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Happy Jack

Decent video editing software for Windows

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10 hours ago, Dad3353 said:

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I've just done a quick'n'dirty download and micro-test of this, and it's darned good. A couple of magnitudes faster than Resolve, and very much more lightweight in its approach. I managed to import, line up, chop around and overlay a few clips, with fades, in a few minutes whilst eating dinner. Thanks for the tip; it may well replace my other softs. 

tried it as well and it loads a lot quicker, however the zoom in/out and pan functions aren't nearly as intuitive or quick as resolve so it's a no from me (for now), but thanks for the heads up, I'll certainly play around with it!

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I'm not much of a video guy so take this is a total amateur recommendation.

I've played around with a few editing tools and the one I enjoyed the most was Filmora, it was easy to use and had a load of functions that were mainly drag and drop, a store with all kinds of effects/effect sets.
It isn't free, there's a yearly subscription but it's a lot less that most of the others I looked at (the most expensive one was less than £100 a year when I checked last).

https://filmora.wondershare.com/?ic_source=navigation

They let you try it for free (but watermark the video until you're a paid user I think), might be worth a couple minutes to see if it'll do what you want.

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I'll take this opportunity to thank everyone for the shedload of help and constructive suggestions coming my way, and also to mention that I am now following the advice of my very good friend Mr. Rishi Sunak and re-training as a Video Software Engineer. That is, I'm spending hours every day frantically clicking things and swearing at the computer.

 

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10 hours ago, Silvia Bluejay said:

@wateroftyne, it didn't go well I'm afraid. You must have Premiere Pro rather than Elements I think?

I right-clicked on anything I could right-click on, and quite a lot of options came up, but Synchronise wasn't one of them. In Elements you apparently can't sync video and audio automatically, as it says here. :(

Ah.. sorry, yes. I didn't actually know there was an Elements version!

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From my limited experience of video editing, one of the big stumbling blocks is that if you have any serious experience of working with either digital audio or graphics, is that what ought to be transferable concepts and skills simply are not. In the end I gave up and paid someone else to do it, and they did a far better job of it then I ever would have. 

IME doing your own video editing is only worth it if you have a lot of spare time to learn and practice the concepts, and you need to produce a large number of videos. Otherwise there are plenty of people out there who will do a brilliant job at very affordable prices. To give you an idea, the person who both filmed and edited the last Terrortones video did it for less money than it cost us to hire the venue where the filming took place.

 

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Hitfilm express is probably where I would go for free on a PC. Gives a straightforward editing experience and the ability to updgrade features if required. It's not as well supported as the mainstream editors... but unlike the mainstream editors, in it's raw installation, it's free.

Disclaimer: I'm on Mac.

Resolve is probably my complex editor of choice - my camera shoots in BRAW so it's a natural choice for me but I do use the full fat version, not the freebie. It is however, a more convoluted editor compared to most out there - but once you have got your head around it, it's very powerful, especially if you are into colour correction in grading. It's available on PC - as you've found out, but win 10 centric I believe - but most of the cool advanced features  are only available in the full fat paid for install.

Final Cut Pro is probably the best in terms of simplicity but power. But alas, Mac only.

 

The biggest thing though, when it comes to editing video, is having a beastly machine. Anything that is underpowered is going to be immediately apparent in the editing experience and the time it takes to do an final export. For those that are on anything but the most powerful machines, you'll start getting better results if you optimise your media - instead of using the off the camera recording, or set up proxies (essentially you are then editing with lower grade media for a more responsive editing experience but then the full res stuff is swapped back in for the final render.

Having said all that, if you are just looking to top and tail, add some titles, or just put together a few multicam clips, most machines of the last 4-5 years should be able to handle HD ok. 4k+ maybe a different story however! And remember, storage costs start to rapidly rise for higher res!  

Edited by EBS_freak
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@BigRedX, I see your point, but Jack took early retirement to dedicate himself to music and any other hobby he has - that may well include preparing videos for his bands. I'm lucky enough to be semi-retired, so I've also got time to do these things, assuming they're not too frustrating. I am already the bands' official photoshopper...

Given the current dearth of gigs, and especially of paid gigs, it wouldn't be fair to ask the bands to stump up for a pro to do a very simple job - we're not trying to make a George Michael video here - that we can do ourselves if we have the patience to try some software and learn to use it.

@EBS_freak, thanks for that. While our machines aren't quite state-of-the-art, mine at least has a passable 16GB of RAM, a decent hard disk, Windows 10, lots of external storage, and seems to cope all right with anything I've thrown at it so far. I don't mind waiting, say, 3 minutes instead of 1 to save a file, as long as it saves correctly and the program has enabled me to do what I wanted to do with the video.

