30 years ago today Jaco passed away

[louisthebass]

[quote name='Maude' timestamp='1506279089' post='3377566']
But why does it stop at Jaco? Surely he didn't grow up devoid of any musical influence, so why am I not influenced by his influences rather than him?
[/quote]

Jaco was heavily influenced (initially) by a lot of Soul & R&B music (has cited the likes of Bootsy, Donald "Duck" Dunn, James Jamerson, Jerry Jemmott and Tommy Cogbill) - don't know if you like that type of music, but if you do, some of it will have rubbed off on you?

Bass as an instrument didn't stop when Jaco died in 1987 - there are loads of great bass players out there (insert name of your bass hero here) who have taken it to another level since then. He was an outstanding bassist of his time and (along with Stanley Clarke) helped put electric bass on the map in the Jazz / Rock / Fusion world.

Edited September 24, 2017 by louisthebass

[leschirons]

[quote name='Maude' timestamp='1506280837' post='3377592']




It's not meant as a dig at Blue, but a genuine question.
It seems to me that the bands that I'm always told are my influences are from the sixties or seventies, as if music began then. But what about all the rock'n'roll before that, and the Jazz and blues before that? My personal musical radar only goes back to around the 1920's delta blues, really got into Robert Johnson for a while, but wasn't the early blues music that the African slaves brought with them into America?
How come folks seem to only consider 60's/70's music worthy of being an influence to everyone today?
[/quote]

I totally get why you've said that. However, (I'm 65 btw) there was just as much crap around in the 60s and 70s as there is today. Conversely, there have been some really great artists over the last 10-15 years.

I think the reason you hear this a lot, usually from us oldies, is that the sixties especially was a time of great change in music, quite a revolution in fact so, when you heard something new and good, it was usually vastly different from what had come before. That's much harder to do nowdays but there is still some great stuff getting produced.

[Maude]

[quote name='louisthebass' timestamp='1506283782' post='3377642']


Jaco was heavily influenced (initially) by a lot of Soul & R&B music (has cited the likes of Bootsy, Donald "Duck" Dunn, James Jamerson, Jerry Jemmott and Tommy Cogbill) - don't know if you like that type of music, but if you do, some of it will have rubbed off on you?

Bass as an instrument didn't stop when Jaco died in 1987 - there are loads of great bass players out there (insert name of your bass hero here) who have taken it to another level since then. He was an outstanding bassist of his time and (along with Stanley Clarke) helped put electric bass on the map in the Jazz / Rock / Fusion world.
[/quote]

I play in a Mod/Northern Soul/Ska band who play covers and originals. Obviously a few of those names you mentioned are big influences, other influences come from the original Jamaican ska bands and the likes of The Who, The Jam, etc. I never realised I was so influenced by John Entwistle until a fair few people have commented after various gigs.
I also play doublebass and am very influenced by early rock'n'roll and rockabilly bands. I grew up on post punk, goth, industrial and metal so have influences from there as well. As you can see I have a wide and varied taste but still can't see any influence by Jaco.
You mentioned Stanley Clarke, I bought an album of his years ago thinking it would further my bass knowledge but I just cannot listen to it, I revisited it a while ago thinking I might have changed my view, nope cannot stomach it. The same us true of Jaco, I have tried listening to every track posted in this thread but can't get past thirty seconds or so, it really makes me cringe. Yes he can play but it makes me recoil.

Edit to add, I didn't mean "why did it stop at Jaco" moving forwards in time but rather going back in time. I am much more influenced by people before him that influenced him, therefore I am influenced by them not Jaco.
I also read up on him today to try and understand more but all that achieved was making me realise that as well as not liking his music I don't think I'd have liked him as a person either.
Not that that takes away from his talent or his untimely death, although it seems he partially brought that on himself.

Edited September 24, 2017 by Maude

[FDC484950]

Setting aside for the moment what contribution he has or hasn't made, it is amusing that there are still people who want to get a fretless sunburst Jazz out and sound like him. The problem is, no-one does (and plenty of very good bass players have tried). He got his sound through a combination of natural talent, some fortuitous circumstances and a hell of a lot of hard playing, gigging and woodshedding. People can get the bass, the sound fairly easily but never get the touch or rhythmic awareness.

