Anyone here a pro bass player?

[Kiwi]

[quote name='Lew-Bass' post='637264' date='Oct 26 2009, 08:59 PM']Who are they, if you don't mind me asking?[/quote]
Noone that I know of with a chart topping band at the moment apart from Jimmy but I can't remember what his username is. Although I guess you could count Andrew McKinney/Ian King with JTQ as fairly well known and they've played to thousands. There's also Dave Marks who plays with Rick Parfitt Jnr, Stuart Clayton who tours with Carl Palmer, plus I'm sure some of the other pros (Phil Mann, Mike Brooks, Nick Owen, Jo Nichols, Steve Lawson, Janek Gwisdala) as well as those who have already responded here, must have played to large audiences at one time or another. I think Phil Mulford is a member as well but its been ages since I've seen him post anything. There could be others who I'm not aware of, I guess.

[Doddy]

[quote name='fatgoogle' post='637334' date='Oct 26 2009, 08:54 PM']Can i ask
for people who have become pro musicians, and those who did study music, did you study performance or theory. Did you come to it later in life or as soon as you left collage. And how did you get out there?[/quote]

I had my first lesson the day I picked up a bass and learned to associate the fingerboard with the Stave. I took
lessons for about a year,which mostly got my reading together,and I practised all the time. I took Music at A level,
but didn't do particularly well.Most of what I know theory wise came when I became more interested in it a few years later.
I still take occasional lessons to get some new ideas-most recently from Bryan Beller and Janek Gwizdala. I never studied
performance as that can only come from actually doing it.

[Gareth Hughes]

For the most part I'm self-taught, banging away to records since I was 13. I'm 32 now. I did attend a music course for a few years, at NVQ level. Not a well run course at the time, and the qualification itself hasn't done diddly for me (but that reflects more on me than the course - I'm not the academic type). It did open my ears, and attitude, to what else goes on in this musical world and that's been an invaluable lesson to adapting and surviving as a working musician. It also opened the door to reading, which I pursued in earnest after I left.

As for getting my foot in the door - I called around anyone I vaguely knew and let them know I wanted to gig, which in reality meant calling guys I knew playing in wedding/cover bands and theatre jobs rather than original music. My timing was good as I called one guy who's lead singer/bassist was leaving so I was able to step in and learn the gig while the bassist just sang. Through that gig I met a pile of other musicians, as this particular band had a constant stream of deps in all roles. I'm pretty sure I gave my number to every one that passed thru.

Then I got the number of a well-respected and established guy I knew needed a dep for the up-coming panto and called him. I can still remember how much I was bricking myself at the phonebox while I called him. Thankfully got his voicemail and he called me back. I auditioned for him and the MD of the show a few days later and got the dep gig, which in reality was only two or three shows at the end of an 80-odd show run. Might have seemed futile then, but I have a good relationship with him to this day. (Actually just borrowed his upright to do an album last week while my new one makes it's way here).

Then a drummer from the first cover band recommended me for a well known band here that had reformed, I got that gig and that opened more doors. Same drummer also recommended me to the fixer for the Irish production of 'RENT' and, with it being a ten week run, that's how I ended up in Dublin. The other guys in the band assured me that if I moved down I'd get plenty of work as there weren't too many readers on electric and upright. The guitarist in the band also lived with one of the main fixers in town so that helped out immensely.

I could go on about how one gig lead to the other - like how I did a gig on Saturday just past, covering for a guy that I met in Switzerland on a festival about two years ago - the point being that one thing leads to another, it just might not be obvious at the time. So like someone said above - play each gig to your best ability, because you don't know who is in the audience.

[skankdelvar]

[quote name='Lew-Bass' post='637264' date='Oct 26 2009, 07:59 PM']Who are they, if you don't mind me asking?[/quote]

The ludicrously talented yet unbelievably modest Craig Martini posts on here a bit. jimijimmi treads the boards with The Quireboys and Raven Vandelle.

Edited October 26, 2009 by skankdelvar

[waynepunkdude]

Bass player from Elliot Minor posts on here.

