FlatEric Posted January 11, 2011 Share Posted January 11, 2011 As I am doing a feature on the man who made the originals, I have tried to look a these new models with an open mind. [url="http://flatericbassandguitar.blogspot.com/"]Peter Cook - FenderBirds and ExplorerBirds[/url] I think it is clear from reading the Dean promo stuff, the top man, is a fan of John and The Who. Whether it presses all the right buttons, or not - I'm not sure. I think Peter would recognise the "Cataldo", as a very close facsimilie and any others that are close to the original. BaCh is not that far off the mark but I'm not sure (myself) about the Dean. Is it as pure, raw and inspirational as the originals that Peter made for John? Discuss/Answers on a postcard! Cheers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris2112 Posted January 12, 2011 Share Posted January 12, 2011 Those 'birds have never done it for me, but surely there are some folk out there who like upside down basses? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Conan Posted January 12, 2011 Share Posted January 12, 2011 I misread the thread title, and was wondering who this "Dean Entwistle" was... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JPJ Posted January 12, 2011 Share Posted January 12, 2011 [quote name='Mog' post='1086018' date='Jan 11 2011, 08:24 PM']That Hybrid looks like something I've seen before. Rex Brown sig SSD maybe?[/quote] My thoughts exactly, and after my experience with the Rex Brown, I won't be joining the queue for the new Dean Fenderbirds Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolverinebass Posted January 12, 2011 Share Posted January 12, 2011 (edited) It's beyond any level of stupidity. If you're going to get a Spyder, get an Alembic one. The warwick buzzard is inferior in every way to the Status one. Yes, I've played both. To shed some light on this whole Buzzard thing. I took my bass to Status about 3 years ago to get it fixed (after the bass centre made a mess of something) and had a nice chat to Rob afterwards. He was rather upset (I'm being euphemistic) at Chris Entwistle whom he said he'd spoken with a few days after John died and who assured him that Status buzzards would still be able to be made. The rest is history. Warwick threatened to sue Status back to the stone age and Rob had to destroy all the moulds. That was in about mid 2008 so that was almost 3 years after the whole thing happened as I got my buzzard (the last one) in September 2005. As for the insidious suggestion that "John would love them," I beg to differ. When did he ever play anything other than top instruments with every single bell and whistle you could possibly imagine on them? Discount pre 1975 periods. It does look suspiciously like Chris is doing this for the money. I would have thought that extending an olive branch to Rob with this might have been the way to go, but what do I know. I'm sure Rob's got enough going on with all his other new basses this year. Regarding Doddy's thought that the Wickershams at Alembic might have something to say about Dean ripping off their design in such a garish way, I'd hope that he's right. They've even ripped off the "only 25 to be made" from when Alembic re-issued a cut down version of the Spyder in 2003 (25 four strings and 25 eight strings were made). On the other hand, the body shape was first done by Gibson wasn't it? I don't know if that's right though or if that would make any difference as I'm not a lawyer... Shameless, shameless cash in. Edited January 12, 2011 by Wolverinebass Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garethox Posted January 12, 2011 Share Posted January 12, 2011 Hey Wolverine.... I think the Foundation had a heavy hand in this as well - Chris might well have been guided by them somewhat (although that is speculation on my part). Chris has said that the Estate lawyers messed up on Buzzard issue - they agreed on Warwick having all the rights to anything Buzzard, not just the wooden (inferior I agree, and I too have played both) version. Warwick's 'license' re: the Buzzard has now expired so I suppose Status could have been approached and Chris himself has not ruled it out in the future, but I think Rob would be very wary tbh. Also the cost of rebuilding those moulds and starting up production again would be, I think, cost prohibitive. It would make the B1 as least £10K retail I think. Alembic did base John's basses on a Gibson design, so what protestations they could have I don't know - maybe the cobweb design, but I think JAE himself probably thought to add those. I don't think too much to the new Signature basses myself either. I would have liked to have seen a Status bass used in a sort of Fenderbird style design - the B2 graphite neck with Roman numerals on a reverse style body like John used in the early 70's with the B1 electronics and L.E.D's up the neck. That might have been a suitable bass...... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris2112 Posted January 12, 2011 Share Posted January 12, 2011 I(f only Rob had just put the moulds into storage he could have resumed production of the bass if Chris and him had been able to reach an agreement. But I'd rather he just kept on making his own basses than risking getting sued. All those Kingbasses and S2's, just not worth it to keep the Buzzard going as sad as that may be! