EBS_freak

[quote name='Happy Jack' timestamp='1492089660' post='3277861'] Hmmmmm ... you might be better off trying a length of wire with a jack plug at each end. Radical, I know, but it just might work. [/quote]

[quote name='hen barn' timestamp='1492085749' post='3277814'] I have been playing for 40 years now and the wife complaints how deaf I am! so went for ear test and now have to wear hearing aids!! So to protect them I got ACS 17 then 15 then 10 and hated it as felt like I was somewhere else. So got IEM found that really hard and couldnt talk to band members and new guitarist hated them. So I'm back looking for protectors? I have some xmas tree ones that I will try again but I might try some isolate one????? Any other suggestions? [/quote] Aw man! Why didn't you talk to me about talk back systems? My band talks to each other via mics that go to just the IEMs, not the front of house. Anyway, if you have some money to invest, you may want to look at the ACS live system and utilise just the live system, not the IEM feed bit. Its like wearing ear plugs with a volume control. May be worth giving them a shout to see if they can help you. I use my live systems in this way pretty much exclusively now - primarily when I'm depping in bands without the ability to give me an IEM feed.

I haven't tried them specifically... because I went and got one of these - [url="http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/8-x-AA-1-5V-2A-Battery-Holder-Storage-Box-WITH-COVER-AND-ON-OFF-DC-jack-UK-/222012968972?hash=item33b101100c:g:6L0AAOSwhcJWHpSk"]http://www.ebay.co.u...L0AAOSwhcJWHpSk[/url] and 8 eneloop rechargeables. A lot cheaper. Note - I did resolder the cables to change the polarity to be pedal friendly - but you could use an adapter to do the same. Last ages - it's great.

Stainless DR LoRiders. Moved from stainless DR HiBeams recently, as I prefer the higher tension in the strings. Best strings I've ever used and they last for blooming ages - which is great as I'm not particularly a fan of coated strings. Oh - and they are pretty bright without being harsh... but not so bright that you can't get rid of the brightness if required.

I've found the Kemper to be the best of both worlds. Lightweight - and captures SS, tube, hybrid, whatever beautifully. I agree with Bill - there's been a lot of claims that ss can capture the valve thing... up until recently, I thought that was the case but the likes of Fractal, Kemper and the Helix has shown that the modelling game is getting to the stage where it is indistinguishable.

Any amp with a DI into a cheap mixing desk will do you. Means you can easily mix in your computer/phone etc to play along with too. And the extra EQ is nice to have also.

You need to play one to make sure you can live with the sharper edges as compared to the more traditional J bass.

OK - just checking - you've gone through steps to eliminate the problems... plug your bass into the desk directly via a cable plug your bass into the DI and from that into the desk... all using cables plug your bass into the Wireless and from that into the desk... all using cables (apart from the wireless bit obviously) Have you tried plugging into different channels on your desk? Hi-Z vs Lo-Z etc - I see the UI has different sockets - that could influence things. Have you tried different cables? Are you using instrument cable? Are you using mic cable or balanced TRS from your Bass Fly to the mixer?

And here was me getting all excited about the return of BigBeefChief

[quote name='scoot' timestamp='1491338704' post='3272309'] Could live with that I suppose, any recommendations.... Oh hang on!! [/quote] In terms of headstock refinish, it's a case of either painting it, putting the decals on it and then clearing it to match the body - OR you could put a thing wood laminate over, decal it and finish it - the result would be it would look like it did before. The laminate can be so thin that only the most eagle of eyes would spot it. You'd have to speak to [color=#282828][font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif]Maruszcsyk to see if you could get hold of the decals... or if you could send the neck back to them to do the laminate and/or finish. If the value of the bass is important to you, [/font][/color][color=#282828][font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif]Maruszcsyk is the way to go. If it isn't, there's plenty of skilled luthiers who could do the job - and even get some repo decals if you can't get hold of the originals.[/font][/color]

My fave amp of all time

[quote name='Dad3353' timestamp='1491325815' post='3272162'] The only real downside of the Heil mics is their cost. Not a mic one would want beer spat into, dropping on the floor or doing a Daltrey swing. Best as a personal mic for a singer who wants good gear and will look after it. The PR35 recommended here, for instance, sells for £260 or so. A good investment, not to be wasted on just any ol' singer; avoid letting the evening's MC take it for calling the sweepstake winners. [/quote] Bit of an odd thing to say... You could say that just about any piece of equipment on stage... pedal boards, basses, speakers getting knocked over... having any gear on stage, if expensive is a downside? It kind of goes with the territory?

