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Shockwave

Barefaced T'Vintage Review.

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Just to clarify a couple of things - tee-nuts don't screw into plywood, they bite into it and are held in by the tension of the bolts. Once the bolts are tightened up you effectively have eight clamps gripping each speaker frame very hard. But they are a bastard to deal with - put too much pressure on the screwdriver when undoing them and they pop out, hence Rob's pains! Great once they're done up though.

Also, I said to Rob that I'd arrange to have the cab collected on the same day as he received a replacement cab from me - that way he'd have been able to use the cab with the dodgy handles until the replacement arrived, and not have the cost of returning the cab. Unfortunately he insisted that he could the cab shipped back to me for only £25 and that that would be much more convenient for him and he sent it almost immediately whilst I didn't have the replacement cab sorted for quite some time. And the shipping cost him more than expected probably because he'd thrown away the original packaging and his multiple layers of cardboard solution added quite a bit more weight.

Obviously the whole issue arose because I screwed up in the first place (again, sorry!) but Rob, I wish you'd been a little less impetuous and not gone trying to fix the problem yourself, I wish you'd kept the original packaging (at least until the end of the one month trial period), and I wish you'd let me collect the cab once a replacement had been shipped to you. That would have made your experience significantly less painful, especially as I realised that the problem was the two screws being far too small before I received the returned cab and thus I could have sent you the correct long fat screws to put in, which would have entirely solved the problem (and you'd have been £50 better off). But with your impatience to sort things out I rather failed to keep control of the fix - again, sorry!

Alex

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[quote name='largo' post='684336' date='Dec 14 2009, 07:13 PM']:) Yep I'm the one it's heading to...[/quote]

Stephen, if possible, could you bring that in to me at the usual place to have a look/listen? And bring your red bass as well!!

cheers

D.

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I don't understand how you could find the Vintage lacking in lows!

I played my Lakland and Thunderfunk through 2 Compacts at the SE Bass Bash and everyone standing within 6 feet had their rib cages vibrating when I hit the lower notes!

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[quote name='alexclaber' post='684417' date='Dec 14 2009, 08:13 PM']Just to clarify a couple of things - tee-nuts don't screw into plywood, they bite into it and are held in by the tension of the bolts. Once the bolts are tightened up you effectively have eight clamps gripping each speaker frame very hard. But they are a bastard to deal with - put too much pressure on the screwdriver when undoing them and they pop out, hence Rob's pains! Great once they're done up though.[/quote]

[quote]Also, I said to Rob that I'd arrange to have the cab collected on the same day as he received a replacement cab from me - that way he'd have been able to use the cab with the dodgy handles until the replacement arrived, and not have the cost of returning the cab. Unfortunately he insisted that he could the cab shipped back to me for only £25 and that that would be much more convenient for him and he sent it almost immediately whilst I didn't have the replacement cab sorted for quite some time. And the shipping cost him more than expected probably because he'd thrown away the original packaging and his multiple layers of cardboard solution added quite a bit more weight.[/quote]

I was under the impression via e-mails that you were going to send a new one out that week. I had to send it via the other shipping because i have no way of getting a courier to pick up something from my place which i explained already. I didnt chuck away the packaging but i did have to flatpack it down. I didnt know how to put it back together so i did what i thought best and then packed it some more!


[quote]Obviously the whole issue arose because I screwed up in the first place (again, sorry!) but Rob, I wish you'd been a little less impetuous and not gone trying to fix the problem yourself, I wish you'd kept the original packaging (at least until the end of the one month trial period), and I wish you'd let me collect the cab once a replacement had been shipped to you. That would have made your experience significantly less painful, especially as I realised that the problem was the two screws being far too small before I received the returned cab and thus I could have sent you the correct long fat screws to put in, which would have entirely solved the problem (and you'd have been £50 better off). But with your impatience to sort things out I rather failed to keep control of the fix - again, sorry!

Alex[/quote]

I dont think i was impetuous, I had already waited past the date i was to recieve the cab, and wanted to have a working cab. I decided to open it up before you sent out the spare parts just incase i couldnt put the tee nuts in the cab because the current holes could have been too close to the brackets. I opened it up and saw that the screws never missed the brackets, at that point i knew that the screws werent man enough for the job. If i had waited until the parts came through only to open it up and found it was another problem completely then i would had to wait another week to get the new screws through (thats if you remembered in time that you forgot to put the screws back in anyway) I just wanted a working cab.

I was only impatient considering the times you said the cab was to be ready and sent out, only for it to be put back a few more days. If i had waited for the parts to get here, then open the cab up only to find i needed different parts instead (Which is what would have happened) then i would have had to wait longer for the problems to be sorted out.

Rob.

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[quote name='MythSte' post='684415' date='Dec 14 2009, 08:12 PM']That was funny the first time :)[/quote]

...and it still is now.