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolverinebass Posted January 12, 2011 Share Posted January 12, 2011 (edited) You know Gareth, I wondered about the fact he's been guided by the foundation. If the money was going to the foundation you could almost say fair enough, but I bet it isn't. Also, Chris - I mentioned the same thing to Rob - couldn't you just keep the moulds and wait for the license to run out? No. They would have been sued even for that apparently. Edited January 12, 2011 by Wolverinebass Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garethox Posted January 12, 2011 Share Posted January 12, 2011 [quote name='Wolverinebass' post='1087067' date='Jan 12 2011, 07:08 PM']You know Gareth, I wondered about the fact he's been guided by the foundation. If the money was going to the foundation you could almost say fair enough, but I bet it isn't. Also, Chris - I mentioned the same thing to Rob - couldn't you just keep the moulds and wait for the license to run out? No. They would have been sued even for that apparently.[/quote] Yep, anything to do with the Buzzard was Warwicks and HPW made sure of that it seems. I don't know if a % is going to the JEF... it would be nice to think so wouldn't it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garethox Posted January 12, 2011 Share Posted January 12, 2011 [quote name='Johnston' post='1087077' date='Jan 12 2011, 07:19 PM']I've never seen a B1 in the flesh. But having seen guys work with carbon and stuff. Why couldn't someone donate an existing one to be used as a "plug" to make new moulds?? Or does the design mean the one being used would need to be sacrificed?? Back onto the OT I'm growing to like the Fenderbird although I don't think enough to stump up the extra the Signature on the headstock will add to the price.[/quote] I don't know enough about the moulding process tbh, but I wouldn't offer mine as the guinea pig!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris2112 Posted January 12, 2011 Share Posted January 12, 2011 Surely it can't be that simple, as even then Rob could have kept an old body shell his loft or something. And the time and cost it takes to develop the moulds are huge, so surely there can't be a quick fix. I remember reading about Geoff Gould's huge startup costs for Modulus, because the moulds cost so much to create in the first place. So I assume it is a difficult process! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lfalex v1.1 Posted January 13, 2011 Share Posted January 13, 2011 [quote name='Doctor J' post='1086078' date='Jan 11 2011, 09:02 PM']No corpse is safe with Dean around. The amount of junk Darrell Abbot has somehow released through Dean from beyond the grave is a farce.[/quote] And HJ Heinz & Co. Have jumped on the Entwistle bandwagon, too.. They do [i]Ox[/i]tail soup now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
senmen Posted January 13, 2011 Share Posted January 13, 2011 Guys, Oliver (senmen) here. I have to step in into that. Well, for us it is all clear what is going on here. Money making. Period. To me as a big JE fan and this from the heart this thing is absolutely damaging Johns heritage. As for the Deans. No comment.... I have owned and played Alembic JE Spyder 4 and 8string, my custom Alembic Dragon Wing Tears for John, my old Buzz2, a Warwick Buzzard, my actual B2 and now also my B1. And I must say: nothing beats the B1. Nothing. But spending 6,5K on that Dean Spyder. Well, for that money I would rather buy a used Alembic JE Spyder from the 2003 limited series. As for Warwick and Status: there is something that is not true. Warwick is still producing and advertising the Buzzard. He is now named JE Buzzard. What Chris said is to my knowledge not totally ok. The rights on the name John Entwistle in collaboration with musical instruments is stopped now and therefore now given to Dean. BUT: the most serious thing is that Warwick could convince the lawyers that he was the designer of the Buzzard and not JE or better said he could convince the lawyers that he did provide more design details than JE. And that is the problem. Everyone who will try to produce a Buzzard will be sued by Warwick! Therefore no go for Status even if Chris is saying no problem! As for Alembic. I talked to them yesterday as I really have a good relationship to them. They are not amused and will communicate that to Dean. But there are no existing copyrights so it might be taken as is..... Cheers Oliver Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris2112 Posted January 13, 2011 Share Posted January 13, 2011 Sadly, I don't think Dean will be interested in reasoning from seasoned luthiers or concerned fans that these basses are a rather tasteless and tacky way to further exploit John. There is money to be made here. As has been previously mentioned, just look at all those awful Dimebag Darrell models. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
