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Transparency - why?


Guest MoJo
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I'm interested in why there is such a desire for transparent amps and cabs that 'do not discolour your sound' in the bass playing community. You don't see it among guitarists who buy a Marshall for that 'Classic Marshall sound' or Metal heads buy a Mesa because it produces 'that sound'.

One of my favourite patches on the Zoom B3 is the Marshall Super Bass through a 4x12" cab. I'd love to play through a real Super Bass.

Surely, if all amps become transparent and all cabs likewise, they'll all sound the same and there would be no reason to buy one over another other than features and price.

I'm all for colouration ....... More colouration I say ....... long live the Bass Terror and it's kin :lol:

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I use a lot of effects to drastically change my tone track to track. I don't want an already 'coloured' sound to work from, I want my tone to be as clean and hi-fi as humanly possible to my direct tone does not influence the different sounds and textures I am using.

Like a million other things it all depends on the music you play, how you hear it and what makes you tick.

Edited by pantherairsoft
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If all amps and cabs were ultra transparent (I understand that no amp and cab can be fully transparent), everyone won't sound the same, but you would be able to hear each person's fingers and bass more clearly.

I've owned a very transparent rig before (Euphonic Audio) but miss the extra timbres that an all valve amp provides. Each to their own.

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Guitar in general is far more about adding extra harmonics than bass on average, hence the situation. A guitar amp (even one that you'd say sounds 'clean') is nowhere near flat in response, most bass amps are far closer to it. It's also far easier for a messy bass sound to 'clog up' the mix in a band with a complicated sound than most things.

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I tend to just buy a cab that sounds good to my ear. If the cab match well with the head then i will buy the cab. I'm not too bother about transparent tone etc.

Also depend on what bass i use as well. In my church their is this old trace 15" combo (200-250watt) which goes well with my passive P Bass and my jazz bass with john east install, but it sound terrible on my ACG 5 string.

So depend on the cab i will use different bass.

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I like to use the most transparent cab and amp i can find for a very simple reason. I want ME to be the one controling the tone, either by pickup blend, bass EQ or right hand positioning/attack!

This is good for one reason, like most people i send my signal to FOH via the amps DI. Using an "uncolouring" rig i know that the sound i'm hearing behind me is the same being fed to the mixer (i play pub gigs with PA but no tech). Using a colouring rig i couldn't know if what sounds good to me on stage is sounding like sh*t on the main mix.

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[quote name='Ghost_Bass' timestamp='1380719053' post='2229466']
This is good for one reason, like most people i send my signal to FOH via the amps DI. Using an "uncolouring" rig i know that the sound i'm hearing behind me is the same being fed to the mixer (i play pub gigs with PA but no tech). Using a colouring rig i couldn't know if what sounds good to me on stage is sounding like sh*t on the main mix.
[/quote]

I get it, but the soundman will just change it anyway....that's what they usually do...to their taste.

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I personally prefer using a few pedals (comp, EQ, OD) to do most of the tone shaping these days and DI where needed. Main reason is that I often play in rehearsal spaces with rented backlines that are all different so that I only use the power section of the amp to avoid too much additional colouration. That way I don't have to waste too much time finding a setup that works for me.

Edited by lowerbassment
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[quote name='MoJo' timestamp='1380716747' post='2229384']
One of my favourite patches on the Zoom B3 is the Marshall Super Bass through a 4x12" cab. [/quote]

But if you played your Zoom through another brand of amp/cab that coloured the sound in a different way, how would know what the Marshall was actually supposed to sound like? :unsure: :D

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[quote name='xgsjx' timestamp='1380727719' post='2229653']
What's on the set list?

I'm looking through you - The Beatles
[/quote]

[url="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YeG5c5y8IpY"]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YeG5c5y8IpY[/url]

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Presumably a transparent amp is likely to have more sales volume as it could be used by a wider variety of players. A highly coloured amp might be great for one particular genre but not for another. Plus the clue is in the name - amplify = make louder.

So, a nice transparent amp for volume and whatever pedals you want for tone. Perhaps?

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[quote name='flyfisher' timestamp='1380728112' post='2229665']
So, a nice transparent amp for volume and whatever pedals you want for tone. Perhaps?
[/quote]

That's the way I work. A cranked Ampeg or Marshall stack is great for rocking out, but not so much for other styles.

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[quote name='Conan' timestamp='1380728011' post='2229663']


But if you played your Zoom through another brand of amp/cab that coloured the sound in a different way, how would know what the Marshall was actually supposed to sound like? :unsure: :D

[/quote]
I don't play my Zoom through an amp. I DI it into the PA. My rig would colour the sound. I would happily swap any transparent rig for a Marshall Superbass 100 and 4x12 cab

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[quote name='Conan' timestamp='1380728671' post='2229677']


Then what you hear depends on the colouration added by the PA and monitors? ;)

In ear monitors, yes, but very little colouration I expect certainly not as much as provided by my rig hence why I don't use it in that band. I'm not knocking people who choose to get the most transparent rig they can, I was simply asking why. I think the most obvious answer from this thread is versatility
[/quote]

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A coloured tone amp usually can only produce that colouration, if you are getting louder, you just get more colouration, its never not got its tone stamped all over your sound.

If all you music that you are goin gto play with that rig needs that particular colour then you are golden, right until you play something that it isnt at all musically appropriate for, then you're stuffed.

I play relatively uncoloured gear by your standards (plenty of mojo and heft from my MB sa450 for me, and my Berg dishes it out in spades, but it isnt saturating at all), if I need colour I have fx that can add more colours than any amp can (other than that SWR oddity with all the fx built in that Michael Manring was pedalling for a while, or the MB multiamp I guess), so why would I need the amp to do that too?

Having said that if I'm tracking or mixing a band then getting the right kind of saturation onto the bass (and everything else pretty much) is absolutely vital, even if its supposed to be dead clean a healthy dollop of tape or transformer style saturation at the right frequencies can lift an ostensibly clean sounding part right out of the track in a glorious way....

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The SVT was clean for its day, loads of speakers so they stay in their clean range, loads of power so lots of headroom, a tone stack with an actual flat setting. Guitarists hate the sound of their instrument and playing, so they have different requirements. Transparency is good for practice because you won't get better if you can't hear the mistakes.

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