He had a big impact on the bass players of the time and one only needs to step back in time a bit and listen to film and TV and jingles to hear bits of that sound appearing. However this was 40 or so years ago, and I wonder what if any music really influences what everyone plays or does today? Music has had a long time to evolve and splinter into lots of different and smaller circles, and plenty of clones have come and gone. In many ways almost the last thing I'd want to do now is sound like him - I'm aware of the style and the music in the context of funk, fusion, jazz etc but I don't want to go near it stylistically. However when you think of major contributors to the way we play bass today, I believe he should stand as one of the greats.

[stingrayPete1977]

Even as someone that doesn't enjoy his music I don't think it matters if someone wants to spend a fortune on what should be a fairly cheap bass only to noodle away on it in their spare bedroom as long as they enjoy it.

[blue]

[quote name='DarkHeart' timestamp='1506275320' post='3377529']


What age do you class as older? im 51 and can`t listen to more than 30 seconds without switching off, sorry but he has never done anything for me.
[/quote]

I would say older are the guys in their mid 60s.

By beef is not with people that don't understand Jaco's style of playing. I mentioned that I'm not a huge Jaco fan.

My beef is with guys that feel Jaco has not been influential and an ispiration to thousands of bass players.

Blue

[blue]

[quote name='FDC484950' timestamp='1506319228' post='3377784']
Setting aside for the moment what contribution he has or hasn't made, it is amusing that there are still people who want to get a fretless sunburst Jazz out and sound like him. The problem is, no-one does (and plenty of very good bass players have tried). He got his sound through a combination of natural talent, some fortuitous circumstances and a hell of a lot of hard playing.[/quote]

Agreed, nobody sounds like him. Even the guys that nail "Teen Town" on a YouTube clip. They playing along to Weather Report and being lead along.

If there's a clip of someone nailing "Teen Town" live with they're own band, I would enjoy hearing it.

Blue

[blue]

[quote name='Maude' timestamp='1506285934' post='3377664']


I play in a Mod/Northern Soul/Ska band who play covers and originals. Obviously a few of those names you mentioned are big influences, other influences come from the original Jamaican ska bands and the likes of The Who, The Jam, etc. I never realised I was so influenced by John Entwistle until a fair few people have commented after various gigs.
I also play doublebass and am very influenced by early rock'n'roll and rockabilly bands. I grew up on post punk, goth, industrial and metal so have influences from there as well. As you can see I have a wide and varied taste but still can't see any influence by Jaco.
You mentioned Stanley Clarke, I bought an album of his years ago thinking it would further my bass knowledge but I just cannot listen to it, I revisited it a while ago thinking I might have changed my view, nope cannot stomach it. The same us true of Jaco, I have tried listening to every track posted in this thread but can't get past thirty seconds or so, it really makes me cringe. Yes he can play but it makes me recoil.

Edit to add, I didn't mean "why did it stop at Jaco" moving forwards in time but rather going back in time. I am much more influenced by people before him that influenced him, therefore I am influenced by them not Jaco.
I also read up on him today to try and understand more but all that achieved was making me realise that as well as not liking his music I don't think I'd have liked him as a person either.
Not that that takes away from his talent or his untimely death, although it seems he partially brought that on himself.
[/quote]

This has to be a bit generational.

I've been studying bass player styles for 50 years. So I get some younger guys, 55 and under not getting or understanding Jaco.

Hell, I'll be 65 in a few months and I don't get the appeal of this guy named Pino. He's not someone I would consider one if the "masters". IMO he's a product of the "masters".

Blue

Edited September 27, 2017 by blue

[blue]

[quote name='leschirons' timestamp='1506283812' post='3377643']


I totally get why you've said that. However, (I'm 65 btw) there was just as much crap around in the 60s and 70s as there is today. Conversely, there have been some really great artists over the last 10-15 years. [/quote]

Name a few. Please don't name Thundercat. Speaking of Thundercat,

I guess I get that some can't listen to Jaco. Thundercat is probably the only bass player where I was listening to him on YouTube and had to turn it off. To me his music and bass playing was odd and made no sense to me. Is that generational?