[jakenewmanbass]

Yep pro for a shade under 20 years. I eat (very well in fact) Have been flown to every corner of the world to play to thousands including presidents and royalty, eaten in the best restaurants and stately homes, even palaces, been given hotel rooms bigger than my house, have met and worked with tons of 'celebrities' and backed a ton of UK tv artists, appeared on tv shows, toured with some very very good US artists, recorded for major labels, and minor ones, have (probably) been heard playing bass by almost everyone on this forum on tv and radio jingles. And to top it all.... last March (that's '08).... I played to an enthralled....


couple (might have been four) on the freezing Easter bank holiday in a tent in a field at a game fayre in Northamptonshire (not a game show... a game fayre, you know,... attended by people who want to shoot stuff)
It was so cold I had an oil radiator between my legs for the entire set. And that was the beginning of the outdoor season in the wind, pissing rain, blistering heat, in a wool tail suit.


The point is, you have to be able to approach it all with a level head and be good wherever you are whatever the conditions. It's the best job in the world for me because I love to play my bass....

[johnmarley]

I play bass for a living and do 6 or 7 gigs a week on average. I think the things people really look for are good time keeping, being open minded about styles, being able to read and being friendly. People will take a friendly bass player who's really good over a great one who's not nice to be round. Also, playing double bass is a big bonus.

[Lew-Bass]

[quote name='waynepunkdude' post='637456' date='Oct 26 2009, 10:38 PM']Bass player from Elliot Minor posts on here.[/quote]

Ah yeah, forgot about him. He's probably the most famous currently then

[Prosebass]

Interesting thread in that there seems a distinction between bassists who play other peoples music, and those who are sucessful doing there own stuff in original bands.
It would be interesting to know what the ratio is of this ? I haven't played in a band for 20+ plus (just as well some may say) but I was never interested in playing any music other than my own when I did play in bands, and never considered playing bass as a career other than by playing original stuff.
I'd be interested to know if the pro - bassists would rather be doing their own stuff , or are they happy to do what they do providing it pays well ? Are there times when it is just 'another job' with very little stimulus or reward artistic or otherwise ?

Edited October 27, 2009 by Prosebass

[Doddy]

The guy's who are successful in an original band are usually the ones with a short career.What
happens when the band eventually ends?
I've noticed that the players who sustain a long career are the ones who can and will play everything
from original music to pure cheese. When you work as a freelance musician-as I do-'art' is not
always the reason for playing.
I personally don't have a great deal of interest in doing my own
music right now.I have worked with plenty of original projects,but it's not 'my' music.I am happy to
be a sideman at the moment,but that may change in a couple of years.

[Prosebass]

[quote name='Doddy' post='637743' date='Oct 27 2009, 11:28 AM']The guy's who are successful in an original band are usually the ones with a short career.What
happens when the band eventually ends?
I've noticed that the players who sustain a long career are the ones who can and will play everything
from original music to pure cheese. When you work as a freelance musician-as I do-'art' is not
always the reason for playing.
I personally don't have a great deal of interest in doing my own
music right now.I have worked with plenty of original projects,but it's not 'my' music.I am happy to
be a sideman at the moment,but that may change in a couple of years.[/quote]

Excellent insight for me to digest. Many people go through life not liking the job / careers they choose and I suppose even if you enjoy your lot there are days when you would rather do something else.
Having never considered playing as a profession (and I have taken a different path to persue now) I never considered playing bass as a means of income , rather as a means of enjoyment and relaxation and getting some tracks down just for the fun of it.
Does this mean the pro bassists job can have an analogy with a plumers job in so much that somedays you are un-blocking a toilet and others you are fitting a luxury bathroom ?
Or is it just that different bassists get a different experience from whatever they do just as in other walks of life ?
I suppose some people wouldn't consider getting covered in wood dust and standing at a workbench alone all day fun but I do.
Very interesting to get different aspects and opinions on being involved in the music industry as a means of income.

[OutToPlayJazz]

I started off as a classical player at school - Cello & double bass. Later on in my teens I discovered that the electric bass was identical to play to the double bass & that was it! Those are my main three. I studied as a double bass player/cellist/conductor at Birmingham. One trick is to be able to diversify. I also teach violin, viola, piano & classical guitar. (Also electric guitar if I absolutely have to!)

