Guest markinthegreen Posted May 19, 2011 Share Posted May 19, 2011 I wondering if any of you lot might be able to help me out? I recently brought a 1973 fender jazz bass from a dealer in LA, Its a beautiful looking instrument and its all original, nothing whatsoever has been changed. I used it for the first time a couple of weeks ago at a live session I was doing, and was very impressed, It did all the right things. However in the studio in a recording situation I am finding it very thin, with not a lot of sustain especially when comparing it to a 75' Jazz bass that I have, which sounds like a completely different animal altogether. My 75' does however have a Baddass II bridge on it. My question is: is it all down to the bridge? I didn't really want to start changing anything on the 73' as I mentioned it is completely original, but if that what it takes... Any suggestions. Cheers Mark Saunders. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcgraham Posted May 19, 2011 Share Posted May 19, 2011 (edited) It could be a multitude of things, (bridge, nut, setup, pickups, even the strings! etc) My suggestion for something of that value and history is take it to a top notch set-up guru for a setup and their opinion, that way nothing irreversible or value-decreasing will be done that isn't 100% necessary. I don't know where you are based, but if you are in the UK then somewhere like the Bass Gallery in London are great people to speak to about that sort of thing. Edited May 19, 2011 by mcgraham Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happy Jack Posted May 19, 2011 Share Posted May 19, 2011 If it sounds good live but not so in the studio, start by asking what's different at the studio. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris_b Posted May 19, 2011 Share Posted May 19, 2011 (edited) If you turn both volume controls on a Jazz full on they can cancel each other out and you get a drop in volume. Just roll one off a little. If it's good live then don't change anything, just use the other bass in the studio. On the other hand, maybe this is an example of why the replacement Fender parts industry got such a boost in the 70's. Edited May 19, 2011 by chris_b Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wateroftyne Posted May 19, 2011 Share Posted May 19, 2011 (edited) As has been mentioned, it could be a number of things. I'd check the pickups aren't too close to the strings, first. Then... off for a pro setup. Edited May 19, 2011 by wateroftyne Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest markinthegreen Posted May 19, 2011 Share Posted May 19, 2011 Thank for your help people, I did have a setup done by the tech guy from Holiday music in Southend On Sea, he came highly recommended and his knowledge of the instrument was quite impressive. And when I got it back it felt like a dream to play (Set up wise). One thing i forgot to mention is the tone knob, There does not seem to be that much scope to it, rolled up full or down doesn't change the sound a great deal? this is bothering me a hugely when recording. Is this a common trait to a early 70's bass? I understand if it sounds great live then leave it at that, however when you spend the kind of money it cost you kind of want it to be good at everything right? Cheers, your thoughts are a great help. Mark Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigRedX Posted May 19, 2011 Share Posted May 19, 2011 If it sounds good live then it ought to sound even better in the studio. How are you recording it? DI, Mic'd amp (what amp and speakers)? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wateroftyne Posted May 19, 2011 Share Posted May 19, 2011 I should learn to read.. I thought it sounded thin live, not vice-versa... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest markinthegreen Posted May 19, 2011 Share Posted May 19, 2011 Im using: 1 Pre Pedal Di 1 Post Pedal Di 1 mic 410 classic Mark Bass cab Mark Bass T800 Head. I suppose the noticeable difference is how good the 75' sounds, its making my 73' sound pony! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigRedX Posted May 19, 2011 Share Posted May 19, 2011 (edited) [quote name='markinthegreen' post='1236859' date='May 19 2011, 12:48 PM']I suppose the noticeable difference is how good the 75' sounds, its making my 73' sound pony![/quote] Ah! There's your problem, one's 2 foot shorter than the other... ;-) Seriously though does the '75 sound better than the '73 live? Fenders do tend to be somewhat variable. Just because the '73 is older doesn't automatically make it better. Unless the '73 is nicer to play I'd just use the '75 and not worry about it. Recording is all about getting the best sound for the song. No one can see what bass you are using. Edited May 19, 2011 by BigRedX Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris_b Posted May 19, 2011 Share Posted May 19, 2011 If your bass doesn't sustain well a Badass will always improve the sound. You could try a Fatfinger, which will help the sustain problem and isn't a permanent change. A regular problem with older basses is failing pots and pickups. But if the bass sounds good live then that probably isn’t the reason. The EQ that's available in a studio should compensate for any tone problems on the bass. But in the end, some instruments just "work" in one situation and not in others. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xilddx Posted May 19, 2011 Share Posted May 19, 2011 [quote name='markinthegreen' post='1236848' date='May 19 2011, 12:36 PM']Thank for your help people, I did have a setup done by the tech guy from Holiday music in Southend On Sea, he came highly recommended and his knowledge of the instrument was quite impressive. And when I got it back it felt like a dream to play (Set up wise). One thing i forgot to mention is the tone knob, There does not seem to be that much scope to it, rolled up full or down doesn't change the sound a great deal? this is bothering me a hugely when recording. Is this a common trait to a early 70's bass? I understand if it sounds great live then leave it at that, however when you spend the kind of money it cost you kind of want it to be good at everything right? Cheers, your thoughts are a great help. Mark[/quote] You may not like this suggestion, but buy and fit a John East J-Retro 01 preamp. They are solderless except for the grounds and you could probably get away with actually twisting the ground wire ends together and taping them. They are very very simple to fit, even for a novice. And it's easy to put your bass back to standard. Here's a thread I started with before and after clips of my Jap Fender 62 RI Jazz without, then with the J-Retro. There's much more info on there about the sound and the passive mode [url="http://basschat.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=123987&hl"]http://basschat.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=123987&hl[/url] John East's Website. It's the J-Retro 01 you want, NOT the J-Retro deluxe. [url="http://www.east-uk.com/"]http://www.east-uk.com/[/url] I ordered one with black knobs so it looked normal from a distance. You get a Basschat discount from John too. Call him for any advice, he's the friendliest most helpful gentleman you'll ever meet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
