Nuggets of wisdom that revolutionalised your playing.

[Hector]

A few years ago, I was told by a bass playing friend of mine (double bass) that I was gripping the neck too hard, and that rather than pressing the strings down I should be pulling them down with the weight of my arm. Hey presto, my shifting is better, my hand position is better (leading to better intonation) and there's less pressure in my left hand so I have much more stamina. Pretty revelatory! It's even lead me to look in more depth at how I play in thumb position to make stopping the strings easier.

Have you every had a simple piece of advice that lead to great benefits in your playing? Share your tales of joy!

[Pete Academy]

What you don't play can be more important than what you do play.

Space is important.

[Cat Burrito]

Don't drink more than 3 pints before going onstage

[Pete Academy]

[quote name='BurritoBass' post='1072108' date='Dec 29 2010, 08:25 PM']Don't drink more than 3 pints before going onstage [/quote]

Especially if it's whisky.

[EssentialTension]

'Don't give up your day job.'

[essexbasscat]

One step forward was the regular use of scale structures that start from the 1st, 2nd and 4th fingers and the art of arranging them to set yourself up for the next piece of music coming up.

Edit

this led to a drastic reduction of left hand bunching and fretboard leap - frogging

T

Edited December 29, 2010 by essexbasscat

[endorka]

When playing over a major chord, don't use the major 3rd in the bassline - substitute the major 6th instead. Unless you are playing reggae, in which case the major 3rd is ok.

From Carol Kaye - and I've found it to be true almost 100% of the time.

Jennifer

[Doddy]

I got some great advise from my Dad when I first said I wanted to play. He told me that if I was going to play,I should do it
properly-take lessons,get my technique together,learn to read...all that kind of stuff.

[essexbasscat]

Also, keep your mind on the bass part by not staring at the woman with the attributes of Pete Academy's avatar

[Sean]

1. Going through Ed Friedland's Walking Basslines book - absolutely superb primer for linear harmony (joining chords together), not just for jazz playing but any style.
2. Learning to read music - if you can't, you have no idea how useful it is. The better I get, the more I understand how useful a skill it is.
3. Ear training software - there are lots of different ones but plugging away with a good one will have you doing my next one faster...
4. Transcribe basslines by ear. Thinking about not just the notes but how they are played, in what position etc.

[Sean]

[quote name='endorka' post='1072232' date='Dec 29 2010, 10:37 PM']When playing over a major chord, don't use the major 3rd in the bassline - substitute the major 6th instead. Unless you are playing reggae, in which case the major 3rd is ok.

From Carol Kaye - and I've found it to be true almost 100% of the time.

Jennifer[/quote]

I've carried this nugget of Carol's around for a few years now and it's made me feel guilty about using the Major third but I'm starting to use it more and have decided it's not as "hokey" [is that the word she used?] as she makes out.

I would modify CK's advice and say, be careful when using a major 3rd over a major chord, it might sound cheesy depending on how it sits, a maj 6th is usually better. My dad told me not to argue with women or crazy people and Carol ticks at least one of those boxes so maybe I'll shut up!

[scalpy]

Duck Dunn says that Al Jackson Jr suggested when playing quavers feel the crotchets, when playing crotchets feel the minim etc. Works for Duck, and works for me too!

[endorka]

[quote name='Sean' post='1072394' date='Dec 30 2010, 01:32 AM']I've carried this nugget of Carol's around for a few years now and it's made me feel guilty about using the Major third but I'm starting to use it more and have decided it's not as "hokey" [is that the word she used?] as she makes out.

I would modify CK's advice and say, be careful when using a major 3rd over a major chord, it might sound cheesy depending on how it sits, a maj 6th is usually better.[/quote]

You are of course correct, it is a generalisation that is not always the case. For such a simple statement, however, the number of times I have found it to be true has surprised me.

Jennifer

[Joe Hubbard Bass]

[quote name='endorka' post='1072232' date='Dec 29 2010, 10:37 PM']When playing over a major chord, don't use the major 3rd in the bassline - substitute the major 6th instead. Unless you are playing reggae, in which case the major 3rd is ok.

From Carol Kaye - and I've found it to be true almost 100% of the time.

Jennifer[/quote]

Are you sure she didn't say use the "6th" instead of the "7th"?

Best

Joe

[Bilbo]

Two for me.

One was from a Cardiff sax/flute/guitar/drums player called Lee Goodall (and, yes, he excelled at all of them - I think flute was his first instrument and he is priimarily known as a sax player) who, when drumming in a Quartet I was playing with, explained to me the concept of playing ahead of, on, and behind the beat. Lee used to live in New York and has played with Will Lee and Anthony Jackson (playing with me must have been such a come down!!).

Second was a trumpet player called Paul Tungay (Paul was Tom Jones' first trumpter and had also played in Ronnie Scott's big band in the 1960s) who drew attention to a timing defecit in my playing (I played in Paul's band for a couple of years - I couldn't do a gig once so he called Roy Babbington in to dep ). Whenever I played a fill, I would focus on the fill and miss the downbeat. He suggested I change my focus and ensure that I made the downbeat as that was an essential part of the groove whereas the fills, whilst adding colour, were peripheral to the core performance. Its a simple change of perspective but it made me a better player from that day on. I have actually found that focussing on the downbeat actually tightens up the fills as it forces you to play the subdivisions more accurately. Particularly useful in Latin music where the 'downbeat' is not the first beat of the bar.