Blue

Edited September 27, 2017 by blue

[FDC484950]

[quote name='Maude' timestamp='1506285934' post='3377664']


I play in a Mod/Northern Soul/Ska band who play covers and originals. Obviously a few of those names you mentioned are big influences, other influences come from the original Jamaican ska bands and the likes of The Who, The Jam, etc. I never realised I was so influenced by John Entwistle until a fair few people have commented after various gigs.
I also play doublebass and am very influenced by early rock'n'roll and rockabilly bands. I grew up on post punk, goth, industrial and metal so have influences from there as well. As you can see I have a wide and varied taste but still can't see any influence by Jaco.
You mentioned Stanley Clarke, I bought an album of his years ago thinking it would further my bass knowledge but I just cannot listen to it, I revisited it a while ago thinking I might have changed my view, nope cannot stomach it. The same us true of Jaco, I have tried listening to every track posted in this thread but can't get past thirty seconds or so, it really makes me cringe. Yes he can play but it makes me recoil.

Edit to add, I didn't mean "why did it stop at Jaco" moving forwards in time but rather going back in time. I am much more influenced by people before him that influenced him, therefore I am influenced by them not Jaco.
I also read up on him today to try and understand more but all that achieved was making me realise that as well as not liking his music I don't think I'd have liked him as a person either.
Not that that takes away from his talent or his untimely death, although it seems he partially brought that on himself.
[/quote]

As always on a forum, opinions tell us a lot more about the person giving them than the topic being discussed. From your background and interests it sounds unlikely that you would like or identify with the sort of music he produced. No-one has to like a given genre or artist/musician. Does it lessen or increase any musician's legacy whether they're popular or well-liked? Not sure.

[Maude]

[quote name='blue' timestamp='1506478653' post='3379020']


This has to be a bit generational.

I've been studying bass player styles for 50 years. So I get some younger guys, 55 and under not getting or understanding Jaco.

Hell, I'll be 65 in a few months and I don't get the appeal of this guy named Pino. He's not someone I would consider one if the "masters". IMO he's a product of the "masters".

Blue

Blue
[/quote]

Blue, if it really was generational, why would I 'get' and be inspired and influenced by players that came before him? I'm out every week playing music that was written before Jaco was on the scene. It's not generational, it's just some people don't like his style of music or playing, therefore don't listen to him or that genre.
I honestly can't think of any music I listen to, and it's wide ranging, that sounds anything like Jaco.
I'm not knocking him at all, just saying that I don't feel I have been influenced by him in the slightest, therefore can't agree when you say that everyone has been influenced by him.

Edited September 27, 2017 by Maude

[lowdown]

[quote name='Maude' timestamp='1506285934' post='3377664']

Not that that takes away from his talent or his untimely death, although it seems he partially brought that on himself.
[/quote]

Sorry dude, No one deserves to be beaten to death, because a meat head decides he ain't letting an individual into his club.

[Maude]

[quote name='FDC484950' timestamp='1506493202' post='3379046']


As always on a forum, opinions tell us a lot more about the person giving them than the topic being discussed. From your background and interests it sounds unlikely that you would like or identify with the sort of music he produced. No-one has to like a given genre or artist/musician. Does it lessen or increase any musician's legacy whether they're popular or well-liked? Not sure.
[/quote]

You're quite correct that I don't identify with that given genre and it doesn't take away from him in the slightest. My opinion matters not a bit.
That post, and the one before it, was questioning the whole 'must have been influenced by him'. Of course as time moves on, every new player is influenced by those that came before them, and they were influenced by those that came before them and so on. I have been influenced by the players that Jaco was influenced by, and they would've had influences before them, so why is it only Jaco that must have influenced everyone, not someone before?
I'll add that I'm not rubbishing Jaco in any way.