I make my living as an instrumental teacher & from professional playing these days. Moreso the playing at the moment, since I left my post as head of music at a school earlier this year. I mainly play in jazz bands and in musical theatre. But at the end of the day, I'll play for anyone who pays me! Recent jobs have been the premiere of a new musical in Sheffield (cello), sight reading Buddy Rich arrangements for an Army Big Band & in December/Jan I'll be the bass player for the Sheffield Professional Pantomime with Toyah Wilcox in the lead.

A lot of the work comes from contacts you make along the way. I moved into my current area in 2004 & one of the first things I did was to make contact with the local music shops. One shop in particular got me into one theatre company & from there, I now do all the bass playing for 6 theatre companies over a 100 mile radius & a lot of other work besides.

[Doddy]

Of course you are going to have gigs that are going to be pretty nasty,but you still
need to adopt the right attitude and play your best. On those kinds of gigs
I always think that no matter how much you may be disliking it,it's still better
than shelf stacking at Tesco's.(No disrespect to those that do).
I love to play the bass as much for enjoyment as I do for a living,so being
able to do both at the same time is great and I couldn't imagine doing anything
else(not that I could).

[beerdragon]

[quote name='Lew-Bass' post='637685' date='Oct 27 2009, 10:35 AM']Ah yeah, forgot about him. He's probably the most famous currently then[/quote]

Nah i'll go with Manfred Manns Earthband.

[SteveK]

[quote name='beerdragon' post='637936' date='Oct 27 2009, 02:17 PM']Nah i'll go with Manfred Manns Earthband.[/quote]

Aww, shucks!

I saw this thread yesterday, but didn't feel that I had any worthwhile advice.

I started playing bass full-time in 1974. But, didn't really consider myself as being professional until about 1980, when I got my first "proper" gig with Hazel O'Connor, touring the UK, Europe, the US. Since then I've been lucky enough to have rarely been out of a gig.

As beerdragon rightly says, I'm with Manfred Mann's Earth Band, and have been since 1985 . Even after 24 years with MMEB I still consider it a privilege to work with such great musicians and singers. During those 24 years I've played with some other artists, even doing a couple of weeks (depping) with Bucks Fizz (about 1994).

Re: getting on in the business. Aside from the obvious, the most important thing is; you do need to be able to get along with people. I would prefer to work with a slightly less accomplished musician who was easy to get along with than a better musician who was a pita.

Steve

[Craigmartini]

[quote name='skankdelvar' post='637455' date='Oct 26 2009, 11:37 PM']The ludicrously talented yet unbelievably modest Craig Martini posts on here a bit. jimijimmi treads the boards with The Quireboys and Raven Vandelle.[/quote]


Skankdelvar,

You are way to kind, Thank you!!



I will try to add something here but I think you guys covered the important stuff.

In my opinion what has kept me going is:

1. Always be prepaired for the gig by knowing the material fully. ( I spend a lot of my time learning songs )

2. BE ON TIME OR EARLY to gigs/rehearsal

3. Be relaxed, don't let little things upset you. No one likes to be around someone who bitches about everything.

4. Have a good bass sound and reliable gear.

5. If you don't know about something............. Respectfully listen to someone who does.

6. BE NICE!

7. (most important.....) DON'T GIVE UP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

8. Don't squander you money when times are good, because during the lean times you will be stressed out and may be tempted to give up and do something else that is more "stable".




If you plan on touring,

Forget everything you know about the comforts of home. At least until you are riding around in you own personal tour bus. Sometimes, you will be hungry, tired, sick, homesick, annoyed, need to use the bathroom, desperate for a shower, and all the while you will need to be on top of your musical game and not be a prick to be around. These are the tough times of touring.
The good stuff in my opinion, far outweighs the bad though. You get to see the world, eat food you would never get to try otherwise, hang with other musicians 24 hours a day, play music in front of amazing fans, meet new people you would never have met, and all because you are playing an instrument you love to play.


I wish you all the best of luck!

Craig

[Prosebass]

[quote name='Craigmartini' post='638279' date='Oct 27 2009, 06:24 PM']Skankdelvar,

You are way to kind, Thank you!!



