4-string-thing Posted May 29, 2015 Share Posted May 29, 2015 (edited) So, after a few years of looking, I've finally managed to find a couple of like-minded souls to put a trio together doing stuff I like. We've been rehearsing for a few weeks and have been offered a gig at a village fete type thing at the end of June. All well and good, 30 minutes on a proper stage with decent P.A etc. Problem is, the guitarist/singer! He can play well, sings ok but is really casual and amateurish. I can just about excuse the music stand with lyric sheets (though tbh, I don't like to see that) but I find his inability to remember songs frustrating. We have a short set list of around 8 songs so far, he can play them all ok, but at rehearsal, someone says "lets do song A" and his reply will be "which ones that?" And then, he'll get his phone out, listen to the first few bars so he knows which song it is! He has to do this for almost every song, even the ones he suggested! He's also prone to starting things in the wrong key, getting his intro's mixed up (it's 60's RnB so a couple of them are similar at the start, so that's probably understandable) He seems to think this would be funny if he needed to do it at a gig. I despair! This gig isn't much, I know that, but I still want to appear professional (it's actually in the village where I grew up, so there will be people there that have known me for over 40 years) I don't mind jamming, but I don't want to be doing it in front of an audience.... Any thoughts? Am I being too fussy? Uptight? Anyway, rant over.... Edited May 29, 2015 by 4-string-thing Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bassman Steve Posted May 29, 2015 Share Posted May 29, 2015 Drop out straight away. Even if you get through this, his behaviour will eradicate any enjoyment you will get from the gig. he doesn't sound very 'like minded'. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neepheid Posted May 29, 2015 Share Posted May 29, 2015 Would do my nut in. I would also be worried. Then annoyed when my predictions came true. Then I'd probably leave. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bassman Steve Posted May 29, 2015 Share Posted May 29, 2015 ................. or take the Acoustics and he won't be heard! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Les Posted May 29, 2015 Share Posted May 29, 2015 He needs to write keys, opening chords etc. on his lyric sheets. Getting his phone out at the gig is defo a no no, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RAY AGAINST THE MACHINE Posted May 29, 2015 Share Posted May 29, 2015 (edited) If you just play with a smile on your face regardless , and lock in with the drummer you should be ok. I've played a few gigs where me and either the guitarist ( or drummer depending which band I was in )were told how good we were , and criyicised the frontman . So ,they knew that we weren't the problem . Enjoy it, and deal with issues afterwards;) Edited May 29, 2015 by RAY AGAINST THE MACHINE Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adrenochrome Posted May 29, 2015 Share Posted May 29, 2015 No I don't think you're being too fussy. If he's making mistakes like that in the safe and comfortable practice environment, then he could be a lot worse in a gig where everything sounds different, there are distractions etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
discreet Posted May 29, 2015 Share Posted May 29, 2015 (edited) You're not being fussy at all. Personally I wouldn't go anywhere it until he's ready, but it sounds like he never will be as he sees the whole thing as a bit of fun and is the band is obviously way down his list of priorities. Regardless of what level you're at, what your ambitions are and what kind of gigs you're doing, there is no excuse for not having a pro attitude even if you're not a pro band and never will be. It doesn't matter if you're playing a kids birthday party or The Albert Hall, the enjoyment you get from doing a gig is in proportion to the quality of your preparation and your attitude - as it stands I wouldn't touch it with a 10-foot gig pole. Whatever that is. On the other hand I am quite often accused of taking things too seriously, so YMMV. I just think if you're going to go to the trouble of learning to play an instrument, buying expensive gear, finding 'like-minded' musicians, paying for and doing rehearsals and finding gigs, why fall at the very last hurdle and turn out a crappy performance because one or more members can't be bothered to put the work it and learn the material? It's letting the side down at the very least! Edited May 29, 2015 by discreet Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dad3353 Posted May 29, 2015 Share Posted May 29, 2015 Chill out. In your musical career, the worst is yet to come. Go with the flow and see how it pans out; it may (and probably will...) be much better than your present fears. Do your bit; he'll do his (or not...) The world's weight is not on your shoulders. Enjoy the gig, that's the main thing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4-string-thing Posted May 29, 2015 Author Share Posted May 29, 2015 I think the chords/keys are on his lyric sheets... It's just his general "dizzy" attitude that bugs me! We're doing a few songs of his choosing because he claimed to know them from previous bands... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ahpook Posted May 29, 2015 Share Posted May 29, 2015 (edited) I wouldn't step on stage with the guy if he's going to carry on like that. He's either not ready or doesn't care enough to make the effort. Edited May 29, 2015 by ahpook Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
discreet Posted May 29, 2015 Share Posted May 29, 2015 [quote name='Dad3353' timestamp='1432891958' post='2785876'] Chill out. In your musical career, the worst is yet to come. Go with the flow and see how it pans out; it may (and probably will...) be much better than your present fears. Do your bit; he'll do his (or not...) The world's weight is not on your shoulders. Enjoy the gig, that's the main thing. [/quote] You hippy! You're not the one about to make an arse of yourself in your home village in front of your childhood friends! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4-string-thing Posted May 29, 2015 Author Share Posted May 29, 2015 Discreet, you have both made me LOL and crap myself with fear at the same time! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
discreet Posted May 29, 2015 Share Posted May 29, 2015 (edited) [quote name='4-string-thing' timestamp='1432893232' post='2785892'] Discreet, you have both made me LOL and crap myself with fear at the same time! [/quote] It's what I do best... Seriously though, I've played too many gigs over the years with people who just aren't up to it and I won't do it any more! Having said that it is very difficult to find people as brilliant as oneself so there is always a certain element of 'why aren't they better?' about it. Trouble is once you're out there playing in public, the angst becomes magnified and makes you wish you'd done something about it earlier! Too late now! I'm not helping much, am I..? At this stage I'd probably just take Dad's advice - swallow a Junior Disprin and go with the flow - at least it'll be interesting... Edited May 29, 2015 by discreet Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4-string-thing Posted May 29, 2015 Author Share Posted May 29, 2015 I'll see how it goes at Sundays rehearsal, we've had a couple of weeks off due to holidays, so maybe he's been putting some work in while I've been away? If he's not got his act together, I'll have a word on Monday. I guess I like the idea of a relaxed attitude, but in practice I'm a control freak who likes things to be as good as possible. I see what you're saying about if he can't get it right in rehearsal, he's got no chance at a gig, but it could go the other way and he could step up to the plate and surprise us all.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ezbass Posted May 29, 2015 Share Posted May 29, 2015 Unfortunately, it is probably not possible for your singer to see the error of his ways until he has had a real gig, nothing can be a substitute for that. However, more rehearsing in 'gig mode' (no phone, no restarts) will help. You need to be firm with the guy, he is the focus of the band, if he wants to be funny, let him do stand up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cheddatom Posted May 29, 2015 Share Posted May 29, 2015 As a general rule, it's best to assume that the gig will be more fraught than the rehearsal, so if you're not happy with rehearsal, don't do the gig. Can't you just persuade him to ditch the phone? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dad3353 Posted May 29, 2015 Share Posted May 29, 2015 (edited) [quote name='discreet' timestamp='1432892893' post='2785890'] You hippy! You're not the one about to make an arse of yourself in your home village in front of your childhood friends! [/quote] Been there, done it, tee-shirt got and all; I'm still breathing (just... ). It's the singer/front man who has to fear ridicule, although he may be about to create a new fashion in stage presence, who knows..? Maybe desinvolte is the new professional..? Edited May 29, 2015 by Dad3353 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4-string-thing Posted May 29, 2015 Author Share Posted May 29, 2015 ezbass, you're right.... Putting the band into gig mode seems sensible. Use our own amps at rehearsal, stick to the 8 songs we've chosen (he keeps suggesting new ones, before he's learnt the original 8) And generally tidy up intro's endings etc.... Sounds like a plan! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
