Fender Tone Stack in a Pedal

[Delberthot]

I'm not big on pedals but one thing I miss is the preamp stage of the Trace V-type combo I used to have for certain songs for grit and mild overdrive.

I could buy the preamp version and figure out a way to switch it in and out of my signal chain but was wondering if there was anything close to it in a pedal format.

I've never found a usable overdrive/distortion pedal but something like this would be ideal - what about a VT Bass, would this get me there or is it completely different?

[yorick]

Didn't Sansamp do a Fender "flavour" pedal in their Character series?

[GarethFlatlands]

[quote name='yorick' post='963242' date='Sep 21 2010, 01:09 PM']Didn't Sansamp do a Fender "flavour" pedal in their Character series?[/quote]

I think so, Boss also do a Bassman stomp box.

[BassBod]

I've thought the same thing (Alembic F2B in a box...no valves?) and I'd suggest the Award JD10 guitar pedal (one was on sale here a week or two ago?) may be worth a try? I've not used one, but I've heard good guitar sounds from them. I did have a VT Bass and thought it was very good for general "amp sim" use. I only sold mine to fund other things in a cash crisis....that seems to be going on and on and on...

[Delberthot]

I've heard that the tech 21 & Boss pedals aren't meant to be very good for bass - what about this:

[url="http://www.bass.se/2009/valvedrive.htm"]http://www.bass.se/2009/valvedrive.htm[/url]

apparently it uses a similar circuit.

in fact f*** that, its over £200

Cheaper buying a Trace preamp

Edited September 21, 2010 by Delberthot

[krispn]

Hey this ain't Fedner but it might give you something like what you're after - probably expensive though.

I think its based on the Baxandal type tone circuit and ultimately going for the Ampeg B15 vibe more than Fender

I'm currently using a valve drive and plan to run it through the power amp only this wed night at practice just to hear how it sounds.


www.barberelectronics.com/linden.html

Or you could buy your ex the V Type combo from me

Edited September 21, 2010 by krispn

[Gareth Hughes]

Check out the Youtube clips for the Catalinbread SFT pedal - it's sounds as good for real. I'm running that thru a Markbass LMK and LOVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVIIIIIIIIIIIINGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGG it.

[Delberthot]

If this is representative of the pedal then we could have a winner

[url="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xr8kdWpB3U4&feature=related"]VT Bass[/url]


The Catalinbread one does sound good but there seem to be a wider variety of sounds available from the VT bass but then again knowing me I'll probably set it on one and leave it on all gig

[nick]

[quote name='BassBod' post='963412' date='Sep 21 2010, 03:34 PM']I've thought the same thing (Alembic F2B in a box...no valves?)[/quote]

Alembic F2B is supposed to be similar. You could always get someone to build one for you [url="http://moosapotamus.net/IDEAS/F2B/alembic.htm"]Alembic F2B schematic[/url].

Along with the SFT, there's also the 'Flipster'. One on here for sale at the moment.
Next on my list of pedal builds.

..... Also the Barber Linden EQ, if you're after more of the tone rather than any drive.

Edited September 21, 2010 by nick

[wateroftyne]

EBS Valvedrive is a Fender tone stack.

[BassBod]

I'm a numpty when it comes to electricky stuff - but, in theory, could you build half an F2B in a small box, using a FET rather than a valve..with the same passive tone section..and power it from a 9v battery?

I love the sound of my old F2B but hate carrying rack boxes to small quiet jazz gigs!

Edited September 21, 2010 by BassBod

[Delberthot]

[quote name='wateroftyne' post='963794' date='Sep 21 2010, 09:02 PM']EBS Valvedrive is a Fender tone stack.[/quote]


I don't really want to spend £200 on a pedal unless its the dogs danglies and gives me exactly what I want.

Given my past experience with gear I am unlikely to keep a hold of it - fancy having a go at one of those DIY jobbies as well, expecially one that had 2 valves like the Trace

I'm off for a rummage around

[Mr. Foxen]

[quote name='BassBod' post='963813' date='Sep 21 2010, 09:20 PM']I'm a numpty when it comes to electricky stuff - but, in theory, could you build half an F2B in a small box, using a FET rather than a valve..with the same passive tone section..and power it from a 9v battery?

