Amateur Players & Expensive Gear

[ahpook]

[quote name='Johnston' post='1243500' date='May 24 2011, 09:26 PM']I would disagree with that. Because you may love the sound but if something like the Neck profile, Body shape or weight isn't comfortable then it's going to an uncomfortable gig and most likely feel like a crap one no matter how good the sound.[/quote]

fair point.

a nice-sounding bass that's so heavy that you can't play it for long would be a non-starter, or as you said, one that was uncomfortable to play.

i stand corrected.

[chris_b]

It always hurts when I hear someone sounding better than me when they're playing crap gear!!

[stingrayPete1977]

[quote name='chris_b' post='1243704' date='May 24 2011, 11:56 PM']It always hurts when I hear someone sounding better than me when they're playing my gear!![/quote]

Fixed

[risingson]

[quote name='chris_b' post='1243704' date='May 24 2011, 11:56 PM']It always hurts when I hear someone sounding better than me when they're playing crap gear!![/quote]

Pino Palladino regularly uses a bog standard Squier in the studio and god knows I'd love to be able to play like he does.

[ThomBassmonkey]

[quote name='4000' post='1243637' date='May 24 2011, 11:00 PM']The only thing that matters at the end of the day is whether you're happy, If a Squier does it, fine. If an Alembic is what you need, fine. Just stop worrying about it! [/quote]

Respectfully disagreed.

You might think you sound fine, but if all the audience is hearing is mush, your sound is crap.

I'm not a pro bassist (working on it) and my gear isn't cheap but it's all top of the range stuff. Would I play a Wal or Ritter at the Dog and Duck? If I could afford it and I felt that it was safe, definitely. Would I play a Squier on an arena tour? If I felt it was up to it, sure. It just happens that I find basses that cost around £800 2nd hand are good bang for buck and do the job perfectly. I'd happily take my current gear anywhere I was gigging.

[Jakester]

I take the view that, as an amateur, I work hard at my job in the week so I can justify having decent gear because I enjoy playing gear that fulfils my every need - sound, fit and finish, the works.

With my drum stuff, it's gradually evolved from starting out on entry level gear to the very best vintage and boutique stuff, because a) I can tell thed ifference and because I can.

I'm a newcomer to bass, but it seems to me you get more bang for yer buck with decent 'pro spec' gear then entry level, certainly when it comes to amps.

[mike_zimmerman]

I take the view that if you can afford it and enjoy it, why shouldn't you have nice gear? There's no need to "justify" by claiming that your gig (or heaven forbid, your technical prowess!) requires it, or that no one will take you seriously with cheap gear (as others have said, no one else besides other bass players really cares!). It's a mistake to convince yourself that expensive gear will make you a better player, as well. But I personally just enjoy playing nice instruments, and since I'm doing this mostly for enjoyment anyway, why shouldn't I play an instrument that will maximize my enjoyment?

[henry norton]

I remember doing exactly the same thing. I had a very early Stingray 5 which I decided to sell because I always preferred gigging with my Squier Precision as I could be more relaxed with it. I was always worried the SR5 would get stolen or scratched (!). That said, 20 years on I play bass for fun and don't live in London anymore, I would go out and buy another SR5 today if I could afford it.

[BigRedX]

I have expensive musical instruments because:

1. Music is the most important thing in my life.
2. I like them.
3. I have the appropriate lifestyle choices to allow me the buy and own them.

[Jakester]

[quote name='mike_zimmerman' post='1243794' date='May 25 2011, 07:10 AM']It's a mistake to convince yourself that expensive gear will make you a better player, as well.[/quote]

I think this should be qualified - a well set up, playable and great sounding instrument will make you want to play more than an unplayable dog that sounds crap and requires gymnastic finger contortions.