I will try to add something here but I think you guys covered the important stuff.

In my opinion what has kept me going is:

1. Always be prepaired for the gig by knowing the material fully. ( I spend a lot of my time learning songs )

2. BE ON TIME OR EARLY to gigs/rehearsal

3. Be relaxed, don't let little things upset you. No one likes to be around someone who bitches about everything.

4. Have a good bass sound and reliable gear.

5. If you don't know about something............. Respectfully listen to someone who does.

6. BE NICE!

7. (most important.....) DON'T GIVE UP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

8. Don't squander you money when times are good, because during the lean times you will be stressed out and may be tempted to give up and do something else that is more "stable".




If you plan on touring,

Forget everything you know about the comforts of home. At least until you are riding around in you own personal tour bus. Sometimes, you will be hungry, tired, sick, homesick, annoyed, need to use the bathroom, desperate for a shower, and all the while you will need to be on top of your musical game and not be a prick to be around. These are the tough times of touring.
The good stuff in my opinion, far outweighs the bad though. You get to see the world, eat food you would never get to try otherwise, hang with other musicians 24 hours a day, play music in front of amazing fans, meet new people you would never have met, and all because you are playing an instrument you love to play.


I wish you all the best of luck!

Craig[/quote]

Very wise words Craig and not just applying to bass playing but life in general.......this should be pinned .

[steve-soar]

[quote name='Craigmartini' post='638279' date='Oct 27 2009, 06:24 PM']Skankdelvar,

You are way to kind, Thank you!!



I will try to add something here but I think you guys covered the important stuff.

In my opinion what has kept me going is:

1. Always be prepaired for the gig by knowing the material fully. ( I spend a lot of my time learning songs )

2. BE ON TIME OR EARLY to gigs/rehearsal

3. Be relaxed, don't let little things upset you. No one likes to be around someone who bitches about everything.

4. Have a good bass sound and reliable gear.

5. If you don't know about something............. Respectfully listen to someone who does.

6. BE NICE!

7. (most important.....) DON'T GIVE UP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

8. Don't squander you money when times are good, because during the lean times you will be stressed out and may be tempted to give up and do something else that is more "stable".




If you plan on touring,

Forget everything you know about the comforts of home. At least until you are riding around in you own personal tour bus. Sometimes, you will be hungry, tired, sick, homesick, annoyed, need to use the bathroom, desperate for a shower, and all the while you will need to be on top of your musical game and not be a prick to be around. These are the tough times of touring.
The good stuff in my opinion, far outweighs the bad though. You get to see the world, eat food you would never get to try otherwise, hang with other musicians 24 hours a day, play music in front of amazing fans, meet new people you would never have met, and all because you are playing an instrument you love to play.


I wish you all the best of luck!

Craig[/quote]Amazing.

[AdamWoodBass]

[quote name='crez5150' post='637075' date='Oct 26 2009, 05:02 PM']Weddings mate..... [/quote]

+ 100000

Best way to bring in a living as a pro. You earn upwards of £100 a gig usually and in the summer months you can probably get pretty regular work. Also look at the cruise ships, you can usually get an audition with P&O or Ocean Village etc fairly easily and the money is pretty good. It's a good way to get a guaranteed amount of money for a certain number of months. Most of the time you don't have to pay for anything other than your beer (and to be honest if you're doing 2 shows a day you probably won't drink much!) Be prepared to live pretty frugally though mate as it's not easy to budget when your main income is gigging which by its very nature is sporadic. A good side earner is teaching, look into private lessons but also look into the peripatetic route (google it lol!) Make sure that your gear is up to scratch too, don't skimp on things as you'll only pay for it in the long run when it lets you down. You don't need a boutique rig and a Fodera to be a pro but you do need to make sure you have reasonably decent quality equipment. And I suppose my last piece of advice is get registered as self employed and learn how to do your taxes, once you get the hang of it you won't need to shell out loads of money for an accountant to do it for you.

I wouldn't really regard myself as a "pro", more a working musician but my aspiration is to one day be able to "go pro".

Hope this is helpful and best of luck to you mate.

