontmen need to be narcissists, like it or not they are the focal point for the band, it's their job to interact with the crowd as well as sing, other wise you may as well listen to a CD
[/quote]

A bit of this, but also, the rest of the band need need to respond to this. I saw Van Morrison twice in a period of a couple of months, so same band and same set. First time was stunning, despite a lacklustre audience, Van was on fire and the band kicked off behind him. The second time, as Paul says, it was as if someone was playing a CD on stage.

[Raymondo]

Our singer has a great voice but she will not interact with the audience. I do all the babbling at gigs.

I have certain phrases that I use a lot of the time. For example, when introducing Whisky in the jar, "this is our version, of Metallica's version, of Thin Lizzy's version of an old Irish song."

The rest of the time I try to find out what the audience laughs at and play up to that.

Although nobody has ever complained I do feel that it looks better when the singer does the talking as they are the focus of the band.

I guess what I am saying is, if the singer is a good singer, then by all means do the talking; if he's not, then replace him.

Edited March 26, 2016 by Raymondo

[RhysP]

[quote name='Mykesbass' timestamp='1458994734' post='3012668']


A bit of this, but also, the rest of the band need need to respond to this. I saw Van Morrison twice in a period of a couple of months, so same band and same set. First time was stunning, despite a lacklustre audience, Van was on fire and the band kicked off behind him. The second time, as Paul says, it was as if someone was playing a CD on stage.
[/quote]

That's probably got more to do with Van being such a miserable old bastard that half the time gives the impression he'd rather be anywhere else than on stage than anything else.

[PaulWarning]

[quote name='Raymondo' timestamp='1458995916' post='3012677']
Our singer has a great voice but she will not interact with the audience.
[/quote]it is possible to learn this, I do open mics as well as play in a band and I've learnt a lot from our singer in regards to interacting with the audience, and as someone else said earlier you can have scripted lines that work well, as long as it doesn't sound like you're reading from a script, take him or her along to see a band with a good frontperson, it can be learnt, confidence is a key ingredient

[KevB]

Some people are just better natural communicators. In my job I see academics interact with students all the time and there is a noticeable range of quality of delivery (and theyve all had training!). Problem for the OP is he has someone doing the 'old dog new tricks' scenario on him. It's always going to be a struggle with someone entrenched in a viewpoint and unwilling to learn. One of my earliest bands (which wasn't too serious, work collegues put together to do in house xmas parties but then asked to do some outside stuff on the side) was a massive learning curve for me as it rapidly developed into me doing half the 'fronting' with our female singer. I'm naturally quite reserved but soon realised I'd have to start doing some acting pretty sharpish to get our message across. You can learn a lot from watching other natural frontmen and stuff really can be scripted in advance if you can pull it off making it sound natural.You only have to see a band twice on the same tour to realise just how much apparently 'adlibbed' things are actually trotted out night after night.

[TimR]

[quote name='Japhet' timestamp='1458994282' post='3012662']
Has he seen the video?
[/quote]

Good question. No. But neither have I, I'm going on the drummer's and guitarist's word. I have seen clips from other gigs but only while he is singing. He can pull of the 'look at me' while singing, just when the music stops, so does he.

[TimR]

I played in a function band for a long time. All of the Ad Libs had been added over the years as the frontman worked out which ones worked and which ones didn't. Occasionally he really milked it and often lost impact and he then had to be reminded, after a gig, that the audience was there to see the band, not a comedian who wasn't very funny.

Edited March 26, 2016 by TimR

[KevB]

Before we get too down on ourselves though we should bear in my there are plenty of pro's who've been around for a while who don't work a crowd that well either. I was amazed at the utter lack of crowd interaction that Ali Campbell had with the audience at a UB40 gig and Pink Floyd's 'remoteness' at some times in their history is quite legendary.

[RhysP]

[quote name='KevB' timestamp='1459002432' post='3012751']
Before we get too down on ourselves though we should bear in my there are plenty of pro's who've been around for a while who don't work a crowd that well either. I was amazed at the utter lack of crowd interaction that Ali Campbell had with the audience at a UB40 gig and Pink Floyd's 'remoteness' at some times in their history is quite legendary.
[/quote]

It's unfair say that Pink Floyd didn't work a crowd well - you didn't go to see Floyd for the witty banter & faux bonhomie, you went for the music & the lightshow. Can't say I've ever talked to anyone who saw Floyd that thought the evening was spoiled by the lack of audience interaction.

[Mickeyboro]

People who pay for a name act will put up with a lot more. If you don't want to lose a pub audience, make an effort to make 'em yours!

On a different note... Saw Rod Stewart in Vegas Wednesday - his banter and crowd control exceeds his singing but he gets away with it on charisma alone.

[scalpy]

I play with one guy who thinks he's quite the raconteur. He isn't. Sometimes I wish he didn't do any 'showmanship' as the rest of the band stand there for what can be minutes at a time whilst he mumbles about himself and saying 'please enjoy' before every number.

[Norris]

The other night a punter came up to complain about the lack of banter. Usually there is a LOT of it but on this occasion it was an "open" birthday party in a pub so we thought we'd better play a bit of music.

We are blessed that our guitarist/singist has the charm and gift of the gab to entertain pretty much any audience. However it doesn't come naturally to most ordinary mortals. In that case you have to put on the persona and do the "act". Watching other frontmen is a good way to learn what and what not to do.

[KevB]

I've probably said it before but Tull's 'bursting out' live album is worth having for the song introductions as much as the actual musical performance.

[lojo]

A shy front person can be interesting , but they must really have a talent vocally to get away with it

[fretmeister]

Watch the vid together. Each member assessing themselves first before doing others. Be harsh on yourself so singer doesn't go first and doesn't get the chance to claim he's awesome and needs no improvement.

And I have to say it - no singer gets away without knowing the words. Ever.

[TimR]

[quote name='fretmeister' timestamp='1459063682' post='3013164']
Watch the vid together. Each member assessing themselves first before doing others. Be harsh on yourself so singer doesn't go first and doesn't get the chance to claim he's awesome and needs no improvement.

And I have to say it - no singer gets away without knowing the words. Ever.
[/quote]

Yes. I think I need to watch the video, but it's been commented on by audience members. Especially the words thing. Which he seems to have taken on board. Small steps.