Current state of play: Jack is testing one of you guys' suggestions on his machine, while I've spent the last hour tinkering with Premiere Elements and have decided that the damn thing is so crippled it's not worth having.

What we basically want to do is have one main video, sync its audio with a better quality external file if available, and overwrite a few frames of the main video, here and there, with snippets from a different camera. That means we need quick or automatic audio syncing, and a decent overlay feature that only overwrites the same number of frames on the main video as those contained in the snippet we add. Can I do either in Premiere Elements? Can I hell. Both features are very much available in the Pro version, but emphatically not in Elements.

It's the equivalent of having to buy proper Photoshop, as opposed to Elements, if you wanted to get rid of a photo's background, or do something equally basic. Total bust, not worth spending a penny on.

If Jack ends up not being impressed with any of the free software he's testing, the next decision we'll have to take is whether we're going to want to do enough video work on the bands' material to justify me getting an effing subscription* to effing Premiere Pro. 😉🙄😄

* Pro doesn't seem to be available as a desktop-only application. Anyone know otherwise?

Many thanks to all of you who are giving us advice and patiently reading our rants on here!

Edited by Silvia Bluejay

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Update: I like the Vegas interface and tutorial, but now I discover that there's a second level of protection of the 'free trial' version in that you can't render any video lasting more than two minutes. This was not mentioned during the three hours of tutorials that I have just waded through.

I suppose I can see where they're coming from, but given that there's already a fixed 30-day lifespan for the trial version anyway, this particular piece of overkill means that they may just have lost a customer.

If I can't generate a meaningful video to check that what I think I've done is what I have actually done, then I'm less likely to be investing either more time or any money in paying for a product that hasn't actually been tested!

 

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11 minutes ago, Silvia Bluejay said:

 

What we basically want to do is have one main video, sync its audio with a better quality external file if available, and overwrite a few frames of the main video, here and there, with snippets from a different camera. That means we need quick or automatic audio syncing, and a decent overlay feature that only overwrites the same number of frames on the main video as those contained in the snippet we add. Can I do either in Premiere Elements? Can I hell. Both features are very much available in the Pro version, but emphatically not in Elements.

I'm not familiar with Elements, but I would have thought that dropping another clip in would be pretty fundamental functionality?

This YouTube clip suggests so...?

 

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3 minutes ago, wateroftyne said:

I'm not familiar with Elements, but I would have thought that dropping another clip in would be pretty fundamental functionality?

The snippet you drop in the main video under Elements overwrites the whole of the remaining main video. Even if the snippet is 30 frames and the main video is 10 minutes long. Horrible and stupid.

Edit: the only other option is to insert instead of overwriting, which leaves you with having to trim afterwards.

Edited by Silvia Bluejay

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13 minutes ago, Silvia Bluejay said:

Current state of play: Jack is testing one of you guys' suggestions on his machine, while I've spent the last hour tinkering with Premiere Elements and have decided that the damn thing is so crippled it's not worth having.

I suspect there's an 'element' (🤣) of disinterest in the process that's colouring things here. the elements version is far from crippled. I've not yet tried to sync music yet, I've just done soundtracks and editing, (cuts/transitions/effects/titles/credits/incidental music fades/etc) on videos with the kids, by way of learning (I'm not interested in stupid video work, but I am interested in the kids, so it creates a bit of motivation at least). But ultimately I want it for music video stuff once our recording is finished, so I've spent a fair bit of time on Youtube going further than I've needed to do just yet, and it seems pretty straightforward. Just a 'sync audio and video on Premiere Elements' search throws up some really clear simple tutorials.

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Done that search and found a lot of advice on MANUALLY doing the work? Not automatically. And don't mention the dropping of snippets in the main video... 😉

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Without wanting to sound a potentially negative note, it's worth remembering that audio devices are not necessarily all strictly clocked at 44.1 or 48 or whatever kHz.

Which means, especially if you are aligning long recordings, there may be some drift in the sync by the end of the set. I've experienced this even when syncing recordings made on the same make and model of recorder.

Ways to get around it are time-stretching the audio (either by ear or by calculating the length discrepancy), dropping a few frames of video or (my current preferred method) leaving some audience noise up between each track and adding and aligning each song separately.

Of course, if you're just doing single song videos this may not be an issue.

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Multicam in FCPX rocks - it syncs it all for you, then you simply click which angle you want as you watch it through.... but alas... mac. Sorry, I know that's no help.

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8 minutes ago, Silvia Bluejay said:

The snippet you drop in the main video under Elements overwrites the whole of the remaining main video. Even if the snippet is 30 frames and the main video is 10 minutes long. Horrible and stupid.