I don't suppose you like matching headstocks do you?

Shure 55SH. Ah yes. No surprises what the SH stands for. I hate those mics with a passion. Ugh. They sound rank, they feedback at every opportunity... and I know that opinion will be divided here - but they look cack too. Bloody Elvis mic. Why anybody would still want to use one of these when technology has moved on so much is anybody's guess. I don't really like the 58 either - but at least thats known to nearly every sound engineer worldwide. The Heil PR35 has a lovely rubberised feel to it. It's kinda like a mic wanting to be a sex toy - but has gone that step further than other mics out there. Out of all the mics that I've ever owned, that is the one that would be rolled out in hell hole venues. The only reason it's not the main mic, is that I've got a rack full of wireless EW500 945s that take precedence over the Heil. They sound great - but will still like to play with you on the feedback front. As Pete suggested, digital desks bring a very useful toolkit with them... if you take the time to learn them. I'd suggest doing it bit by bit... for the EQ section alone. Having a 31 band EQ - especially if it has a Real Time Analyser (so it will show you the frequencies that are feeding back) is the biggest tool in preventing feedback (obviously second after mic and monitor placement). Defo stick with it - but don't try and do it all in one outing. Get to really know the desk first... then you'll get to the point where you'll wonder how we ever did without them. (If you nail it, that is!)

I suppose the feedback destroyers really come into their own when you have a singers that like to move around a lot and randomly point their mics at speakers. Of course, for the average setup... it doesn't really help that the band are generally standing over each other either! Just out of interest, what is the singers mic? It may be the case that the feedback rejection is not great on it - so something like a Heil PR35 which has pretty incredibly feedback rejection could be the wisest choice of upgrade.

[quote name='bassjim' timestamp='1491300014' post='3271882'] Its a black art then .... Thanks for the advise here ,really appreciate it. I'm trying to stay clear of the digital mixer right now but only because in the hands of the user, in my case , its just asking for trouble. At a later date when I can organise a room for a day to experiment these pointers will definitely be handy. In the mean time I've seen a Peavey Feedback Ferret https://youtu.be/UbxQXJyNnyY which the guy implies you just "plug it in and turn it on" which is about my technical limit. Any one used one or any plus /minus points on it? [/quote] I have a afs2 - same sort of thing. I tend not to use it but it is pretty magical in those known problem venues. You do have to let the PA ring though when setting it up - which is not ideal at say, a wedding gig. It's pretty good with the live filters when you are playing. The DBX stuff is good and reportedly the feedback ferret not that great. It may help you but don't expect it to be the magic wand that you may think it is. You still have to have sensible EQs to keep the feedback under control.

[quote name='6feet7' timestamp='1491301770' post='3271897'] Depends on the venue - we don't have a desk so we either get one in or use whatever is available [/quote] Ok so it sounds like you've got a bit of an impossible entry at the moment. The first thing I would suggest to you is that you save for a digital mixer as a basis to then build upon at a later date. Something like a xr18, 1608 or m18 would be a good call.

[quote name='6feet7' timestamp='1491293881' post='3271800'] OK, I've read through the last 25 pages and loads of different names (or should I say, letters and numbers that don't make any sense unless you actually know what you are talking about - which I don't) of different systems have been mentioned. I know the gear4music system ( [url="http://www.gear4music.com/PA-DJ-and-Lighting/Wireless-In-Ear-Monitor-System-Pack-by-Gear4music-3-Receivers/164T"]http://www.gear4musi...-Receivers/164T[/url] plus 2 extra receivers ) is cheap but there are 5 of us in the band and can't afford much more. Is it adequate for most general uses ie. pubs and weddings [/quote] What desk have you got? I would wager that doing in-ears on such a tight budget is not going to result in a good experience but if you can tell us more about your current desk and setup, I may be able to help you out. I would say that with such a tight budget, a wired solution is going to yield much better results.