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[quote name='deksawyer' post='684424' date='Dec 14 2009, 08:19 PM']Stephen, if possible, could you bring that in to me at the usual place to have a look/listen? And bring your red bass as well!!

cheers

D.[/quote]

Nae bother! Hoping to have it around end of Jan as I've got 3 gigs over a couple of weeks. Might arrange for you to bring the Tecamp in at the same time :)

Edited by largo

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Sorry, I didn't see your reply before writing my addendum!

[quote name='Shockwave' post='684404' date='Dec 14 2009, 08:09 PM']As you know, i already know about the return policy, i havent made a decision yet, I guess i am mostly semi satisfied due to the experience as opposed to the actual cab itself. I do not gig very regularily so my perceieved flimsyness is not so much an issue with me. However it is my opinion which i feel other people should know if they plan to regularily gig with it.[/quote]

The thing is that it isn't flimsy but I can understand why your handle and grill experience makes you think that.

[quote name='Shockwave' post='684404' date='Dec 14 2009, 08:09 PM']Whilst this is true, some of the tee nuts werent securely screwed as a number of them only partially covered the wood (IE a small section of the tee nut isent secured into wood). I realised when i was unscrewing them that something was dropping out, when i started undoing them more gently, the tee nuts were still dropping out.[/quote]

That's not how tee-nuts work, they act like a clamp. They aren't screwed into the wood and if you exert any more pressure on the bolt than that required for the bit to grip the head, then they will pop out. They are not fun to work with but the end result is excellent - the speaker is so firmly clamped it adds useful bracing to the baffle, like a semi-monocoque chassis car.

[quote name='Shockwave' post='684404' date='Dec 14 2009, 08:09 PM']I understand that this was probably one off, Though i still question how good the handles really are. Maybe a handle that uses more then one screw per end would feel more solid?[/quote]

I'm absolutely confident that you could be totally abusive with the handles the way they are normally installed and they will never have a problem. The screws that caused the problem were so tiny it's an unfortunate miracle they stayed in whilst I was putting the cab in the box. The correct screws would take a ridiculous force to pull them out.

[quote name='Shockwave' post='684404' date='Dec 14 2009, 08:09 PM']I havent ranted it that much admittedly. Somehow i was under the impression that you ran in the speakers during testing before sending them out.[/quote]

I did on the early cabs but stopped when I realised it just took way too much time. I think it mentions this on the website but if it doesn't then I'll correct that. There are a ton more lows in there, it will open up a lot but it will take much longer to run in than a Compact unless you play it twice as loud.

[quote name='Shockwave' post='684404' date='Dec 14 2009, 08:09 PM']I'll make a decision at somepoint soon. Thanks for getting back to me, i was already aware i can return it because of the return policy.

What is your position based on the partial refunds? Should people pay for the return of a cab that is not fit for purpose? Or is shipping refunded? On this assumption, if i returned this cab, wouldnt i get shipping refunded twice as well as the full price of the cab?[/quote]

My position is that I want every buyer to be happy with the experience, whether they keep the cab or not. In this case if you return the cab then I'll make sure you suffer zero financial loss for the whole experience as it was not what a normal Barefaced customer enjoys.

Cheers!

Alex

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Can you keep your negotiations to yourselves please chaps.

ped

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[quote name='alexclaber' post='684417' date='Dec 14 2009, 08:13 PM']Also, I said to Rob that I'd arrange to have the cab collected on the same day as he received a replacement cab from me - that way he'd have been able to use the cab with the dodgy handles until the replacement arrived, and not have the cost of returning the cab. Unfortunately he insisted that he could the cab shipped back to me for only £25 and that that would be much more convenient for him and he sent it almost immediately whilst I didn't have the replacement cab sorted for quite some time. And the shipping cost him more than expected probably because he'd thrown away the original packaging and his multiple layers of cardboard solution added quite a bit more weight.

Obviously the whole issue arose because I screwed up in the first place (again, sorry!) but Rob, I wish you'd been a little less impetuous and not gone trying to fix the problem yourself, I wish you'd kept the original packaging (at least until the end of the one month trial period), and I wish you'd let me collect the cab once a replacement had been shipped to you. That would have made your experience significantly less painful, especially as I realised that the problem was the two screws being far too small before I received the returned cab and thus I could have sent you the correct long fat screws to put in, which would have entirely solved the problem (and you'd have been £50 better off). But with your impatience to sort things out I rather failed to keep control of the fix - again, sorry!

Alex[/quote]

Just found this in an email

[quote]From: Barefaced Bass ([email protected])
Sent: 23 November 2009 09:18:25
To: Robert Quick ([email protected])
I have a Vintage just waiting for the tweeter to go in, so I can send you
that one this week and get the cab collected on the same day, you just
need to box up your current cab safely in the original packaging.[/quote]

Anyway, i will contact you when i decide what to do with the Vintage. I am unsure, i'll play it in a bit more and see.

Cheers!

Rob.