[missis sumner]

[quote name='Dropzone' timestamp='1506075902' post='3376259']
Sorry to derail but I read the title to the tune of Sgt Peppers
[/quote]

Me too.

[Maude]

[quote name='lowdown' timestamp='1506497350' post='3379081']


Sorry dude, No one deserves to be beaten to death, because a meat head decides he ain't letting an individual into his club.

[/quote]

Quite agree, and I didn't say he deserved it.
From what I read, he would go to clubs and bars and provoke fights and allow himself to get beaten up. If this is true then you can only expect bad things to happen.

[discreet]

[quote name='Happy Jack' timestamp='1506070244' post='3376201']
I've tried so hard to get into his music... ...but basically I don't really dig that whole jazz/funk/fusion thang and that's hardly his fault!
[/quote]

Same here, but can't deny the first time I heard him play, I thought 'Wow!'
Hugely talented, very unique and broke lots of new ground. Changed the entire meaning of 'bass playing' for many.

[Maude]

[quote name='discreet' timestamp='1506503003' post='3379138']


Hugely talented, very unique and broke lots of new ground. Changed the entire meaning of 'bass playing' for many.
[/quote]

That's a quote I do agree with.

[ahpook]

Sacred cows, eh ?

Edited September 27, 2017 by ahpook

[FDC484950]

[quote name='Maude' timestamp='1506498202' post='3379085']


You're quite correct that I don't identify with that given genre and it doesn't take away from him in the slightest. My opinion matters not a bit.
That post, and the one before it, was questioning the whole 'must have been influenced by him'. Of course as time moves on, every new player is influenced by those that came before them, and they were influenced by those that came before them and so on. I have been influenced by the players that Jaco was influenced by, and they would've had influences before them, so why is it only Jaco that must have influenced everyone, not someone before?
I'll add that I'm not rubbishing Jaco in any way.
[/quote]

Yes, I agree, I didn't think you were rubbishing him at all. Jaco was at his height 40 years ago and a lot of time (and music) has happened since then. I listened to a fair bit of Weather Report and Joni Mitchell when I was younger but must admit I find it hard to listen to now - partly through familiarity and partly because some of it hasn't aged very well.

[blue]

[quote name='Maude' timestamp='1506496509' post='3379075']


Blue, if it really was generational, why would I 'get' and be inspired and influenced by players that came before him? I'm out every week playing music that was written before Jaco was on the scene. It's not generational, it's just some people don't like his style of music or playing, therefore don't listen to him or that genre.
I honestly can't think of any music I listen to, and it's wide ranging, that sounds anything like Jaco.
I'm not knocking him at all, just saying that I don't feel I have been influenced by him in the slightest, therefore can't agree when you say that everyone has been influenced by him.
[/quote]

That's fine, it's only my opinion. I'm not a Jaco fan, however at some concious or sub-consious level I'm influenced by him.

Blue

[jacko]

[quote name='blue' timestamp='1506478051' post='3379019']

If there's a clip of someone nailing "Teen Town" live with they're own band, I would enjoy hearing it.

Blue
[/quote]

can't post the youtube link but if you do a search there's a very good vid of Marcus Miller 'nailing' It with his band.

[PawelG]

[quote name='blue' timestamp='1506239226' post='3377181']


Then I guess it's s personal thing. I don't know any older people that can't listen to him or young people that can.

Blue
[/quote]
I'm 26, not a big Jaco fan but can listen to him/Weather Report for hours, days. Too many notes for my liking but interesting and inspiring nevertheless.

[blue]

[quote name='PawelG' timestamp='1506839738' post='3381372']

I'm 26, not a big Jaco fan but can listen to him/Weather Report for hours, days. Too many notes for my liking but interesting and inspiring nevertheless.
[/quote]

Now that you mention it, the only Jaco I'm somewhat familiar with is Weather Report"s "Heavy Weather".

Blue

[PawelG]

[quote name='blue' timestamp='1506840315' post='3381375']


Now that you mention it, the only Jaco I'm somewhat familiar with is Weather Report"s "Heavy Weather".

Blue
[/quote]
Great album :-)