[endorka]

[quote name='Joe Hubbard Bass' post='1072475' date='Dec 30 2010, 09:30 AM']Are you sure she didn't say use the "6th" instead of the "7th"?[/quote]

I'm sure it was the third she mentioned. Two possibilities spring to mind though;

1) In my studies of general orchestration I have come across another rule that mentions substituting the major 6th for the major 7th when harmonising. This is particularly applicable when the melody note is the tonic, i.e. it would give a semitone clash with the major 7th. I have sucessfully applied this rule to basslines & cello parts as well.

2) I think she has also mentioned that the major 6th can be used with a dominant chord, even if the minor 7th is present elsewhere.

Jennifer

[Slaveunit]

awwww... I want an epiphany!!!!

though my resolution this year is to start lessons, so maybe it's on its way...

[essexbasscat]

[quote name='scalpy' post='1072396' date='Dec 30 2010, 01:39 AM']Duck Dunn says that Al Jackson Jr suggested when playing quavers feel the crotchets, when playing crotchets feel the minim etc. Works for Duck, and works for me too![/quote]


+1 to this for practically all of my musical life

[gjones]

[quote name='Pete Academy' post='1072106' date='Dec 29 2010, 08:23 PM']What you don't play can be more important than what you do play.

Space is important.[/quote]

+1

And 'find the groove'. The groove's the indescribable thing the rest of the band (especially the drummer) are looking for in a bassist and it's what makes a band tick. If you've found it...........stick with it.

Edited December 30, 2010 by gjones

[Dood]

Aptitude + Attitude = Altitude

Nathan East on talking about what makes a good session musician, but it applies to so many other areas of playing Bass. Know your stuff and have the right attitude towards when and how to use it.

[chris_b]

Advice from a double bass player on playing walking bass lines;

"Never hit the same note twice in a row".

It works!

[Romberg Bevel]

[quote name='endorka' post='1072232' date='Dec 29 2010, 11:37 PM']When playing over a major chord, don't use the major 3rd in the bassline - substitute the major 6th instead. Unless you are playing reggae, in which case the major 3rd is ok.

From Carol Kaye - and I've found it to be true almost 100% of the time.[/quote]

I don't think that's right - that would consign pretty much every bassline to the 'cheesy' bin. The major third's always good, isn't it? I think Carol says something along the lines of think about chord tones rather than scales.
I like Carol Kaye but she does ramble alot and often says do something then plays something else (on her tapes at least!).

She plays a hell of alot of thirds for someone who tries to avoid 'em.

[Joe Hubbard Bass]

[quote name='endorka' post='1072489' date='Dec 30 2010, 09:49 AM']I'm sure it was the third she mentioned. Two possibilities spring to mind though;

1) In my studies of general orchestration I have come across another rule that mentions substituting the major 6th for the major 7th when harmonising. This is particularly applicable when the melody note is the tonic, i.e. it would give a semitone clash with the major 7th. I have sucessfully applied this rule to basslines & cello parts as well.

2) I think she has also mentioned that the major 6th can be used with a dominant chord, even if the minor 7th is present elsewhere.

Jennifer[/quote]

Thirds (and 10ths) are used prolifically over major chord types in all forms of music with great success. In a pop/funk context it is common place for people to subtract the major 7th and replace it with the major 6th. I can't imagine Carol Kaye advising not to use the major third over a major chord type. It is just kindergarden theory. Not to mention all the bass lines that she claimed to have played are loaded with root, third, double chromatic to the fifth. Of course the 6th over a Dominant 7th chord is really a chord tension that is commonly reffered to as tension 13.

Best

Joe

[Joe Hubbard Bass]

[quote name='chris_b' post='1072683' date='Dec 30 2010, 01:20 PM']Advice from a double bass player on playing walking bass lines;

"Never hit the same note twice in a row".

It works![/quote]


This is bad advice! The use of repeated notes is a powerful device for creating all sorts of dynamic tension in your lines. It has been used throughout time by everyone from Paul Chambers to Miles Davis; from Anthony Jackson to John Coltrane. As a bass player giving that advice, he should be shot as a bass player's toolbox should include is what is called "pedal points."

Best

Joe

Edited December 30, 2010 by Joe Hubbard Bass

[endorka]

[quote name='Joe Hubbard Bass' post='1072934' date='Dec 30 2010, 05:42 PM']In a pop/funk context it is common place for people to subtract the major 7th and replace it with the major 6th.[/quote]

We are all agreed on this, at least!

[quote]I can't imagine Carol Kaye advising not to use the major third over a major chord type. It is just kindergarden theory. Not to mention all the bass lines that she claimed to have played are loaded with root, third, double chromatic to the fifth. Of course the 6th over a Dominant 7th chord is really a chord tension that is commonly reffered to as tension 13.[/quote]

I've just checked some of her teaching material. While I cannot find the explicit reference to the major 3rd, there is this:

"For Rock and some Pop styles of playing, the most commonly used contemporary bass notes you use for these different chords are...
MAJOR - Root, 5th and 6th (also: 3rd, 4th, #4th to 5th as a run, also the 9th)...
The above are basically the primary notes to use for creating patterns in all styles of music except jazz."

While she does not totally proscribe the use of the 3rd in the above statement, it would seem that she views it as only applicable in the context of a run or fill, much as you describe above. - in the accompanying examples there are indeed very few major 3rds. There are some specific examples of major 10ths, but it is my impression that she views these differently as being used as part of a more "melodic" type of statement than the major 3rd.

I'll keep on looking for the major 3rd reference in her work - I am sure it is there, another poster in this thread has also come across it independently :-)

Whatever the case, it is a rule I have found useful. I do use the major 3rds in walking lines, but in other music I found that they have a propensity to sound corny. That's just my experience, of course.

Jennifer