I love the sound of my old F2B but hate carrying rack boxes to small quiet jazz gigs![/quote]

Fairly sure a FET wouldn't give same sort of grit as a valve, the the EQ curve could be done. Could probably fold up the cirucit with a valve into a sensible space. Maybe Umph could do something with those subminature valves he was using.

[BassBod]

Thing is, I don't use an ounce of grit...or grind...I've even got low gain (5751) valves in it. Doom it is not. Its really the tone stack, clean gain boost, and if I'm greedy a DI output, I'm after. That I can put in my pocket.

[Delberthot]

Found this which is meant to be based on the Fender tone stack and similar to the Alembic

[url="http://www.diyguitarist.com/"]http://www.diyguitarist.com/[/url]

click on Guitar FX at the top then scroll down to Modified Real McTube II

I'm lost when it comes to circuit diagrams so I am either going to buy a pedal or see if someone can build me one of these

Edited September 21, 2010 by Delberthot

[BassBod]

Looks interesting..but 120v and a hot valve in a small box is a bit scary for me, especially when the keyboard player spills his lager (as recently happened to my GK combo).

I might follow up the FET idea...but I need a tame boffin.

[Delberthot]

[quote name='BassBod' post='963901' date='Sep 21 2010, 10:40 PM']Looks interesting..but 120v and a hot valve in a small box is a bit scary for me, especially when the keyboard player spills his lager (as recently happened to my GK combo).

I might follow up the FET idea...but I need a [u][b]tame boffin[/b][/u].[/quote]


Is that a type of real ale?

[King Tut]

[quote name='Delberthot' post='963920' date='Sep 21 2010, 10:56 PM']Is that a type of real ale?[/quote]

PMSL!!

[obbm]

Electro Harmonix "English Muffn" is worth a look. It has a Fender tone stack. I changed to capacitors in mine to bass values.

[BassBod]

Question for those with a technical perspective - why does the "fender" tone stack (wasn't it RCA's to start with?) nearly always seem to go with valves? Is it just tube-based-marketing, or is there something irreplaceable about the combination of valve pre-amp stage and passive tone network?

Could it be done with FETs and less emphasis on the distortion potential?

[Silent Fly]

I don't know if it is of any help but the Tech21 VT Bass and the Catalinbread SFT pedal don't use a Fender tone stack.

[quote name='BassBod' post='964401' date='Sep 22 2010, 12:55 PM']Question for those with a technical perspective - why does the "fender" tone stack (wasn't it RCA's to start with?) nearly always seem to go with valves? Is it just tube-based-marketing, or is there something irreplaceable about the combination of valve pre-amp stage and passive tone network?[/quote]

I think it just sounded nice with valves and guitar players were happy with it.

I don't think there is necessarily an irreplaceable combination Fender-tone-stack + valves. A Fender tone stack could be implemented with any other amplifier even a very linear one.

[quote name='BassBod' post='964401' date='Sep 22 2010, 12:55 PM']Could it be done with FETs and less emphasis on the distortion potential?[/quote]

I don't see any major problem in implementing a transistor (FET or anything else) preamplifier with a Fender tone stack.

Personally, I use another viewpoint when I design a circuit. I start from the sound and I use the best parts to achieve what look for. FET might do the trick but it also possible that other type of components can lead to better results.

[BassBod]

Now that sounds encouraging...time to think about my wish list and budget? I was only thinking FET as they seem to be described as the most "valve like" of the transistor options...but I have absolutely no idea if this is true! Mind you, I read it all on this interweb..so it must be true??

[Dood]

Hmmm! Interesting this post should arise - as I was just thinking the other day how nice it would be if Hartke put their LH amplifier preamps in a box and sold it seperately. It's just a killer preamp - so simple and great sounding. If a FET / IC version could do / sound the same it'd be an absolute winner in any set up. Especially those who want a simple preamp to drive a power amp / PA via the DI output. Love mine!

That's got the cogs turning!

[Dood]

Although not what I was thinking about at first - but I did stumble on a resource for the Muff'n schematic to compare against the afore mentioned Alembic and Trace schems. I have to say I am pretty enamoured with the idea of the single valve Hartke version though - I haven't seen a diagram for that one so can't really comment further.


[url="http://www.freestompboxes.org/viewtopic.php?f=2&p=43256"]http://www.freestompboxes.org/viewtopic.php?f=2&p=43256[/url]

[LukeFRC]

caitlinbread sft is based on an ampeg preamp isn't it? it's pretty good, well my homemade version is