Adam

[endorka]

All good advice so far. Some wise words I've taken on board along the way;

- "a good musician is one who can do the simple stuff well. A great musician is one who can do the simple stuff well, and a little bit more"

Another thing I've found beneficial is to try to step outside of your own little segment of the music and to listen in from outside, as it were, and to realise your place in the scheme of things. It can be a humbling experience, but you'll be a better musician for it.

As others have alluded to, there is probably a balance to be struck between self criticism and self belief if you wish to make consistent progress.

Jennifer

[chris_b]

I'm professional bass player and like everyone has said, get connected, always have the highest professional attitude and never give up or in!!

[Gareth Hughes]

In response the the post abut playing your own music vs. someone else's. I've done both and I love both. From a business side of things I'd much rather play someone else's music and let them worry about the headache of empty theatre's and plane tickets, etc.

Musically tho, I fell into being a sideman/session guy simply because I wanted to play my bass EVERY day and simply couldn't find a band that would do that, so the solution was to play in lots of bands. It helped being blessed with a genuine passion for a wide variety of styles - nothing was really a pain to play, there was always something I could enjoy in it. As for playing bass lines I haven't written - for me it's incredibly satisfying to play through something 'West Side Story' and be a part of that big sound. If you get your kicks that way even 'Copacobana' is great!!! (It's a great read too - pity the horn section, it's a roast for them)

I suppose that's an aspect of playing music professionally that surprises me. Sure I started off wanting to be Gene Simmons playing in front of the adoring masses, but that quickly got replaced with actually making music, and making a song sound good.

One thing I keep in my head when I'm playing, and it helps on the dodgy gigs, is a quote I read somewhere in Bass Player magazine: 'you should always try to make the music sound better than if someone else was playing it'. In other words, don't just phone in your part.

[Stingray5]

Redundancy and illness actually led to my going full-time as a musician about 18 years ago.
It's been a real rollercoaster ride with many ups and downs, but I love music (mine and others) and am grateful for the opportunity to do something I love -- and even get paid for it!
I would also echo many of the sentiments that have been previously mentioned. To me, being 'professional' has always been as much an attitude and state of mind regardless of whether someone is a full-time musician or playing for fun at the weekend. In that regard, I've certainly worked with so-called 'amateur' and 'semi-pro' musicians who were definitely more 'pro' than some so-called 'professionals' I've worked with!

[doctor_of_the_bass]

[quote name='Stingray5' post='638712' date='Oct 28 2009, 04:35 AM']To me, being 'professional' has always been as much an attitude and state of mind regardless of whether someone is a full-time musician or playing for fun at the weekend. In that regard, I've certainly worked with so-called 'amateur' and 'semi-pro' musicians who were definitely more 'pro' than some so-called 'professionals' I've worked with! [/quote]

Absolutely! I recall a function gig we did down south somewhere with a dep guitar player (pro of course) - he turns up with a Peavey Rage practice amp with no channel select footswtich, no FX etc and a 50p lead - he kept having to bend down and press the channel button! What a berk! Needless to say he never got called back...

[AdamWoodBass]

[quote name='doctor_of_the_bass' post='638834' date='Oct 28 2009, 10:00 AM']Absolutely! I recall a function gig we did down south somewhere with a dep guitar player (pro of course) - he turns up with a Peavey Rage practice amp with no channel select footswtich, no FX etc and a 50p lead - he kept having to bend down and press the channel button! What a berk! Needless to say he never got called back...[/quote]

Like I said make sure your gear's up to scratch! Also another point I thought about which may have been mentioned before so apologies if it has; when you're going to a gig/rehearsal make sure you actually know the tunes you're going to be playing! Just sacked a guitarist for these reasons. He turned up 3/4 hour late to the rehearsal with a guitar with shoddy electronics and didn't work properly, an amp that wasn't his and he wasn't sure if he could borrow it for the gig (he didn't actually own one!) and had only bothered to learn the songs that he actually liked on the set list which was 3 out of about 26! And to top it off, he came up to me after about 3/4 hour of fumbling his way through chord sheets and said he could only rehearse til 9pm and had to go, he'd only turned up at 8.15pm!!! We did the gig without a guitarist by just rearranging some of the tunes and it went really well! Needless to say I won't be calling him again!