[quote name='bassjim' timestamp='1491230251' post='3271376'] This weekend just gone....... So for once I have a gig in my hometown and all my fam and friends came. So did a lot of curious whats he up to now. Really good turn out. Thanks to the inability of the band members who want to go IEM and IMO not really yet knowing how this stuff works properly, plus a nice high ceiling, plus a digital "its all on a tablet " desk, its a f***ing disaster. Half an hour of " one two....one two....no i still cant hear myself.....one two FEED BACK FEED BACK...one two...no that sounds terrible...ect " 9:10 pm = Ok we just have to get on with it now, gigs got to start... I take my rig anyway because it bloody well works. I have already told em thats what Im gonna do. Drummer is in no mood to use hot rods and although not exactly building a shed type, its a loud room so its....well you know. After two numbers in we had to stop the gig because the sound was just terrible. No one really knew what was going on. Its bloody awful. I went out to the car , got the usual mixer back in and we got it connected up really quickly ( good old thing with knobs and sliders you can touch ! ..) and turned the guitarists amp back on. Keys went back into his usual monitor. They bring this stuff along " as a back up till we know where we are at with the IEM set up" . Just as well. Singer however has no monitor at all because she is told every thing is gonna be ala Trump... just great. Switch on the old school mixer, take the IEMs out and instantly and I mean to the second...all sounds good again. (well a lot better than it did. High ceiling, wood floor ect ect.) Thankfully a really nice and loyal crowd soaked up a lot of bad stuff and eventually its all back to normal...ish.Couldnt hear the vocals all night because no back up monitor for that. She made a lot of mistakes due to being so isolated she wasn't aware when various things were going on. Like solos. Or Intro parts after a chorus. These are all seasoned giggers that on paper never put a foot wrong reduced to sounding like a bunch of first timers having a stab at it within a short space of time thanks to this IEM lark. They really should of known better but you know what its like...band politics...let em do it..see how it goes... I was embarrassed, pissed off and angry all at the same time. Our gitard is the main cause of the problem. Wants to use the digital desk plus IEM mainly because we always are fed up with guitar being too loud on stage. This is his solution and we have so far put up with allowing him to try it out. Not once so far has this proved to be a good idea. Everytime the IEM come out its a problem. Yes most likely the operator rather than the kit but if these guys cant make it work what hope do I have? ...... Well thats it now. New rule in my band. The digital desk is out. IEM is ok as long as you use it in addition to not instead of. Its too risky. Anyway so what I think I'm trying to say here is if you are going this route, be careful. Dont take it out in public till you have taken you and your band plus the sound system to a place where you can lock and load it at full band volume, in a band playing a gig configuration and test it out. And maybe use a sound man. Also make sure the peeps doing the PA fiddling know the difference between one room from another. IE: its not a set and forget thing. All our vocalist wanted to do was just sing and hear herself and the band. Not unreasonable so why all this grief. Ok our chap obviously doesn't know what hes doing with it but if its that complicated..... If I was biased against it before I'm even more so now. All I can say is Pre IEM = all sounds good. Post IEM = all bad. Yep so not a happy bunny this week. Maybe in the future I will get to work with a PA/tech head who really knows their stuff and can be but persuaded but right now........."dont talk to me about IEM. I'll give you IEM...ect ect" Think I'd rather wait for another ten years for a better solution to be invented than go through all that again [/quote] A bad workman blames his..... and all that C'mon Jim, sounds like you are trying to run before you can walk. The main problem I read from that is that your guitarist is trying to use a digital desk before understanding what it can do. I can imagine it now... Ooh, I've got some EQ I can draw some pretty curves... yep, I'll have some of that... my guitar generally sounds a bit muddy, so I'll pump up the treble a bit. Hmm... the vocals, always seem a bit thin... lets add some mid... I dunno... 600hz... that kinda [i]looks[/i] right... Boost, boost, boost. Ooh... compression... never had compression before... lets add a lashing of that... don't really know what it does...so I'll go with the preset... Ooh!! look at that!! FX... lets have a play there... You can get so much more gain out of digital desk I bet you are running everything so hot any natural feedback rejection is wishful thinking. Main faders go up... and you witness what happens. That's not the desk's fault. With great power, comes great power... and the necessity for restraint. The fact is, a digital gives you so much more... you only have to go into a studio and listen to a recording pre processing and post processing to see what a difference processing can make. An analogue desk however - doesn't give you more... but it goes give you a hell of a lot less to fiddle with and hence less chance of doing something woefully wrong. Like any piece of equipment... you need to know how it works before you use it - especially in a situation like yours where you can look like a right d1ck. Jim, sounds like you'd get a load of benefit of having some time with an engineer that knows what they are doing and experienced in doing some killer IEM mixes. I've posted this before (excuse any playing gaffs... this was just a bit of a jam gig at a pub...) but check out [url="http://basschat.co.uk/topic/205633-in-ear-monitors-help-needed/page__view__findpost__p__3152580"]this link[/url] and tell me you wouldn't like to hear your gig like this in your ears. Stick with it... when you nail it, you'll never want to play without IEMs again. It's just that you seem to be having a rough time with it all - perhaps a few technical rehearsals would transform your experience.