senmen Posted January 13, 2011 Share Posted January 13, 2011 Well, this turns out to a joke. I see this now on the Statii forum from a collaborator of this project: love it, hate it...whatever. We are talking about Entwistle here on the forum, a lot more people will be reminded of him, we'll raise more money to put music rooms in hospitals for sick kids...I'm buying a hybrid, I'll let you know what I think once I've actually played one, I'm not forming an opinion based on looking at a product shot. Fact is, that I got an email from the head of the foundation two weeks ago after I had asked him about the bass and he told me that this bass has nothing to do with the foundation... ?????? There is a WHO song that matches: We won't get fooled again...... Oliver (senmen) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mokl Posted January 13, 2011 Share Posted January 13, 2011 (edited) I am unfortunate enough to have been in the position of selling Dean guitars, in particular the myriad of Dime Bag Darrell "Tribute" models. Surely, if Dean intended to pay a "tribute" they might try harder than to peddle inferior quality, overpriced tat bearing the deceased's name. I really hope that these basses are better, but I would be utterly amazed. Having said that, a couple of USA made Deans have passed through my hands (on their way to customers), and they were a beautiful quality. Edited January 13, 2011 by Mokl Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FlatEric Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 [quote name='senmen' post='1088430' date='Jan 13 2011, 06:49 PM']Guys, Oliver (senmen) here. I have to step in into that. Well, for us it is all clear what is going on here. Money making. Period. To me as a big JE fan and this from the heart this thing is absolutely damaging Johns heritage. As for the Deans. No comment.... I have owned and played Alembic JE Spyder 4 and 8string, my custom Alembic Dragon Wing Tears for John, my old Buzz2, a Warwick Buzzard, my actual B2 and now also my B1. And I must say: nothing beats the B1. Nothing. But spending 6,5K on that Dean Spyder. Well, for that money I would rather buy a used Alembic JE Spyder from the 2003 limited series. As for Warwick and Status: there is something that is not true. Warwick is still producing and advertising the Buzzard. He is now named JE Buzzard. What Chris said is to my knowledge not totally ok. The rights on the name John Entwistle in collaboration with musical instruments is stopped now and therefore now given to Dean. BUT: the most serious thing is that Warwick could convince the lawyers that he was the designer of the Buzzard and not JE or better said he could convince the lawyers that he did provide more design details than JE. And that is the problem. Everyone who will try to produce a Buzzard will be sued by Warwick! Therefore no go for Status even if Chris is saying no problem! As for Alembic. I talked to them yesterday as I really have a good relationship to them. They are not amused and will communicate that to Dean. But there are no existing copyrights so it might be taken as is..... Cheers Oliver[/quote] Mmm, good point. Extract from my blog - Peter Cook feature "words from the man himself" "John said he liked the T’bird body & fittings but he preferred the Precision neck – he gave me the hardware and I did the rest. When the pickups & bridges ran out I made them as well. I think there were about six Fenderbirds and 6 Explorerbirds . . ." So, in theory. . . . . . . They are "Peter Cook" "Tributes" Cheers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ezbass Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 [quote name='FlatEric' post='1088914' date='Jan 14 2011, 08:33 AM']So, in theory. . . . . . . They are "Peter Cook" "Tributes" Cheers. [/quote] The whale is in fact an insect. Sorry wrong Peter Cook. I'll get my coat. Dons outer garment and hangs head in shame. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
senmen Posted January 15, 2011 Share Posted January 15, 2011 ..and here are the retails: Spyder USD 6555 USA Hybrid USD 3722 Import Hybrid USD 699 Well, for that amount of money I would rather go for a used Alembic Spyder if I had to choose... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lemmywinks Posted January 15, 2011 Share Posted January 15, 2011 [quote name='senmen' post='1090510' date='Jan 15 2011, 03:12 PM']..and here are the retails: Spyder USD 6555 USA Hybrid USD 3722 Import Hybrid USD 699 Well, for that amount of money I would rather go for a used Alembic Spyder if I had to choose...[/quote] Crikey! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
12stringbassist Posted April 8, 2012 Share Posted April 8, 2012 You have to wonder how much they are going to be asking for this new version. I think I'd prefer it as a plain version, without the spiderwebs, to be honest. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
12stringbassist Posted April 8, 2012 Share Posted April 8, 2012 (edited) [b] [font=arial,helvetica,sans-serif][url="http://www.gearhounds.com/dean-john-entwistle-spider-bass-guitar-black-silver.aspx"][size=3]http://www.gearhounds.com/dean-john-entwistle-spider-bass-guitar-black-silver.aspx[/size][/url][/font][/b] [b] [font=arial,helvetica,sans-serif][size=3]Dean John Entwistle Spider Bass - Black / Silver Webs[/size] [size=3]List Price: $1,306.25 | Your Price: $799.00[/size] [size=3]|[/size][size=3] You Save: 39 %[/size][/font][/b] 799.00 USD = 503.29 GBP Edited April 8, 2012 by 12stringbassist Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gust0o Posted April 8, 2012 Share Posted April 8, 2012 Derek Acorah has said that John is very happy with his new signature basses. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chambo Posted April 8, 2012 Share Posted April 8, 2012 Isn't it just another Explorer copy? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
karlfer Posted April 8, 2012 Share Posted April 8, 2012 [quote name='Chambo' timestamp='1333912702' post='1608203'] Isn't it just another Explorer copy? [/quote] Yeah, shame about that hideous headstock , so much better if it had been P style like the wonderful Explorers John had. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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