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[quote name='ped' post='684457' date='Dec 14 2009, 08:35 PM']Can you keep your negotiations to yourselves please chaps.

ped[/quote]

Agreed. But you did publish all the correspondance with regards to your Roland experience.

Kinda makes for interesting reading.

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[quote name='EBS_freak' post='684459' date='Dec 14 2009, 08:36 PM']Agreed. But you did publish all the correspondance with regards to your Roland experience.

Kinda makes for interesting reading.[/quote]

With all due respect, Roland werent here so there was no possibility of turning into a public discussion between the two parties.

I agree with Ped.

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[quote name='Shockwave' post='684458' date='Dec 14 2009, 08:36 PM']Just found this in an email[/quote]

There you go, me being over-optimistic again on how quickly I can get a cab finished! But you do see that I said I'll get it sent so it arrives on the same day as the other cab is collected, hence zero cab-less time.

Alex

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Not all of it - and the company in question weren't about to defend themselves!

Seriously - let's just take the review at face value and let Alex and Rob sort this out in private.

ped

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[quote name='Shockwave' post='684462' date='Dec 14 2009, 08:38 PM']I agree with Ped.[/quote]

I'll keep quiet then. Email me if you want anything!

Alex

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[quote name='alexclaber' post='684468' date='Dec 14 2009, 08:40 PM']I'll keep quiet then. Email me if you want anything!

Alex[/quote]

Probably wise. Damage limitation and all that.

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[quote name='ped' post='684457' date='Dec 14 2009, 08:35 PM']Can you keep your negotiations to yourselves please chaps.

ped[/quote]

Exactly what I was thinking as I've been reading through this.

Honest review of the product, honourable response from the supplier - no need for the full laundry to see light here.

Shame one example of a product will inevitably become a major point of attention on BC, and a big potential hurdle for the future for Alex.

If others on here like their Barefaced products, now would be a good time to chime in, but to keep it all balanced, those with misgivings about their Barefaced product should also speak up.

Hope a mutually agreeable resolution is reached soon.

Good luck to both parties.


Mark

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Picking up on Mark's suggestion, I think I'm known to be a fan of Alex's work.

Really sorry to hear about Shockwave's experience, and I'm delighted that it seems to be getting sorted now.

I have the very first Big One, plus one of the earliest Midgets. My experience has clearly been different from Shockwave's but so far I have found both cabs very robust and a delight to use. Clearly I can't comment on the Vintage (or the Compact), but I wouldn't hesitate to buy another cab from Alex.

On a purely personal note, I rather like the "home-made" air of these cabs and the finish is standing up well so far to the (relatively small number of) gigs I've played with them.

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[quote name='ped' post='684457' date='Dec 14 2009, 08:35 PM']Can you keep your negotiations to yourselves please chaps.

ped[/quote]
+1. That's kinda what I was getting at originally.

Stuff like this should be saved for when everything has been concluded. IMO.

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[quote name='Happy Jack' post='684563' date='Dec 14 2009, 09:45 PM']Picking up on Mark's suggestion, I think I'm known to be a fan of Alex's work.

Really sorry to hear about Shockwave's experience, and I'm delighted that it seems to be getting sorted now.[/quote]

Well nothings sorted as i havent decided what to do yet! I always knew there was an option to return it so there was never a problem with that.

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My Vintage has been thrown in the back of taxis, Dropped down stairs, On the recieving end of a cymbol and the only damage thats actually occoured is the cloth has "dented" slightly near one corner. The finish actually has quite a lot of marks on it... Marks from other things not as tough as it.

We need to learn to not get drunk before we've re-loaded into whatever transport we're using...

Naturally though, If anyones not sure i'm more than happy to have people over for a play, or even if you want to take it for a gig. be my guest.

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[quote name='Musicman20' post='684583' date='Dec 14 2009, 09:58 PM']My thoughts are that you might be better suited to another cabinet.[/quote]

Well on the initial advice, Alex said that it would be fine to emulate the AWS tone. Its kinda close to it at the moment, but running it in will tell if it truly can manage that particular tone. (Oh and an amp upgrade which is in the works)

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Not related to any of the exchanges in this thread, but I do have some prior knowledge of the dreaded T nuts from my model aircraft days. What we used to do was install them as normal so that the points bit into the wood. We then popped them back out, put a dab of two pack epoxy or super glue underneath (don't get any on the threads!) and then put it all back together. Voila - no more T nuts dropping out.

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[quote name='Daquifsta' post='684599' date='Dec 14 2009, 10:19 PM']Not related to any of the exchanges in this thread, but I do have some prior knowledge of the dreaded T nuts from my model aircraft days. What we used to do was install them as normal so that the points bit into the wood. We then popped them back out, put a dab of two pack epoxy or super glue underneath (don't get any on the threads!) and then put it all back together. Voila - no more T nuts dropping out.[/quote]

Thats what i had to do when i put the inital one back together it seemed the only solution!

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