discreet Posted May 29, 2015 Share Posted May 29, 2015 (edited) [quote name='Dad3353' timestamp='1432893793' post='2785903'] Maybe desinvolte is the new professional..? [/quote] Ha! All those bands with an apparently 'casual' attitude generally have a lot of hard work and rehearsal behind them to make it look that easy! All the [i]genuinely [/i]'casual' musicians and singers are behind a till in Sainsbury's!!* [size=2]*Not that there's anything wrong with that. It's a job.[/size] [quote name='4-string-thing' timestamp='1432894022' post='2785909'] Use our own amps at rehearsal, stick to the 8 songs we've chosen (he keeps suggesting new ones, before he's learnt the original 8) And generally tidy up intro's endings etc.... Sounds like a plan! [/quote] It's a start. One of the worst things you can do is leave huge gaps between numbers, it looks bad. Practice ending one song and going into another with only a few seconds delay. It's easy to do and makes you seem pro. Having said that the bands I play with are usually guilty of it. That's because they're assholes!! Ein Reich! Ein Volk! ...Oops. Edited May 29, 2015 by discreet Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marvin Posted May 29, 2015 Share Posted May 29, 2015 I was going to say go with the flow, but then I thought about the gigs I've enjoyed and the ones I haven't. The gigs I've had a blast at are the ones where I've had absolute confidence in the people up on stage with me. At the minimum as ezbass says your front man needs more rehearsal in gig mode (but that's what I've always regarded rehearsals as) I used to jump at any band, so desperate to be in a band and to play. However, after several years of doing that I've got to the stage where I've realised most bands are a waste of time and would rather bide my time than just be in something for the sake of it. When the band I contacted recently gets back in touch eventually I'll be saying I've changed my mind...take too long to get back to me, that's not good in my books. Having the same standards and approach is the only way it works for me Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4-string-thing Posted May 29, 2015 Author Share Posted May 29, 2015 It's very easy for me to criticise I suppose. After all, I have a bass, lead, amp.... No effects to mess around with between songs etc. I can see a lot of delays where he messes with pedals, amp settings, guitar swaps..... Oh Jeez, the hot flushes are starting again Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonnythenotes Posted May 29, 2015 Share Posted May 29, 2015 He is a passenger.... He is putting nothing in, that's why he is asking you, or his phone, or his music stand, (complete with bits of scribbled paper placed on it)what the hell to do. A band relies totally on everybody's faith in their fellow band members to get it right all of the time. If you have got a member who can't provide this guarantee, then you have a gig where all you seem to do is live with the fear and stress of something going wrong, and when it does, band confidence hits the deck. Things will always go wrong in live music, but a good band recognises what has gone wtong and fixes it there and then, mid song.This ability to fix it comes from knowing the songs well. This bloke must finish rehearsing with you, pack his stuff away, and his gear doesn't see the light of day again until your next rehearsal, when out comes the phone, the music stand, the ' how does this one go' questions again. Good bands are not put together in rehearsal rooms, they are put together by musicians putting in unseen hours at home, to learn and iron out problems before hand. They then turn up at the rehearsal and put together all the pieces they have learnt, which in itself is sometimes better than gigging it... A first band run thru of a song that is 90% there is a great feeling. If you and the other band members are putting all the work in, and he is letting you do it, and then cannibalising what you have done because he can't be bothered, he does not deserve you or the band, unless of course you are prepared to work with a lazy, noncommittal user.... Even mates can't get away with that.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marvin Posted May 29, 2015 Share Posted May 29, 2015 I can put up with screw ups and stuff to some extent if the effort and attitude to be professional is there Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4-string-thing Posted May 29, 2015 Author Share Posted May 29, 2015 You could be right Jonny, he seems to spend more time on youtube looking for more material, than learning the songs we've already agreed on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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