What to upgrade to after a combo?

[Minininjarob]

My first amp is a GK Mb112 combo. 200w, 1x12” driver. It’s pretty loud at home but I’m thinking in the future I’d want something more. 
Looking at the TE Elf for sale in the ads I can see it’s 200w - if I combined that, for example, with a 2x10” cab would the volume be any different - I know the sound would be - being as the wattage would be the same? 

Would I be best going for 500w plus? 
I do like the sound of my GK amp (sounds better when driven hard!) but I don’t have any experience playing through anything else. 
I’d probably keep what I have now for practice and would need something easily transportable so older second hand stuff is probably not the best for me. I don’t think a heavy head would be a problem, I don’t have any issues with my back, but I reckon a lighter cab would help me in the future. 
 

Edited March 31, 2023 by Minininjarob

[lidl e]

if you're thinking you're going to be playing with other people in the future, i'd go higher than 200 watt.

 

what about a higher watt combo?

[Lozz196]

As you like the GK sound I’d look at their MB amps. Want a small portable & powerful cab, well Barefaced, GR and LFSys (our very own @stevie) all produce these types of cabs and would get a lot from a GK MB200 or 500.

Edited March 31, 2023 by Lozz196

[jezzaboy]

If you are going to maybe be gigging in the future, a class D 500 watt amp would be a good bet. Add a couple of cab`s and you are sorted for virtually any gig.

[Minininjarob]

30 minutes ago, Lozz196 said:

As you like the GK sound I’d look at their MB amps. Want a small portable & powerful cab, well Barefaced, GR and LFSys (our very own @stevie) all produce these types of cabs and would get a lot from a GK MB200 or 500.

I’ve been looking at them but they aren’t cheap. Something to save up for I think. 
They don’t seem to be easily available though. 

Edited March 31, 2023 by Minininjarob

[Pea Turgh]

GK used to do combos with what appeared to be powered slave cabs.  Might be compatible with your model?  That would give you the same sound but more of it.

 

edit:  here it is…

 

https://www.gallien-krueger.com/112-mbp-specs

Edited March 31, 2023 by Pea Turgh

[BassAdder60]

I would look at the Ashdown Rm500 with either a 212 4 ohm cab or two 210 8 ohm cabs and you’re set for home and gigging 

 

GK do have some nice heads and cabs too such as the GK Legacy 800 

 

Orange Little Bass Thing is a lovely 500w head so perhaps another option 

[goonerjoe]

Ampeg 810 and SVT. Obviously...

[Chienmortbb]

2 hours ago, Lozz196 said:

As you like the GK sound I’d look at their MB amps. Want a small portable & powerful cab, well Barefaced, GR and LFSys (our very own @stevie) all produce these types of cabs and would get a lot from a GK MB200 or 500.

The 200W combos are really an MB200 in a cabinet so will be no upgrade. The MB200 or as I call it, the  MB170 uses the ICEpower  50ASX2 module, rated at 170W into 4 ohms and 100W into 8 ohms.

[stevie]

3 hours ago, Minininjarob said:

I’ve been looking at them but they aren’t cheap. Something to save up for I think. 
They don’t seem to be easily available though. 

 

There's no availability problem with LFSys cabs - at least at the moment.🙂

[Dan Dare]

If you like the sound of your GK, the obvious answer is to go for more of the same. An Elf plus 2x10 would be a sideways move and a bit pointless, imho. Your GK is not cheap. New price is in the mid £600 range. So improving on it will cost. Why not look at a GK MBP powered cab? That way, you get more of the same and can use just the combo for smaller jobs.

 

Edited March 31, 2023 by Dan Dare

[Elfrasho]

If you like it

6 hours ago, Pea Turgh said:

GK used to do combos with what appeared to be powered slave cabs.  Might be compatible with your model?  That would give you the same sound but more of it.

 

edit:  here it is…

 

https://www.gallien-krueger.com/112-mbp-specs

 

If you like the sound of your current set up, then this is exactly what I'd do! If you're needing more than that at a gig, then you're likely going to have a PA which you'll be running through anyway! That would be an outstanding rig.

[Minininjarob]

8 hours ago, goonerjoe said:

Ampeg 810 and SVT. Obviously...

Yeah we all know that’s the answer. I know that’s the answer. 

[Minininjarob]

9 hours ago, Pea Turgh said:

GK used to do combos with what appeared to be powered slave cabs.  Might be compatible with your model?  That would give you the same sound but more of it.

 

edit:  here it is…

 

https://www.gallien-krueger.com/112-mbp-specs

Yeah I’ve seen those but they are very expensive, and rare to find 2nd hand. I’d also like a separate drive and master volume on an amp which mine doesn’t have for some weird reason. 

[Mudpup]

What's the budget?

 

[Phil Starr]

Just looking at this from a technical point of view 200W through a speaker that gives you 97db/W is going to give you 120db maximum output which is what you'd need to be playing along with a drummer. A decent 12" speaker will give you around 97db/W so that would just about be 'enough'. Your amp and the Elf will only give that power through 4ohms though. Doubling up your amps power will not give you double the sound just an extra 3db (3db is noticeably louder but not by much) Adding an extra speaker gives you around 5db more on average.

 

so 200W through a single 12 is borderline enough and an inefficient speaker might mean the amp isn't quite there. A loud 12 probably would be. Add an extra 1x12 of the same type and you'd probably be happy with a 200w amp. A 2x10 would sit between these two options. FWIW I have a Warwick Gnome the same power as the Elf and with an LFSys Silverstone it will do most pub gigs, but I also have 2 1x12's and a classD 300/500W amp for the odd big gig or outside gig.