[ZMech]

I think there's a bit of a diminishing returns thing. The difference between a £50 and £500 bass will be bigger than that between a £500 and £5000 bass. The more expensive ones will have better build quality, and ultimately sound that bit better, but it still comes down to how you EQ it. Think i'll stick to my one mid-range bass

Of course, we'd all see a bigger improvement in our sound if we spent as much time practising as we do browsing the For Sale section

Edited May 25, 2011 by ZMech

[Fat Rich]

[quote name='henry norton' post='1243816' date='May 25 2011, 07:58 AM']I remember doing exactly the same thing. I had a very early Stingray 5 which I decided to sell because I always preferred gigging with my Squier Precision as I could be more relaxed with it. I was always worried the SR5 would get stolen or scratched (!). That said, 20 years on I play bass for fun and don't live in London anymore, I would go out and buy another SR5 today if I could afford it.[/quote]

I felt the same way about my old Jazz bass, someone might steal it at a gig and then I wouldn't have it anymore. So I sold it and didn't have it anymore

Now I have some expensive basses I still worry someone might steal them, but so far they haven't and I've still got them and they put a big smile on my face.

[quote name='mike_zimmerman' post='1243794' date='May 25 2011, 07:10 AM']I take the view that if you can afford it and enjoy it, why shouldn't you have nice gear? There's no need to "justify" by claiming that your gig (or heaven forbid, your technical prowess!) requires it, or that no one will take you seriously with cheap gear (as others have said, no one else besides other bass players really cares!). It's a mistake to convince yourself that expensive gear will make you a better player, as well. But I personally just enjoy playing nice instruments, and since I'm doing this mostly for enjoyment anyway, why shouldn't I play an instrument that will maximize my enjoyment?[/quote]

Exactly this in my opinion.

Edited May 25, 2011 by Fat Rich

[Muzz]

[quote name='Jakester' post='1243928' date='May 25 2011, 09:41 AM']I think this should be qualified - a well set up, playable and great sounding instrument will make you want to play more than an unplayable dog that sounds crap and requires gymnastic finger contortions.[/quote]

True, but where in the quote you're quoting did it say that 'a well set up, playable and great sounding instrument' means an expensive instrument? Sometimes, it's got very little to do with money. Clearly the OP isn't putting his Ric in this category, as it isn't making him want to play it.

I agree completely about amps, but 'bang for buck' in basses is much more prevalent down the bottom end of the (especially secondhand) market - look at what you can get a secondhand Warwick for these days - you may not like the brand for any number of reasons, but the build quality is fantastic.

[neepheid]

[quote name='ZMech' post='1243943' date='May 25 2011, 09:53 AM']I think there's a bit of a diminishing returns thing. The difference between a £50 and £500 bass will be bigger than that between a £500 and £5000 bass. The more expensive ones will have better build quality, and ultimately sound that bit better, but it still comes down to how you EQ it. Think i'll stick to my one mid-range bass

Of course, we'd all see a bigger improvement in our sound if we spent as much time practising as we do browsing the For Sale section [/quote]

Agree on both points (especially the second). I feel that I've reached a price point in my gear collecting where I can't/don't/won't see the benefit of spending more. Prime example is the G&L Tribute L-2000. What's the point in getting a USA G&L? Same pickups, the Tribute is already pretty well screwed together, looks quite nice anyway, maybe a little heavy, but does a slight aesthetic improvement (nicer ash grain, more colour choices, the possibility of binding), perhaps a slightly lighter body, and tuners stamped with G&L along with the ALL IMPORTANT LOGO on the headstock really justify a doubling in price? Not for me, because there isn't a corresponding doubling in quality as perceived by me. Yes, I have played a USA L-2000 (in fact it was one at the Moffat bash which started me off on G&L basses in the first place) and while it was very nice and all, I'm glad I hedged my bets and sourced a Tribute - all the sound with a neck I like for half the cost.

[Conan]

[quote name='spongebob' post='1243245' date='May 24 2011, 06:39 PM']Nobody batted an eyelid over the Squier headstock - it was a very good tool for the job.[/quote]

Were you seriously expecting them to? For the non-bass players in the audience (i.e. most of them), the only thing they might notice about your bass is the colour. Sound-wise, they are also unlikely to notice you unless you sound particularly awful or are too loud.

Bass Chat is not the real world...

[ZMech]

[quote name='Conan' post='1244022' date='May 25 2011, 11:01 AM']Sound-wise, they are also unlikely to notice you unless you sound particularly awful or are too loud.[/quote]
all about the solo-bass riff intro! then they'll notice you

[BigRedX]

[quote name='ZMech' post='1244050' date='May 25 2011, 11:15 AM']all about the solo-bass riff intro! then they'll notice you [/quote]
No they'll just notice that you couldn't shut up and get on with the song...