Edit: the only other option is to insert instead of overwriting, which leaves you with having to trim afterwards.

These applications all work on the basis of overlaying. Unlike an audio mix where we hear a combination of all the tracks at once, in video we usually just see one of the available tracks.

So if camera 1 is the main view, we add a track above it and pop camera 2, say on that. In the final render, if camera 2 has content (clips) all the way then that's all we will see. You need to go through and cut the camera 2 clip into the lengths (roughly) that you want and delete the bits you don't want.

So in your case, pop the clip on a new track where you want it to show and trim off the end at the point where you want it to hide.

Apologies if you know all that already but the little tutorial @wateroftyne posted shows exactly that process. I think at the start it can just be overwhelming and super frustrating.

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1 minute ago, Dankology said:

Without wanting to sound a potentially negative note, it's worth remembering that audio devices are not necessarily all strictly clocked at 44.1 or 48 or whatever kHz.

Which means, especially if you are aligning long recordings, there may be some drift in the sync by the end of the set. I've experienced this even when syncing recordings made on the same make and model of recorder.

Ways to get around it are time-stretching the audio (either by ear or by calculating the length discrepancy), dropping a few frames of video or (my current preferred method) leaving some audience noise up between each track and adding and aligning each song separately.

Of course, if you're just doing single song videos this may not be an issue.

The audio is not really a problem as it can be easily transformed between formats without issue.

It's when you try and mix 24, 25 and 30 fps that things gets difficult. Retiming of clips and dropping clips looks awful.

You have to plan for a video - and the very first decision to make, is get the fps sorted.

 

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17 minutes ago, EBS_freak said:

Multicam in FCPX rocks - it syncs it all for you, then you simply click which angle you want as you watch it through.... but alas... mac. Sorry, I know that's no help.

As always Russ, you're absolutely right. 

That's no help.

 

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7 minutes ago, EBS_freak said:

The audio is not really a problem as it can be easily transformed between formats without issue.

It's when you try and mix 24, 25 and 30 fps that things gets difficult. Retiming of clips and dropping clips looks awful.

You have to plan for a video - and the very first decision to make, is get the fps sorted.

 

I meant more the issues relating to discrepancies between stated and actual clocking rather than between different stated sampling rates.

eg if your camera has recorded the audio accurately at 48kHz but your external audio has actually been recorded at say 48.05kHz (due to the inherent inaccuracy within the clock) then over the course of a long enough file the two will drift out of sync. These discrepancies seems to be magnified by resampling (say if the external audio was 44.1 and needs to be 48khz for the video).

The most frustrating aspect of my video work is getting the external audio to stretch/sync in this way.

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15 minutes ago, Happy Jack said:

As always Russ, you're absolutely right. 

That's no help.

 

You could always go the Hackintosh route.

I only included it for other people who have got Macs I guess.

But again... sorry :P

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10 minutes ago, Dankology said:

I meant more the issues relating to discrepancies between stated and actual clocking rather than between different stated sampling rates.

eg if your camera has recorded the audio accurately at 48kHz but your external audio has actually been recorded at say 48.05kHz (due to the inherent inaccuracy within the clock) then over the course of a long enough file the two will drift out of sync. These discrepancies seems to be magnified by resampling (say if the external audio was 44.1 and needs to be 48khz for the video).

The most frustrating aspect of my video work is getting the external audio to stretch/sync in this way.

Ah, I run a Dante clock so it's never really an issue in my setup... but could see that if the above is happening, it would be a little frustrating. In which case, if I was requiring retime, a tempo change to conform to a known time length would fix you. Cheapest (free) way of doing this would probably be in a tool like audacity. Not saying it would be a nice workflow - but could get you out of a spot.

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@Silvia Bluejay : I don't know quite how 'automatic' you're wanting things to be, but I've done editing multi-cam synced to audio with VideoPad with no issues nor problems. I've not done the same with Resolve nor the latest I've installed (Shotcut...), but they work in exactly the same manner, and it's easy enough to drop 'snippets' in. Here's a concert from end of last year, which took just minutes to put together...


... and another of one of my 'planes ...

... and the 'plane's First (brief...) Flight...)

... again, simple enough to edit. No great expertise needed; just a bit of Patience. Not professional quality, I'll freely admit, but certainly no need for aspirins, either, and better can be done  by those taking more time (and playing better, maybe..!).

Here's a screenshot of the VideoPad project for that last video...

xjeNzLo.jpg

Any help..? :friends:

Edited by Dad3353
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The tool in Davinci Resolve for automatically syncing audio is called...

auto sync

Plenty YT tutorials if you search for resolve auto sync  

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