 

Basically all this boils down to is that you can get away with a small amp if you have a loud speaker system or a less efficient speaker if you have a big amp but probably not both. In an emergency or in a smaller venue your current combo might be enough. If you buy the Elf I'd be looking at a 2x12, 2 1x12's or 2 2x10's if I wanted to cover every situation. Alternatively one of the many 500W amps around at the moment would probably cope with half that speaker complement.

 

You probably want to choose on what sounds good though, probably more important than sheer power. Maybe if you give us a budget you'll get more suggestions

[BassAdder60]

15 minutes ago, Phil Starr said:

Just looking at this from a technical point of view 200W through a speaker that gives you 97db/W is going to give you 120db maximum output which is what you'd need to be playing along with a drummer. A decent 12" speaker will give you around 97db/W so that would just about be 'enough'. Your amp and the Elf will only give that power through 4ohms though. Doubling up your amps power will not give you double the sound just an extra 3db (3db is noticeably louder but not by much) Adding an extra speaker gives you around 5db more on average.

 

so 200W through a single 12 is borderline enough and an inefficient speaker might mean the amp isn't quite there. A loud 12 probably would be. Add an extra 1x12 of the same type and you'd probably be happy with a 200w amp. A 2x10 would sit between these two options. FWIW I have a Warwick Gnome the same power as the Elf and with an LFSys Silverstone it will do most pub gigs, but I also have 2 1x12's and a classD 300/500W amp for the odd big gig or outside gig.

 

Basically all this boils down to is that you can get away with a small amp if you have a loud speaker system or a less efficient speaker if you have a big amp but probably not both. In an emergency or in a smaller venue your current combo might be enough. If you buy the Elf I'd be looking at a 2x12, 2 1x12's or 2 2x10's if I wanted to cover every situation. Alternatively one of the many 500W amps around at the moment would probably cope with half that speaker complement.

 

You probably want to choose on what sounds good though, probably more important than sheer power. Maybe if you give us a budget you'll get more suggestions

My backup Elf is loud enough with the band using a 4ohm 212 cab ( Ampeg )

 

I gig with 100w valve amp through the same cab and it’s very loud running approx 3/4 output 

[Dan Dare]

1 hour ago, Minininjarob said:

Yeah I’ve seen those but they are very expensive, and rare to find 2nd hand.

 

GK MBP cabs are around £400 new. If that is "very expensive" to you, what's your budget?

 

Your current GK combo costs around £600 new, so, if it's in good shape, you may get 50% or a little more (generally, you can reckon on 50% of new price unless something is rare or sought after) of that if you sell it.

 

Realistically, would it be fair to say your budget is around £200 plus whatever you can get from selling the GK combo? 

[Downunderwonder]

If your combo is an mb200 in a box with a speaker then it should take an extension cab. That would be a good thing to try before ditching it.

 

Crazy how loud an MB200 goes through a big cab at 4ohms.

[Elfrasho]

You could always wait until an old trace Elliot 1x15 combo appears on marketplace. I've just purchased one for just over 100 quid and it's unbelievably loud and sounds incredible. It's maybe not a sexy choice but for price vs quality don't think there's a better option.

 

 

[Dan Dare]

1 hour ago, Elfrasho said:

You could always wait until an old trace Elliot 1x15 combo appears on marketplace. I've just purchased one for just over 100 quid and it's unbelievably loud and sounds incredible. It's maybe not a sexy choice but for price vs quality don't think there's a better option.

 

Good option if weight not an issue. Nearly always a few TEs on the 'Bay, too.

[ukbassboy]

If you want more power than you'll ever need for little money then a there's a Bugera Veyron in the marketplace for like £170 delivered. Claims to put out 2000w but that is peak, realistically it's going to give you around 700w which is still huge! It's not a high end brand that people will gush at, but those that have tried them seem pretty impressed, and they are pretty small and light (in comparison to most things, not so much the Elf). 

Another option for cheap, small form-factor power is the Harley Benton B800 - that has the same 800w Icepower Class D power amp that many of the big brands are using but at a fraction of the price. 

Both options will give you more power than you'll likely ever need - if you need more, then you probably need a PA. The only question is whether you can dial in a tone you like. You could probably try the likes of a used Bugera Veyron and shift it on for the same price, so very low risk to have a play and see what you think. 

Which cabinet to go for is a bigger minefield IMHO! 

[BigRedX]

Just cut the years of mucking out with “bass” amps and cabs and go straight for a modelling multi-effects and FRFR.

[Minininjarob]

On 01/04/2023 at 08:38, Elfrasho said:

You could always wait until an old trace Elliot 1x15 combo appears on marketplace. I've just purchased one for just over 100 quid and it's unbelievably loud and sounds incredible. It's maybe not a sexy choice but for price vs quality don't think there's a better option.

 

 

A good friend of mine lent me his TE combo and I think he wanted to sell it (he might have given it to me tbh as he is really generous) but the weight of it was unbelievable. I need to be able to move it round often up and down stairs - I’m strong having worked in manual jobs and sports and I nearly caused myself permanent damage moving it!

It also came with an extension cab…… 

if it wasn’t  for the weight and lack of a headphone socket I would have it in my house now. 

[ukbassboy]

Trust me, lifting heavy gear doesn't get any better with time - the lightest gear is generally more expensive, but imho worth it. I've got a Mark Bass Nano 2 which kicks out 300w at 1.4kg and, as the name suggests, is tiny. That is great for small pubs and practices so when something bigger is required I have a Genz Benz Shuttlemax 12.0 which gives me 1200w (provided I have two cabinets) and weighs 3kgs. It really is incredible what they can do size vs weight vs power wise these days!

I see the recommendation above about about an FRFR - I have a Line 6 Helix Stomp so looked at that route, but ultimately decided there weren't enough advantages over just getting a small used bass head and bass cabinet. It might have been tempted if the Barefaced FR800 still existed though!