;-)

[ZMech]

Touche redX. although I meant a short few bars like with this. Of course most punters will assume it's a distorted guitar

[dan670844]

[quote name='bubinga5' post='1243260' date='May 24 2011, 06:52 PM']Ive had a few expensive basses and now im playing a 21 year old MIJ Fender Jazz..Although im playing through Aguilar amps im the happiest ive ever been... there are so many great basses that sound awsome and play very very well.. like Rob said... its if your happy..

instruments are so subjective to the individual player... different strokes and all that.. and knowone cares what bass your playing.. only you[/quote]

That era jap 62's reissue jazz is a good 'un though! so well made, quality and action top notch, out of all of my bass's my CAR 1991 '62 reissue is my fav bass and I paid £250 quid for it.

Edited May 25, 2011 by dan670844

[lojo]

For most of us just doing pubs and functions, I think its clear we mostly agree that names on headstocks are not needed, but as its is mainly a hobby we if we are working and can afford it, we like to have something that means something to us

But I am wondering, for those that really do pro gigs, like pit work or sessions etc, although a broadway production wouldn't suffer if the bassist played a Cheapo, would you be judged by the guys employing you on your gear before you play a note ?

[risingson]

[quote name='lojo' post='1244163' date='May 25 2011, 12:49 PM']But I am wondering, for those that really do pro gigs, like pit work or sessions etc, although a broadway production wouldn't suffer if the bassist played a Cheapo, would you be judged by the guys employing you on your gear before you play a note ?[/quote]

People in those situations will be called in because of reputation and through word of mouth, not for the gear they use. It's possible that producers will ask a session player to use a different instrument for a more fitting sound, but I doubt that anyone would care what instrument you were using providing you weren't causing difficulties for everyone else. If it ain't broke, don't fix it etc.

[CPBassman]

I bought the basses that I own and have done (and there have been many) for the same reason as I play. Love !!!

The bass is a stunning piece of engineering. I love the curves, the way it feels and the vibes it gives off. I love the way it can control the groove of the band regardless of what the others think. BASS RULES

They are all individual and have their own individual nuances whilst doing the same job. Ive traded a lot but found that there is a certain cost area where the bass doesnt really lose value. I was chatting to Stu (vmaxblues) about it the other day. He had a Squier that was incredible for what it cost, the only issue with that is that it holds no residual value but can hold its own on any stage.

Its a love affair through and through.

Edited May 25, 2011 by CPBassman

[lemmywinks]

[quote name='lojo' post='1244163' date='May 25 2011, 12:49 PM']But I am wondering, for those that really do pro gigs, like pit work or sessions etc, although a broadway production wouldn't suffer if the bassist played a Cheapo, would you be judged by the guys employing you on your gear before you play a note ?[/quote]


Still i reckon you could turn up to a session with one of those HK Marleaux copies like the one Shockwave had and everyone would think it was a £2-3k bass. Pic from his FS post here:



Cheap doesn't always have to mean a Fender knock-off. That thing looks like a boutique bass, well i supose it was shamelessley copied off one! I think if people don't recognise a brand name and the instrument looks upmarket then they'll automatically assume it to be a luthier job.

[spongebob]

Good point made earlier about amps....

I do use Markbass stuff - great sounding amps that make most stuff sound good!

Agree that excellent amplification is a big part of the job.

Point about the venues was that in so many pubs, etc, band gets stuck in a tight space.....amps and kit stacked more for space than sound quality....no soundman, etc.....just the singer giving a quick 'sound okay boys...1,2,3,4....!'

With this in mind, the subtle differences of a high-end bass I feel would be lost in the general racket!

I played a gig last year where my car got vandalized outside. I was inside with 2.5k's worth of bass gear, and I thought.......is this really necessary??

[Deep Thought]

I sometimes question the wisdom of playing small pub gigs like we do with 1500 quids worth of bass. I could play my Mex Precision and leave the Shuker at home, but at the end of the day I like playing it so much, and it sounds so much better, I can never resist using it. It was made to be played, preferably live, so I think it would be a shame not to use it. If we stop gigging I doubt I'll be able to justify keeping it, so I'm making the most of it while I can.