73Jazz Posted May 19, 2011 Share Posted May 19, 2011 1st of all..i am not thin! 2nd..as i always recommend to try an yamaha NE-1 with a jazzbass. 3rd.."On the other hand, maybe this is an example of why the replacement Fender parts industry got such a boost in the 70's." nonsense 4rth i will send you a pm, if you allow but..if the bass always sounds as you like it..but not in the studio..the problem is not the bass..my oppinion Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shaggy Posted May 19, 2011 Share Posted May 19, 2011 .........or get a Precision Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
73Jazz Posted May 19, 2011 Share Posted May 19, 2011 [quote name='Shaggy' post='1237186' date='May 19 2011, 07:05 PM'].........or get a Precision [/quote] ...don`t tell all the secrets Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sibob Posted May 19, 2011 Share Posted May 19, 2011 I have to say, after I put a badass on a jazz a while ago, I didn't notice any kind of significant increased sustain compared to my standard bridged fenders. I've also found that on the few recording sessions I've done recently, my '03 Jazz has been bass of choice, whereas my '73 gets the pick live. Could he anything though, as has been mentioned. Measure the output of the pickups on both basses, see if that throws up any clues?! Si Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
73Jazz Posted May 19, 2011 Share Posted May 19, 2011 [quote name='Sibob' post='1237425' date='May 19 2011, 10:13 PM']I have to say, after I put a badass on a jazz a while ago, I didn't notice any kind of significant increased sustain compared to my standard bridged fenders.[/quote] In my eyes/ears the badass works like a smooth "compressor" in sound, some may like that, while the original bridge delivers more character and edge, which i prefer Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jakenewmanbass Posted May 19, 2011 Share Posted May 19, 2011 (edited) My '77 is like thunder in the studio, everyone always comments on how weighty the thump is. Thats partly my fingers and I guess the seymour duncans it had on when I bought it. Not sure this helps with the question... apart from the obvious... hit it right...! Edited May 19, 2011 by jakesbass Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JTUK Posted May 19, 2011 Share Posted May 19, 2011 [quote name='markinthegreen' post='1236848' date='May 19 2011, 12:36 PM']...... I understand if it sounds great live then leave it at that, however when you spend the kind of money it cost you kind of want it to be good at everything right? Cheers, your thoughts are a great help. Mark[/quote] Not really... some basses excel at some things and suck at others. If you have more than one, you'll use each in the situation you find it works best in. If it sounds great live, that is good..but you can't demand or expect it to work well everywhere. You probably paid the money you did for its date of manufacture, first and foremost..no garuantees beyond that, IME. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heathy Posted May 20, 2011 Share Posted May 20, 2011 [quote name='silddx' post='1236895' date='May 19 2011, 01:31 PM']buy and fit a John East J-Retro 01 preamp. [/quote] +1. I can't tell you what a massive difference this has made to my sound (and playing) in just a few short weeks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prime_BASS Posted May 20, 2011 Share Posted May 20, 2011 You may have issue with dead electronics. For example on of the pickups is dead thus sounds thin. You may not have noticed live but will do when it's played solo on it's own. I'm surprised you hadn't played it before using it live to see if everything was kosher. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris_b Posted May 20, 2011 Share Posted May 20, 2011 The J-Retro is a good idea but it's an on-board preamp which requires modding your bass. If I were you I'd keep the bass 100% original and unchanged (to maintain it’s value) and I'd get an out-board preamp like the Sadowsky or Sansamp. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
73Jazz Posted May 20, 2011 Share Posted May 20, 2011 [quote name='chris_b' post='1237906' date='May 20 2011, 11:58 AM']The J-Retro is a good idea but it's an on-board preamp which requires modding your bass. If I were you I'd keep the bass 100% original and unchanged (to maintain it’s value) and I'd get an out-board preamp like the Sadowsky or Sansamp.[/quote] The J-Reotro requires NO modifikation. Additional to this..the J-Retro is also available as an outboard preamp. The Sansamp is not the best choice for a JB and is colouring the sound of each instrument too much..even while blending it max to 12 o`clock. but..i do not think that a preamp is the solution in this case Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigRedX Posted May 20, 2011 Share Posted May 20, 2011 (edited) [quote name='chris_b' post='1237906' date='May 20 2011, 10:58 AM']The J-Retro is a good idea but it's an on-board preamp which requires modding your bass. If I were you I'd keep the bass 100% original and unchanged (to maintain it’s value) and I'd get an out-board preamp like the Sadowsky or Sansamp.[/quote] Or you could try adjusting the tone controls on your amp. Edited May 20, 2011 by BigRedX Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris_b Posted May 20, 2011 Share Posted May 20, 2011 [quote name='73Jazz' post='1237917' date='May 20 2011, 11:02 AM']....The J-Reotro requires NO modifikation....[/quote] Presumably you have to unsolder the original electrics? That counts as a mod to some collectors. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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