[quote name='Les' timestamp='1491229952' post='3271372'] Can't see any problems with people using processingrather than amps to get their sound in this band. Gone are the days of pandering to " I need my amp to get my sound" or "I have to play at a certain volume or I can't get my sound" Those dinosaurs are quite welcome to go and join another band, the audience don't give a sh*t as long as your instrument sounds like what it's supposed to be and they can hear the vocals enough to sing along to. Back line is only monitoring as far as I'm concerned, the PA should do the work. If I can hear you amp out front over the PA you're too loud. [/quote] If they need their amp to get their sound, well, there's no excuse now with the likes of the modelling stuff getting so good. Kemper, Fractal, Helix... well... plenty of opportunity to get your sound with that sort of gear. Re: hearing the backline over the PA - completely correct.

Maybe get a really nice monitor and preamp - then depending upon the situation you have a kick ass bass rig or a kick ass monitor...?

Been having a think about this - the only thing I can think of is that your bass signal is actually distorting at the desk (or prior to getting to the desk) or you have a problem with the driver in your sub. Alternatively Is your bass active? It could be the case that you are driving the DI to hard? Are the batteries in your bass on the way out - a lot of onboard bass preamps will go into distortion before giving up completely... What is the exact signal path between your bass and the desk?

The thing is, the concept of running bass rigs without PA support is dated - but people have got used to it and not moved on. "We've been doing it since the 60s and it's never failed us" is shortsighted thinking. There has been massive advances in music tech, so why not embrace it? Just because it's not how you do it, doesn't mean you shouldn't be open to change. Anybody who says that "it's the only way" makes me raise an eyebrow - the very same condescending response is said to me when I mention inears and for them to say "it's rubbish" - and I then find out they have been using their phone earbuds. The average set of portable PA speakers driven with a digital desk (with some now available cheaper than their analogue counterparts) is now capable of supporting a band though it - whereas historically, there was no chance. Drivers are more robust, louder and lighter - and a hell of a lot cheaper! Spend a couple of thousand on a pro monitor and you'll soon realise that your boutique bass amp is loaded with toy speakers, built to a budget to fit an ageing ideal. And if the "But they use backline at Glastonbury is brought up" - yes they do... mostly as stage decoration. The sound that you hear on stage is going to be via IEM or a nice set of wedges.

[quote name='chris_b' timestamp='1491210982' post='3271164'] I'm in several bands and do plenty of deps. The [i]only[/i] way to make this work is to bring my own sound reinforcement. I'm doing it just right thanks. [/quote] Come back to me when you've got permanent ringing in your ears and your back has given out.